Link Hourglass lake and Barefoot bay, and build a canal under East Buena Vista from Barefoot Bay to a new Gateway next to the Epcot show marina. This was the genesis of the Skyliner.
But we’re wildly off topic.
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News Remy's Ratatouille Adventure coming to Epcot
- Thread starter wdwmagic
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But we’re wildly off topic.
Creathir
Well-Known Member
He’s mentioned it before. Essentially a canal on the East side of WS.
International Gateway East.
I still think they could have skipped the dogleg and gone straight into Italy with the Skyliner.
SplashJacket
Well-Known Member
All this comes back to Michael Eisner making random hotels in random spots of the property. Why carve out an insanely huge piece of land if you're going to segregate everything?
People are complaining about the Imagineers of today building random towers that pollute the delicately crafted skyline and sightlines, but the Imagineers of yesterday decided they needed a fourth park, two water parks, and several resort complexes that are completely separate as if they were social distancing.
Expensive and intrusive additions such as the Skyliner wouldn't be necessary if an elementary level of thought was put into the property decades ago.
Epic Universe will be a mile and a half closer to the other Universal parks than Magic Kingdom is to Animal Kingdom. We can sit here and endlessly discuss the flawed nature of current Imagineers, or realize they may not be as bad as we think when we take off the nostalgia glasses. They're obviously not perfect, but the atmosphere on this forum would lead you to believe that every recent project is done with the standards and scope of Dino Land U.S.A.
People are complaining about the Imagineers of today building random towers that pollute the delicately crafted skyline and sightlines, but the Imagineers of yesterday decided they needed a fourth park, two water parks, and several resort complexes that are completely separate as if they were social distancing.
Expensive and intrusive additions such as the Skyliner wouldn't be necessary if an elementary level of thought was put into the property decades ago.
Epic Universe will be a mile and a half closer to the other Universal parks than Magic Kingdom is to Animal Kingdom. We can sit here and endlessly discuss the flawed nature of current Imagineers, or realize they may not be as bad as we think when we take off the nostalgia glasses. They're obviously not perfect, but the atmosphere on this forum would lead you to believe that every recent project is done with the standards and scope of Dino Land U.S.A.
UNCgolf
Well-Known Member
Why would you want everything on top of each other? The fact that the resorts are spread out and separate from one another is part of what makes them unique; it's peaceful and quiet when you're somewhere like Port Orleans Riverside. And the Skyliner wasn't necessary; there was absolutely no need for it whatsoever. You can't blame it on any past decisions. While I couldn't care less about the water parks, building Animal Kingdom as a fourth gate was a great idea. I don't know why you'd act like that was a mistake either -- it also had to be built farther away because you can't shoot off fireworks near it.
Not everything that's been done recently is bad, and not everything done in the past was great, but the overall quality across the board at WDW was much higher 25 years ago than it is now.
Also, while it's very nice when visiting Universal that the two parks and CityWalk are all connected, and that some of the hotels are right there too, but the scale is wildly different. There's far less to do at Universal (everything is doable in two days if you don't care about the water park) and the hotels aren't really similar to Disney hotels. As one example -- I really liked the Royal Pacific; it's a nice hotel. But it's not comparable to the Polynesian in terms of overall theming, although Disney seems to be moving towards changing their hotels to be more like the Royal Pacific. Which would be a good thing if they were trying to give them that level of service and quality, but instead they appear to be copying the aesthetics and little else.
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castlecake2.0
Well-Known Member
Looking at Google earth it looks like it would be easy to do the canal, but expensive getting it across LBV drive. Is that what killed it?
Disney Analyst
Well-Known Member
I don’t know if they are suggesting on top of one another... but planning could have been better.
Better placements may have resulted in building a better and more connective Monorail system, which is never going to happen now due to distance and cost.
UNCgolf
Well-Known Member
I don't think there was any chance they were ever going to expand the monorail regardless of where hotels were placed. There are hotels that could have been connected pretty easily (relatively speaking -- adding to the monorail would never be easy) and yet as far as I know they never showed any interest in doing so.
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lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
From late 1984 to 1996, planning and development was not handled by Walt Disney Imagineering but by the Disney Development Company. Earlier in 1984 as part of the efforts to hold off Saul Steinberg, Disney acquired Arvida Corporation (a tract home developer) which increased the holdings of the Bass Brothers who would very shorterly thereafter throw their weight behind Roy Disney‘s takeover attempt. The Bass Brothers believed Walt Disney World was severely underdeveloped and Eisner gained their support by agreeing to aggressively pursue development. While Arvida would be sold off in a few years, that tract home mindset took root and the Disney Development Company, outside of their work on Celebration, did very much approach Walt Disney World like suburban sprawl. They viewed Walt Disney World like developers trying to work as cheaply as possible and just as shortsightedly, not concerned for how things would work in the future. It’s a problem Walt Disney World is stuck with but you don’t make something better by just saying “Oh well, they didn’t do a good job so I don’t have to either.”
Choosing where to put a hotel amongst tens of square miles is also a very different exercise and even job than actually laying out the specific form of that hotel and designing its specific look. It is also different from laying out a land and an attraction. You’re saying because someone else years ago did a poor job slack should be given to others doing a different job poorly. They don’t follow. The height of The Riveria and Destino Tower are problems far more so because of their poor execution than just because they are tall. They could have been tall and well designed. Context is never pristine but part of a strong design is working with the given context, even if it is less than ideal.
Gondolas are becoming a popular choice for transit projects because they are relatively cheap. The Skyliner was expensive because Disney has a serious problem controlling costs that has exploded over the past 15 years. That problem is across the board with new developments. The money was there to do a lot more not just with Ratatouille but almost every Disney project for the past 15 years.
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castlecake2.0
Well-Known Member
Cast blocked out of EPCOT starting 02/13
** edit: it’s because the calendar wasn’t updated.
** edit: it’s because the calendar wasn’t updated.
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RSoxNo1
Well-Known Member
Interesting...
Surferboy567
Well-Known Member
That seems just about the right time to soft open. No insider knowledge but it seems possible. I think Marni and others said March for opening soft openings could definitely begin mid to late February.
CastAStone
5th gate? Just build a new resort Bob.
Lol score one for Jim Hill, apparently.
CastAStone
5th gate? Just build a new resort Bob.
(I assume this will officially be a soft opening)
Movielover
Well-Known Member
What if instead of Rat it's the first time they test all the Harmonious barges at the same time in full force and they just want to limit the huge rush of people coming to experience and bask in all their glory... Ok I can't say that with a straight face, it's Rat.
mm52200
Well-Known Member
Cast are blocked out of every single park starting that day for the rest of the month because they don’t update the blockout calendar more than a few weeks out. So I don’t think this is the big find that you think it is.
castlecake2.0
Well-Known Member
Thank you, i didn’t notice that, updated my post
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LBV drive would have rised to cross the canal like the way it crosses the DHS to Swolphin canal. Cost of manning another gateway and Skyliners cheaper long term running costs killed it.
Top of my head there were monorail stations proposed for the Yacht/Beach, Swolphin/Boardwalk and CBR.
Movielover
Well-Known Member
I mean I’m not an engineer but:
In your plan you don't even need that final leg. Just have the end station there next to Boardwalk. It would give those Hotels slightly better access to it while also still being close to Epcot's entrance AND have plenty of space for the overflow line after the nighttime show ends. Would also possibly allow a Skyliner extension to other areas over the lake and beyond.