Replacement for Tomorrowland Speedway?

[Kman101]

True however....why on God's earth should I have to wait 20 or 30 minutes for certain things? FP distribution destroys rides that previously had no waits. When we go (APs) we have to pick and choose our FP and than pick the 2 or 3 to do at rope drop walk on....dude I legit won't wait past 15 minutes. Call me spoiled or impatient but if I'm not walking on it I don't want to ride it. There's so many "lower tier" attractions (D and C stuff) with absurdly long waits due to fastpass.

Fastpass was better when it was only for big attractions that need it so other attractions could hum along but when you expanded it via magic bands is when it broke the system. To be fair I know they couldn't have done advance windows this far out without expanding it (only a small fraction of guests wold ever get FP) but maybe it's not the greatest idea to have your every moment planned so far in advance in exchange for negative effects elsewhere. (Like lines at its a small world)

It looked awful seeing Spaceship Earth's outdoor queue constantly filled last week. FP is not necessary. I'm used to walking onto that. Onto Small World (which also consistently had a line).

 

[marni1971]

I agree. Unless the show building is outside the berm I don't think it would work well..

It would be. And it still wouldn't work well.

 

[Casper Gutman]

The Tron coaster would be so absurdly redundant - WDW has a Tron-style ride with TT and the Tron coaster is very close in concept to SM. The fact that it is even still being considered indicates their is something fundamentally wrong with the decision-making process.

My hope? A couple dark rides, with one being the E-Ticket Beauty and the Beast concept from TDL. That franchise is demonstrating its viability right now in a way even Disney management should recognize. And Disney's watchword right now (especially in

It would be. And it still wouldn't work well.

It seems like, if you are using both the Autopia plot and an area outside the berm, you should be able to fit in quite a bit more than a single ride. That sorta feels like the kind of area that could accommodate a sub-land - or are my estimates off?

 

[uncle jimmy]

It seems like, if you are using both the Autopia plot and an area outside the berm, you should be able to fit in quite a bit more than a single ride. That sorta feels like the kind of area that could accommodate a sub-land - or are my estimates off?

Thats what I was thinking too, would any of our insiders know if this is/was/could be a possibility?

 

[rushtest4echo]

My guesses (everything's scaled properly according to Google Maps:

Above: Would really encroach on Space Mtn, TTA and the show building would soar over the Circus area of the park.

Above: Too tall for Main Street, would work if sunk (very unlikely to happen) and would require removal of CoP.

Above: Would be a horrible aesthetic choice, visible from Monorail and blocking Space Mountains view on the lake. WOuld also encroach on TTA and Space Mountain.

Above: Show building would be ugly, but would be concealed for the most part. Train and TTA would remain unaffected (train could pass over/under the transition between the show building and all of the elevated track/walkways). The "dome" would visually intrude into the Dumbo/Goofy area but Autopia already does that. This would open up the load area for the Speedway to be changed into retail and/or a flat ride. This would open up a fair amount of "walkable space" for the park and would probably help free up that whole crowded corridor around Speedway/Tea Cups.

 

[Princess Leia]

It looked awful seeing Spaceship Earth's outdoor queue constantly filled last week. FP is not necessary. I'm used to walking onto that. Onto Small World (which also consistently had a line).

Maybe it's because the last two trips I had at Disney were in the summer and spring break, but I always remember Small World having a line?
Here's photo proof of me and my sister waiting in line for iasw (looking back on this makes me feel super old) in 2008-

I think we waited somewhere around 30 minutes for it (could have been longer, it's been awhile lol).

 

[wdwgreek]

My guesses (everything's scaled properly according to Google Maps:

Above: Would really encroach on Space Mtn, TTA and the show building would soar over the Circus area of the park.

Above: Too tall for Main Street, would work if sunk (very unlikely to happen) and would require removal of CoP.

Above: Would be a horrible aesthetic choice, visible from Monorail and blocking Space Mountains view on the lake. WOuld also encroach on TTA and Space Mountain.

