News Reflections of Earth confirmed to be replaced by Harmonious

[ToTBellHop]

Another thing I will say is that Epcot at night will not be the same. Between the torchlight illuminating the walkways, and the preshow music loop playing, it made for a quintessentially Epcot experience. I am (pleasantly?) surprised that the changeover would be overnight, although the new show debuting during Food and Wine seems a bit odd. Sure it is not pulling the numbers that it used to, but there are times when Epcot hurts far worse (cough, the Summer of Diet Epcot, cough).

On the other hand, I'm looking forward to one more summer with RoE and 25-minute Test Track waits! Summer 2019 at WDW will be quite different than Summer 2019 at Disneyland!

Here's an example of the Eisner era of Disney that I really loved. Just look at these ads and promotional videos for the 100 Years Of Magic Celebration in 2001 and 2002. They all felt charming, welcoming, and had heart.






Even the 100 Years of Magic theme tears me up.


This is the type stuff I miss from today's Disney marketing team (Especially in WDW ads). It feels soulless compared to the 1990's and early 2000's era where it felt genuine and touching. Same with today's Park Planning Videos that are inferior to the ones made in the 1990's and early 2000's.

Eh, I don't fault them on this too much. I feel nostalgic toward commercials like these, too, but they are objectively corny and feel extremely dated by modern standards. I actually still find the marketing team capable of tugging at your heart-strings in a more 2018-way. Not that every commercial is a slam-dunk.

They never all were. We also had "Nahtazu" back then...

 

[geekza]

Let's be honest, Eisner was at his best when Frank Wells was still alive.

Eisner had lots of enthusiasm and ideas. Most of his ideas were terrible. He respected Frank Wells, though, and Wells was able to get away with telling him when an idea was bad and Eisner would listen. Once Wells died, he had nobody to stand up to him. If they did, they were ushered out the door. That was when the decline started. A company like Disney needs a talented dreamer at the top with a rational businessperson at their side to balance out the equation. They no longer have that. It's all business and no imagination. Unfortunately, there are a great many people who are fine with that. Eventually, people will get tired of mediocrity and Disney will either get lucky and find another dreamer, or they'll become nothing more than an IP holding company. They're dangerously close to that right now.

 

[eliza61nyc]

ok who was Frank Wells?

 

[geekza]

ok who was Frank Wells?

Wells and Eisner were brought on at the same time. Eisner was CEO and Wells was directly below him. Eisner came from the Hollywood side and Wells more from the business side. For the first half of Eisner's tenure, they worked as a team. Sadly, Wells was killed in a helicopter crash and it left Eisner rudderless. It's pretty well accepted as the point when Eisner started losing it at Disney.

 

[rle4lunch]

I like HEA. When I see it, I enjoy it and I'm not making a mental note of all the ways it can be improved.

I like RoE. However, when I see it, I make a lengthy mental list of all the ways it could be improved:

• the pan flute rendition of Popcorn before the show is an insult to music, there are literally tens of thousands of better choices of music
• all stuff in the way of viewing, from trees to lakeside buildings (which I know a new show won't take care of)
• all the show elements at the level of the lake surface which becomes impossible to see if you have people in front of you
• the globe that is too small for the show and the attempt to show a video on only 25% of the globe (which is the percent of land mass on Earth)
• the big pause, because if you can't see the globe, then there is nothing visual happening

RoE needed *huge* upgrades or a new show, so, I'm glad there'll be a new show.

I don't mind the IP if done right, namely, nicely re-orchestrated for the show rather than audio clips of the movies, and none of that mushy old-time choir sound (looking at you American Adventure), but a more gospel-y or Broadway sound.

Thank you Mister Penguin. Your thoughts are more elegantly presented than the way I describe RoE...

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

ok who was Frank Wells?

...I don’t think we can be friends anymore...

 

[FullSailDan]

I *love* HEA (before anyone circles back to how wonderful Wishes was, I get it, it's subjective, we all like what we like, they're both excellent shows - it's actually possible to love both shows! I know!) but I don't want it duplicated on the World Showcase Lagoon. I can stomach (I know I'm in the minority here, but I'm used to that, LOL) some tasteful IP (but that remains to be seen, how they use IP in the show; I think it's possible to have a compelling show that honors Epcot yet includes IP, but we don't know the end result yet). I don't want World of Color having a baby with HEA and showing up on the WS lagoon.

And I'm also one who felt it's time for RoE to go.

I'm more mixed on this. It's easy to get worked up about IP but we have no clue what the final execution will be. I'm preparing for the worst but maybe I'll get surprised?

And I do think the reaction towards RoL didn't help matters here any in terms of IP. I can easily see them thinking the lack of IP is the problem, not the, you know, actual problems RoL has.

I agree with everything you just said. RoE has been a favorite of mine for a long time. For a long time I'd leave a shift at Y&B, pop over to see it, and then head home. It was the perfect nightcap, and the message of humanity's progress and interconnection is probably one of the simplest expressions of my worldview. However, the spectacle doesn't provide the wow factor that it did two decades ago. It's still beautiful, still inspiring, but it needed either a massive upgrade or a redo. Wishes had that same feeling, it was still a great show at the end, it's storytelling method is classic and timeless, but it was time for something new. HEA is a new direction and equally as stunning of a show, I'm always amused and find something new to see in it. Love both of them.

