News Remy's Ratatouille Adventure coming to Epcot

[Missing20K]

That it is. And was done in a single continuous pour. Construction pictures of that and the DCA version show the huge difference in building technique.

Are you certain? I assume foundations must have been poured separately with re-bar set ready to go vertical. Then they would have begun building form-work and tieing all the re-bar together. Then pouring, setting re-bar for the next vertical section, letting it cure, and so on.

This video appears as though they built form-work and re-bar structure, poured the concrete, let it cure, built additional vertical form-work and re-bar, poured concrete, let it cure. Rinse and repeat.

Time-lapse video of the Construction of Sleeping Beauty's Castle in Disneyland Paris

Not discounting your knowledge, just doesn't mesh with what I know about poured concrete construction. A single continuous pour of that magnitude would be concrete being poured for days and days. Wouldn't allow it adequate time to cure.

 

[marni1971]

Are you certain?.

For the Tower show building? Yes.

@Missing20K:
As an aside my local airports new 65m control tower is a concrete tower. Was a 24 hour continuous pour for 222 hours.

 

[Missing20K]

For the Tower show building? Yes.

That is something. I would love to see the construction details for how that was accomplished. Thanks as always for the info!

 

[lazyboy97o]

The beginning of this video has a time lapse of the tower construction. I’m not sure I would count that as a continuous pour since they clearly moved the form work up and did different work for the different openings.

You can see the layers and different form work clearly on this photo posted on Disney and More.
http://bp2.blogger.com/_OO7WbmARD08/R5UlgtzpnQI/AAAAAAAAE_4/IqFXLT3TN4o/s1600-h/tot+4.jpg

 

[Missing20K]

The beginning of this video has a time lapse of the tower construction. I’m not sure I would count that as a continuous pour since they clearly moved the form work up and did different work for the different openings.

You can see the layers and different form work clearly on this photo posted on Disney and More.
http://bp2.blogger.com/_OO7WbmARD08/R5UlgtzpnQI/AAAAAAAAE_4/IqFXLT3TN4o/s1600-h/tot+4.jpg

Yeah, probably semantics. I'm not sure I would call that a continuous pour, but I can understand why someone else might. They "continually" built form-work and poured concrete without "stopping." Each layer they pour has time to cure before moving the form-work up and set re-bar and pour again. It's about exactly how I expected it was done.

 

[Missing20K]

For the Tower show building? Yes.

@Missing20K:
As an aside my local airports new 65m control tower is a concrete tower. Was a 24 hour continuous pour for 222 hours.

Wow, that is nifty. In that case they most likely built the entire form and set all the re-bar before pouring. I've seen it done but it's on the more unusual side. But my estimate of "days and days" wasn't too far off.

EDIT: On second thought, they could have still built form-work and set re-bar as they went but just phased it in such a fashion as to always be pouring. 65m is too tall to build all the formwork and set re-bar first. Either way, quite a feat.

 

[marni1971]

The beginning of this video has a time lapse of the tower construction. I’m not sure I would count that as a continuous pour since they clearly moved the form work up and did different work for the different openings.

You can see the layers and different form work clearly on this photo posted on Disney and More.
http://bp2.blogger.com/_OO7WbmARD08/R5UlgtzpnQI/AAAAAAAAE_4/IqFXLT3TN4o/s1600-h/tot+4.jpg

Wow, that is nifty. In that case they most likely built the entire form and set all the re-bar before pouring. I've seen it done but it's on the more unusual side. But my estimate of "days and days" wasn't too far off.

EDIT: On second thought, they could have still built form-work and set re-bar as they went but just phased it in such a fashion as to always be pouring. 65m is too tall to build all the formwork and set re-bar first. Either way, quite a feat.

Here’s a better example

 

[Lensman]

Yeah, probably semantics. I'm not sure I would call that a continuous pour, but I can understand why someone else might. They "continually" built form-work and poured concrete without "stopping." Each layer they pour has time to cure before moving the form-work up and set re-bar and pour again. It's about exactly how I expected it was done.

Are you sure? It does look like slip forming to me. How can you tell the difference?

 

[Missing20K]

Here’s a better example

Funny I saw that same video.

Are you sure? It does look like slip forming to me. How can you tell the difference?

Well at first I thought we were talking about the DLP castle, so that video I posted looks more like a traditional pour. But, the TOT tower and the Airport Tower videos posted absolutely appear to be a slip form construction. Great eye! In either case, the "continuous" portion of the process refers more to the lack of joints. The concrete is not necessarily being "poured" constantly.

I sometimes avoid being too technical here, but I'm beginning to realize there is a nice subset of folks here who have a really good grasp of construction methods.

 

[BEARSHOUSE4]

From Bioreconstruct

View attachment 297837

To those worried about sightlines from the gondola, it looks like they will hang much lower than the roofs of those show buildings. Should be simple enough to dress up the visible part.

 

[marni1971]

Funny I saw that same video.



Well at first I thought we were talking about the DLP castle, so that video I posted looks more like a traditional pour. But, the TOT tower and the Airport Tower videos posted absolutely appear to be a slip form construction. Great eye! In either case, the "continuous" portion of the process refers more to the lack of joints. The concrete is not necessarily being "poured" constantly.