Above: Show building would be ugly, but would be concealed for the most part. Train and TTA would remain unaffected (train could pass over/under the transition between the show building and all of the elevated track/walkways). The "dome" would visually intrude into the Dumbo/Goofy area but Autopia already does that. This would open up the load area for the Speedway to be changed into retail and/or a flat ride. This would open up a fair amount of "walkable space" for the park and would probably help free up that whole crowded corridor around Speedway/Tea Cups.

All of these seem like horrible options, that show building is a barn. Sightlines are really important to me, and this seems like it would be awful. Although to be fair from NFL you can see both Bay Lake and Space Mountain so Disney has seemingly stopped caring about what you can see where. SAD.

 

[RandySavage]

All of these seem like horrible options, that show building is a barn. Sightlines are really important to me, and this seems like it would be awful. Although to be fair from NFL you can see both Bay Lake and Space Mountain so Disney has seemingly stopped caring about what you can see where. SAD.

I strongly agree with you about the importance of sightlines & vistas in general and as one of couple reasons why Shanghai Tron isn't the ideal choice for this park.

I do think there is a Special Sightline Caveat: If the visual intrusion is still really cool, then it isn't such a sin. Seeing Space Mountain from Fantasyland forest or the Castle from Frontierland/Liberty Square fall into this category. Sometimes these visual juxtapositions are enhancing. Another example from Paris:

The problems arise when the visual intrusion is banal, mundane and real-world, such as an exposed show-building, backstage area or unthemed hotel.

 

[uncle jimmy]

My guesses (everything's scaled properly according to Google Maps:

Above: Show building would be ugly, but would be concealed for the most part. Train and TTA would remain unaffected (train could pass over/under the transition between the show building and all of the elevated track/walkways). The "dome" would visually intrude into the Dumbo/Goofy area but Autopia already does that. This would open up the load area for the Speedway to be changed into retail and/or a flat ride. This would open up a fair amount of "walkable space" for the park and would probably help free up that whole crowded corridor around Speedway/Tea Cups.

They could add another ride in NFL where the speedway sits between Dumbo and Teacups, with the Tron ride placed how you have it. Which the ride too, could help hide some of the building.

 

[pax_65]

Fastpass was better when it was only for big attractions that need it so other attractions could hum along but when you expanded it via magic bands is when it broke the system. To be fair I know they couldn't have done advance windows this far out without expanding it (only a small fraction of guests wold ever get FP) but maybe it's not the greatest idea to have your every moment planned so far in advance in exchange for negative effects elsewhere. (Like lines at its a small world)

I've been saying this for awhile. We can debate the whole "spontaneity vs planning ahead" thing (personally I like having the freedom to be spontaneous, creative, and impulsive - all words I associate with "fun") but there's no denying the impact FP+ has had on the standby lines. They have gotten significantly longer on all rides, including less popular attractions that used to be walk-ons.

I'm not sure I fully understand the dynamic. My thinking is that when you get your FPs in advance for the top tier attractions you also get one for the lower tier (like Small World or Teacups or whatever). Because FPs are of limited quantity you think "This has value, I have to use this" so you go back and use your FP even though the attraction was typically a walk-on you could do anytime (although not all guests realize that). So because more people are using FPs on these less popular attractions, the standby line grows.

I guess if it keeps people in the parks longer and directs them to lesser attractions (thus relieving some of the strain on popular attractions and decreasing the need for new attractions), the whole system could be called "genius".

I would use a much different term however...

 

[rushtest4echo]

All of these seem like horrible options, that show building is a barn. Sightlines are really important to me, and this seems like it would be awful. Although to be fair from NFL you can see both Bay Lake and Space Mountain so Disney has seemingly stopped caring about what you can see where. SAD.

That's been the case since Mickey's Birthday Land nearly 30 years ago. And if you have issues with bad sight lines and them not caring about lands bleeding into eachother: Walt would like to have a word with you about Adventureland, New Orleans Square, Frontierland and Bear Country.

It's a problem, but it's one that's always existed at MK and elsewhere. I hope they mitigate the sight line issues by installing Tron (if that happens) in the plot that I chose to minimize the impacts. Let's be realistic about the issue though, it's not new and it's not unique to NFL and Tomorrowland.

 

[marni1971]

My guesses (everything's scaled properly according to Google Maps:

Above: Would really encroach on Space Mtn, TTA and the show building would soar over the Circus area of the park.