IP is a funny thing in EPCOT. It's always been done to some level, usually quietly for kids activities. If done tastefully and with purpose, it can still align with the values and message of the park. I think an adult aimed story about progress, cultural diversity, and co-operation, utilizing IP to tie the narrative together, could be beautiful. If HEA ends up being projected onto fountains, with some culturally appropriated music... I'd cry.

 

[geekza]

If done tastefully and with purpose, it can still align with the values and message of the park.

You mean like the Guardians coaster and Rat ride? Don't get your hopes up.

 

[JIMINYCR]

Its been written extensively that Eisner had a great respect for Wells and he more than anyone else could influence Eisners decisions. When Wells death ocurred Eisner had no one else to influence/ manage/ control the direction of his decisions and ambitions and thats when Disney fans see things starting to sour for Disney.

 

[Tony the Tigger]

Test Track and Soarin' are fine as is, but why couldn't they be "more"?

it obviously lacked vision and/or budget or proper operational overhead allowance to make it the kinda show they needed to develop.

I think one necessarily has to do with the other. Why not "fix" Soarin so the Eiffel Tower doesn't look crooked no matter where you sit? (ETA: before you roll it out!) Because it lacked vision and/or budget or proper operational overhead allowance to make it the kinda show they needed to develop.

People may want Frozen everywhere or junk food, but that's because they don't know better.

So? Plenty of "uncultured" people go to Disney World and just want to have fun, and I don't think a theme park is particularly cultured, anyway.

ok since the art of taking a sentence and the extracting it to the circumstances seems to be a lost art, isn't that still on the sat? lets break it down.

I almost said in another thread: can we just assume there is an exception to almost everything everyone posts; do we have to find and post the exception every time? Do we have to self-inoculate by acknowledging the exception (or sarcasm, hyperbole, etc.) in every post we make?

If characters and thrills are what the people want, why is Epcot so dependent on food festivals to get bodies in the park?

Because there are currently very few characters and maybe 2 thrills?

It feels like they are very reluctant to deviate from what works, and who can blame them?

It's really not an option IMO. When they bomb, they bomb big and publicly. It can affect stock prices, and that can affect everything. You have to have a whole bunch of consecutive successes to greenlight a total risk so the successes can mitigate if the risk turns out to be a dud.

Crap is crap...quality is quality. Don’t dabble in both.

Nonsense. Like what you like, have fun, and don't take anything too seriously. Not every movie has to be deep and life-changing, right? Some are just fun like a roller coaster ride.

Snobbery is self-serving and pointless.

If I only sold "quality music" in my record store, it would disappoint a lot of people and I'd save a lot on rent based on square footage. (It's also very much subjetive.) Beatles? Got it. Spice Girls? Got it. Disney picture discs? Got 'em. And you're going to be treated like whatever you are buying is "correct" and awesome, because (musical) snobbery = Massengill.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

Shocking.

The ignore feature is awesome. You'll never have to hear from me again -- yippee!

 

[geekza]

So? Plenty of "uncultured" people go to Disney World and just want to have fun, and I don't think a theme park is particularly cultured, anyway.

Better to aim high and fall short than to aim low and never achieve greatness.

 

[MickeyMinnieMom]

Just FYI, not sure if it's been mentioned yet..... I've been told the torches around WSL will be removed, drastically modified, or reduced during this change. I really hope that doesn't happen.

I'd actually miss those torches a lot more than the show. I also associate them with rD races and running around World Showcase... soooooo close to finishing...

 

[Tony the Tigger]

Better to aim high and fall short than to aim low and never achieve greatness.

That may sound good, but best to aim for the majority and stay in business/continue growing.

 

[Wendy Pleakley]

So? Plenty of "uncultured" people go to Disney World and just want to have fun, and I don't think a theme park is particularly cultured, anyway.

It's getting closer to the point of Disney providing just one kind of fun. The benefit of having four theme parks is that you can have different experiences, different kinds of fun, instead of each park just being a slight variation on the other.

It's not about eliminating the "just having fun" experience. It's about appealing to a broader audience and surprising people. Maybe the person who goes to Epcot because it has that fast car ride, goes on Spaceship Earth and realizes that a very different type of attraction can be just as entertaining in it's own way.

Disney has the ability to appeal to a broad demographic. It strikes me as good business to offer experiences that appeal to different guests.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

That may sound good, but best to aim for the majority and stay in business/continue growing.

And low hanging fruit is the way to achieve that?

 

[geekza]

That may sound good, but best to aim for the majority and stay in business/continue growing.

Because the parks didn't make money or attract visitors during the days when quality of experience was a priority. Do you really think that they would go out of business if they redirected their focus on aiming high?

 

[marni1971]

ok who was Frank Wells?

Half (or perhaps more than half) of what made Eisners first decade so great.

 

[Father Robinson]

Just FYI, not sure if it's been mentioned yet..... I've been told the torches around WSL will be removed, drastically modified, or reduced during this change. I really hope that doesn't happen.

Just out of curiosity, where did that info come from? I can't understand why they'd want to lose them other than $. They give so much to WS even during the day.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Half (or perhaps more than half) of what made Eisners first decade so great.

And top 5-6 most important figures in Disney history...

1-1a walt and Roy O
2. Roy E
3. Eisner
4/5 iger and wells

Honorable mention: Stan gold, Sid bass, card walker, don Tatum, ray Watson...even ron miller.