Screamscape - Monorail Expansion Rumor

[Captain Neo]

The real issue for Disney would be identifying a business advantage for such a large expeniditure. The monorail currently is not a revenue source. It's hard to envision where the business case is for this, and it isn't extra room sales at the resorts given Disney's occupancy rates. Just not enough extra room night sales available to justify the cost.

I can see several advantages right off the bat:

-Improved guest satisfaction (most guests are extremely dissatisfied with the current bus system. They just don't go out of their way to file complaints about it).

-Captive audience means you can advertise to them while they are on board. In addition, the monorail provides a great tour of different resorts and locations which guests will want to get off and explore (and spend money!)

-Good Press (Disney embraces green technology, more jobs, WDW in the headlines, etc.)

-It has to save more money than all the fuel and repairs that huge fleet of buses cost in the long run

 

[c-one]

If the buses ran more frequently (e.g. less crowding, no standing necessary) and were of newer stock (no more noticeable diesel fumes!), much of the bus complaints would disappear.

I'm a monorail lover too, but I just can't see why it'd be worth the investment. Personal rapid transit, on the other hand... maybe someday. Fingers crossed.

 

[bhg469]

I agree completely. More busses would cost them a lot less and would satisfy most complaints.

 

[Cosmic Commando]

I can see several advantages right off the bat:

-Improved guest satisfaction (most guests are extremely dissatisfied with the current bus system. They just don't go out of their way to file complaints about it).

-Captive audience means you can advertise to them while they are on board. In addition, the monorail provides a great tour of different resorts and locations which guests will want to get off and explore (and spend money!)

-Good Press (Disney embraces green technology, more jobs, WDW in the headlines, etc.)

-It has to save more money than all the fuel and repairs that huge fleet of buses cost in the long run

I don't mean to cause trouble, but honestly, they probably would have done more to drive demand for the resort as a whole if they spent 1.2 billion putting in a shiny new ultra-efficient transportation system instead of NextGen.

 

[Captain Neo]

I don't mean to cause trouble, but honestly, they probably would have done more to drive demand for the resort as a whole if they spent 1.2 billion putting in a shiny new ultra-efficient transportation system instead of NextGen.

Absolutely. It is foolish to disagree. I am eagerly anticipating the nextgen rollout just to watch it become a disaster. I am very curious what the consequences for Disney will be if its mostly a flop.

 

[flynnibus]

Absolutely. It is foolish to disagree

Yet people continue to bypass the monorail everyday to get to the MK.

I think your valuation does not align with as many as you think it does

 

[Kamikaze]

-Improved guest satisfaction (most guests are extremely dissatisfied with the current bus system. They just don't go out of their way to file complaints about it).

If they don't complain, then they aren't dissatisfied to the Company. Simple as that.

-Captive audience means you can advertise to them while they are on board. In addition, the monorail provides a great tour of different resorts and locations which guests will want to get off and explore (and spend money!)

Can do the advertising on buses as well. As to the second part, loops that go more than a few resorts would be untenable.

-Good Press (Disney embraces green technology, more jobs, WDW in the headlines, etc.)

Embracing a technology they've used for what, 60 years? Wonderful. Also, after the initial construction jobs go away, it would be fewer jobs. More buses = more bus drivers.

-It has to save more money than all the fuel and repairs that huge fleet of buses cost in the long run

How long are you talking? Maybe in 100 years you might see a return on investment.

 

[nace888]

There's an easy way to solve this.

Simply ask the guests what kind of transportation they'd like to use, and where they'd want it to go!

 

[invader]

Maybe with all that advertising space they've taken advantage they can afford an expansion... :lookaroun

 

[Captain Neo]

If they don't complain, then they aren't dissatisfied to the Company. Simple as that. .

That's not true at all and if a company really believes that it's a recipe for disaster.

 

[Kamikaze]

That's not true at all and if a company really believes that it's a recipe for disaster.

Can't refute anything else I said, so you don't mention it. Good.

If people are not upset enough to complain, there is no reason to 'fix' anything. Your priorities are things that break and then things that get the most complaints. You know the saying as much as I do - 'If it ain't broke, don't fix it'.

While the current system may not be 'sexy', it certainly isn't broken.

 

[Gregoryp73]

There's an easy way to solve this.

Simply ask the guests what kind of transportation they'd like to use, and where they'd want it to go!

Disney transports 91.5 million people on all of there transit options...55 million of those are monorail riders...

I'm sure that there is a lot of nostalgia and first time riders of monorails there...but it is apparently the most used.

I really don't think there is an anti-bus conspiracy in the country...some bus systems do very well. Typically the ones that have short direct routes that don't overcrowd are the best. But when it comes down to it...taking a filled to the gills bus on a mission to move people from one park or resort to the next with zero regard to physics...is just uncomfortable and mostly just unsafe.

More busses and head-counting could help...let's face it, people are going to file on to any form of mass transit as long as they feel they can squeeze in (like elevators). So without some general limits to ridership the buses will feel uncomfortable. Do monorails get packed?? Of course they do...but they tend not to overload the trains like they would buses...there is a much smoother ride, and the limiting turns help to keep anyone from falling into anyone elses lap.