Above: Too tall for Main Street, would work if sunk (very unlikely to happen) and would require removal of CoP.

Above: Would be a horrible aesthetic choice, visible from Monorail and blocking Space Mountains view on the lake. WOuld also encroach on TTA and Space Mountain.

Above: Show building would be ugly, but would be concealed for the most part. Train and TTA would remain unaffected (train could pass over/under the transition between the show building and all of the elevated track/walkways). The "dome" would visually intrude into the Dumbo/Goofy area but Autopia already does that. This would open up the load area for the Speedway to be changed into retail and/or a flat ride. This would open up a fair amount of "walkable space" for the park and would probably help free up that whole crowded corridor around Speedway/Tea Cups.

Your final image is closest

Still not saying it'll happen though.

 

[larryz]

Fastpass was better when it was only for big attractions that need it so other attractions could hum along but when you expanded it via magic bands is when it broke the system. To be fair I know they couldn't have done advance windows this far out without expanding it (only a small fraction of guests wold ever get FP) but maybe it's not the greatest idea to have your every moment planned so far in advance in exchange for negative effects elsewhere. (Like lines at its a small world)

We weren't spending enough while waiting for our FP times, and not enough people were riding the so-called C's and D's to justify keeping CMs on them, so we're being, how you say, "Pyu-nished" with "Magic Our Way" ride-rationing.

 

[Sundown]

TRON coaster would not work for Magic Kingdom. It would take away from Space Mountain and it's experience. It is the marquee attraction in Tomorrowland.

And the TRON coaster in Shanghai breaks it's theme in that it has a part that goes outside into daylight. It ruins the experience of being in a TRON world. It also makes you sun-blind. I am a big fan of TRON. I'm the type of fan that the TRON coaster should appeal to, but the way they did it in Shanghai doesn't appeal to me.

Now if the Magic Kingdom did another type of TRON ride, perhaps a a dark, flat-ride with some dips, spins, and speedy areas...that would be cool!

 

[Kman101]

Is Carousel of Progress safe if anything goes in that parking lot or general area?

 

[montyz81]

Your final image is closest

Still not saying it'll happen though.

That still seems a bit of conflict of interest. I would be willing to bet that the Tron coaster would render SM obsolete. For the first time in it's life, SM will be a walk on 90-95% of the time.

 

[Sundown]

Tomorrowland = Space. That is it's overall theme and the main thematic draw.

Space Mountain IS the epitome of that space theme. Besides, it's a visually striking, impressive massive metal mountain that is the largest item of the area. It screams out to people to come to it as the marquee of Tomorrowland.

If you put in a similar coaster ride, non-space based...you do a serious negative disservice to a ride & decades of Disney fan's idea of what Tomorrowland means to them.

 

[Bocabear]

The Tron Coaster seems hulkingly huge...that show building dwarfs even the largest show buildings in the Magic Kingdom...which would make the entire thing way too out of scale for the park. With Space Mountain right next door, I am not so sure another coaster is even a good idea... Surely there are other ride systems that could fit a smaller footprint and still be exciting. Surely there are other ideas aside from Tron for tomorrowland...
and Space Mountain is concrete, not metal...lol

 

[KrazyKat]

That still seems a bit of conflict of interest. I would be willing to bet that the Tron coaster would render SM obsolete. For the first time in it's life, SM will be a walk on 90-95% of the time.

I for one wouldn't mind the shorter wait. hehe
But if they updated SM that would probably even out the wait time between the two. IF they build it.

 

[Kadiem]

I haven't read every post in this thread, so excuse me if this has already been suggested. I see the specific need that the Speedway meets (young kids, families, others wanting 'tamer' rides). But, the amount of real estate devoted to this attraction could be used more efficiently. I've seen 'vertical' go cart tracks at places like Pigeon Forge, etc., that implement an almost 'parking garage' type approach to the track. I wonder if Disney could build some sort of dual attraction on this space? A Tron-centric attraction that utilizes a bit smaller 'electric go cart' type indoor track with cool Tron theming. And, on a second level, a more intense Tron attraction of some sort.

Just spit-ballin' here