I sometimes avoid being too technical here, but I'm beginning to realize there is a nice subset of folks here who have a really good grasp of construction methods.

I watch Discovery Channel

 

[Missing20K]

I watch Discovery Channel

Why do I get the impression your knowledge somehow runs deeper?

 

[EricsBiscuit]

Why is every building concrete in France? Weather?

 

[Lensman]

Why is every building concrete in France? Weather?

I don't know the answer, but I have some speculative suspicions (like your weather speculation):
1. In California, I suspect that earthquake-related building codes make concrete slightly less economical than steel frame.
2. In Florida, I suspect that the additional weight of a concrete building makes it slightly less economical due to the additional engineering. For instance, do they have to drill pilings down to bedrock or do they just have to compress the earth more? I'm not sure.

I'd be interested to know the real answer.

 

[ToTBellHop]

Why is every building concrete in France? Weather?

No, it’s due to baguettes.

 

[rle4lunch]

I don't know the answer, but I have some speculative suspicions (like your weather speculation):
1. In California, I suspect that earthquake-related building codes make concrete slightly less economical than steel frame.
2. In Florida, I suspect that the additional weight of a concrete building makes it slightly less economical due to the additional engineering. For instance, do they have to drill pilings down to bedrock or do they just have to compress the earth more? I'm not sure.

I'd be interested to know the real answer.

i think steel probably flexes a bit better in earthquake conditions as well.

 

[FerretAfros]

I am surprised when they built this they did not use the concrete pre-formed panel system they used in France... Down here in Hurricane Land, they are using that sytem on schools and lots of other buildings to make them hurricane proof ( as much as it can be)...

Another factor to consider is the thermal massing of the structures. A lightweight steel structure is much easier to air condition in the swampy Florida climate than a heavy-duty concrete bunker. Given France's cooler climate, there's not as much worry about the structure soaking up the heat from the summer sun and retaining it for days or weeks on end.

It's the same reason why tropical architecture has historically been mostly wood, while stone structures tend to be found primarily in cooler areas. Before everything had central air conditioning, structures were designed with the local climate in mind; warming a building up wasn't difficult (build a fire) so keeping them cool was the primary concern.

For large-scale structures like this, the cost difference between steel and concrete construction is often negligible. Those types of decisions tend to come down to lifecycle costs, maintenance concerns, and local code requirements [Edit: and local availability of materials & skilled construction workers].

Why is every building concrete in France? Weather?

France has a strict fire code that governs structure types; concrete doesn't melt when exposed to extreme conditions, and the steel reinforcing has enough concrete cover that it will retain sufficient strength for life safety in the event of a fire.

Steel construction in the US requires fireproofing, which is typically done either by wrapping it sufficiently in drywall or spraying a concrete coating on it. France just cuts out the middle-man.

 

[EricsBiscuit]

Another factor to consider is the thermal massing of the structures. A lightweight steel structure is much easier to air condition in the swampy Florida climate than a heavy-duty concrete bunker. Given France's cooler climate, there's not as much worry about the structure soaking up the heat from the summer sun and retaining it for days or weeks on end.

It's the same reason why tropical architecture has historically been mostly wood, while stone structures tend to be found primarily in cooler areas. Before everything had central air conditioning, structures were designed with the local climate in mind; warming a building up wasn't difficult (build a fire) so keeping them cool was the primary concern.

For large-scale structures like this, the cost difference between steel and concrete construction is often negligible. Those types of decisions tend to come down to lifecycle costs, maintenance concerns, and local code requirements.

France has a strict fire code that governs structure types; concrete doesn't melt when exposed to extreme conditions, and the steel reinforcing has enough concrete cover that it will retain sufficient strength for life safety in the event of a fire.

Steel construction in the US requires fireproofing, which is typically done either by wrapping it sufficiently in drywall or spraying a concrete coating on it. France just cuts out the middle-man.

Thanks for the information!

 

[marni1971]

Why do I get the impression your knowledge somehow runs deeper?

Well...

 

[Missing20K]

No, it’s due to baguettes.

Baguettes and an overinflated sense of ego.

Another factor to consider is the thermal massing of the structures. A lightweight steel structure is much easier to air condition in the swampy Florida climate than a heavy-duty concrete bunker. Given France's cooler climate, there's not as much worry about the structure soaking up the heat from the summer sun and retaining it for days or weeks on end.

It's the same reason why tropical architecture has historically been mostly wood, while stone structures tend to be found primarily in cooler areas. Before everything had central air conditioning, structures were designed with the local climate in mind; warming a building up wasn't difficult (build a fire) so keeping them cool was the primary concern.

For large-scale structures like this, the cost difference between steel and concrete construction is often negligible. Those types of decisions tend to come down to lifecycle costs, maintenance concerns, and local code requirements.

France has a strict fire code that governs structure types; concrete doesn't melt when exposed to extreme conditions, and the steel reinforcing has enough concrete cover that it will retain sufficient strength for life safety in the event of a fire.

Steel construction in the US requires fireproofing, which is typically done either by wrapping it sufficiently in drywall or spraying a concrete coating on it. France just cuts out the middle-man.

Well hot darnit we are talking thermal massing and fireproofing in the MAGIC forums. I may shed a tear.

There really is a great big beautiful tomorrow.....full of Disney construction fans!!!