When it comes down to it, my choice to get anywhere in Disney is this...

1. Walking (which is why I like the beach club walking to epcot)
2. Monorail
3. Boat
4. Bus
5. Car

Really someone should poll the board on their transportation preferences....may be kinda neat.

 

[MichWolv]

Can't refute anything else I said, so you don't mention it. Good.

If people are not upset enough to complain, there is no reason to 'fix' anything. Your priorities are things that break and then things that get the most complaints. You know the saying as much as I do - 'If it ain't broke, don't fix it'.

While the current system may not be 'sexy', it certainly isn't broken.

I disagree. Disney aspires to much greater levels of guest satisfaction than "not upset enough to complain.". I don't have idea what satisfaction levels are, but I'm pretty sure that if the levels are best described as "just above the level that would generate large amounts of complaints", something would be done, or at least planned.

I doubt it would be monorails, given the cost.

 

[Glasgow]

I can't understand when people complain about the accountants or beancounters always determining the direction of the company. If YOUR company didn't make decisions based on the bottom line then you'd be out of work. It seems like those same people complain about the wages that get paid to CMs .. you can't have it both ways. I don't even want to start with the exec salaries - that's a WHOLE other conversation.

The point is that Disney has a somewhat unique situation where they have to factor in both cost AND desirability of a new ride system, attraction, resort, you name it ..

My money would be on some sort of hybrid bus solution or at least an advanced diesel technology. I'm guessing that the average guest would say that they'd LIKE a more comprehensive monorail (or similar) solution but not at the expense of an increase in vacation cost.

 

[Polydweller]

I wonder if all these people with so much knowledge about costs of building a monorail actually have an idea or if they are basing it on figures from forums. My opinion on it is they will get more positive reaction from a monorail than the would for a c ticket.

You can get actual costs of monorails from lightrail.org. Nothing cheap about a monorail.

 

[Polydweller]

I can see several advantages right off the bat:

-Improved guest satisfaction (most guests are extremely dissatisfied with the current bus system. They just don't go out of their way to file complaints about it).

-Captive audience means you can advertise to them while they are on board. In addition, the monorail provides a great tour of different resorts and locations which guests will want to get off and explore (and spend money!)

-Good Press (Disney embraces green technology, more jobs, WDW in the headlines, etc.)

-It has to save more money than all the fuel and repairs that huge fleet of buses cost in the long run

Nothing here is a cost justification except very long term costs but even that is problematic.

Improved guest satisfaction is only important if you are losing customer base because of the item. That's not the case here.

Captive audience. They are the same audience as on the buses. It's unlikely thus would increase spending in WDW overall since people will spend the money they put aside for their vacation somewhere. It's not like they have more disposable income because of the monorail.

Good press. Only for a short time after the initial build. No long term there.

The money savings on buses, well the important factor is payoff time, and they couldn't replace the complete bus system. They still need buses at the current monorail resorts. It's questionable how much savings there would be and thus the payoff time.

 

[EpcotFanForever]

Nothing here is a cost justification except very long term costs but even that is problematic.

We really don't know Disney's cost structure and how they fund their transportation system. In many ways our conjecture can lead to most any conclusion we choose, given the up-front assumptions.

Disney was planning a major change in the form of a new integrated transportations system before the big downturn after 9/11. Park attendance has come back substantially since that time, and once could logically expect a new transportation system upgrade.

Let's see what it turns out to be - I bet we will be surprised.

 

[disneydiva72]

Something has to change! So many long time Disney visitors, such as myself, have moved onto their own mode of tranportation ex: renting their own cars....we have been renting a car for years now, it is simpler, faster, easier and not that expensive...I have rented a van every year for 200 dollars, this year we rented a regular car for less than $200...I have grown to HATE the busses, we find them slow, annoying and overcrowded. The monorail is no better! We had to wait for 3 monorails to come to the station just to get a standing room only car. Disney needs to stop expanding that ever annoying DVC and concentrate on other things. [\end rant]

 

[Sassagoula-Rvr]

Something has to change! So many long time Disney visitors, such as myself, have moved onto their own mode of tranportation ex: renting their own cars....we have been renting a car for years now, it is simpler, faster, easier and not that expensive...I have rented a van every year for 200 dollars, this year we rented a regular car for less than $200...I have grown to HATE the busses, we find them slow, annoying and overcrowded. The monorail is no better! We had to wait for 3 monorails to come to the station just to get a standing room only car. Disney needs to stop expanding that ever annoying DVC and concentrate on other things. [\end rant]

You see one of my first trips to Disney we waited for hours getting out of park/boat/parking lot. I said after that point I will NEVER drive to the parks again (magic Kingdom at least) and I haven't. The buses are the way to go, sure there might be a wait sometimes but not usually too bad.

 

[PhilharMagician]

Disney transports 91.5 million people on all of there transit options...55 million of those are monorail riders...

Where did these numbers come from? There is absolutely no way that the monorail system transports 60% of WDW guests. 55 million people per year would be more than 150,000 people per day.