News Reedy Creek Improvement District and the Central Florida Tourism Oversight District

[flynnibus]

Correct me if I am wrong but was EPCOT publicly known about when Reedy Creek was put into effect? I don’t think so, though I could be wrong

Yes - the epcot film was used when courting state officials.

The rcid act took some time before it was passed - long after disney’s intention in Florida was public

 

[Smiley/OCD]

Well, given that their jobs depend upon his largesse, do you blame them?

No, of course not, they know where their bread is buttered, but I just wonder if the conversation even came up or were/are they so blinded, they didn’t know any better…

 

[harry58]

But you can also argue there maybe a reason to reassess since the whole situation is very different almost 60yrs later.

Disney playing the ‘from my cold dead hands’ position is not a good look for someone trying to push “good neighbor and we’ve worked with all interests in mind”.

There are some black marks from their past… it’s not all roses.

Welcoming a modern refresh that still meets their current objectives can strengthen their position with the public and the state in general.

I agree, but I think this needs to be adjudicated first. The state should not be able to be running like this, with punishment as a goal. After it was adjudicated, if I were Disney, I would offer to form a board to create that "modern refresh". Just not at the point of a punishment from the Gov.

 

[RamblinWreck]

But you can also argue there maybe a reason to reassess since the whole situation is very different almost 60yrs later.

Disney playing the ‘from my cold dead hands’ position is not a good look for someone trying to push “good neighbor and we’ve worked with all interests in mind”.

There are some black marks from their past… it’s not all roses.

Welcoming a modern refresh that still meets their current objectives can strengthen their position with the public and the state in general.

If that option becomes available to them at some point, they’d likely take it.

It seems apparent that they in fact tried to work with the government on this but they were not ever responded to.

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

I honestly don’t know what he’s trying to do. I think the conflict helped him some in the beginning so he keeps doubling down, but it’s hurting him now even with the base. He’s tanking in the polls now so is looking a little unhinged. I think it’s dangerous for Disney because he may blame his humiliation in this conflict for derailing his campaign and ruining his career. That may make for an uncomfortable last few years of his term.

I’m amazed the legislature is still playing along, I hate that politicians ride coattails but I can understand the logic behind it, there doesn’t seem to be any coattails left at this point though, his numbers have cratered, he’s being abandoned by mega donors… makes me wonder why the legislature is still playing along.

 

[Cliff]

Show us the actions taken

It was always just talk and complaining. Neither party had the gutts to actually take action. This one did and so did the Florida Legislators. Quite amazing that they actually had courage to go against the mouse.

Honestly, if I were a legislator, even if I thought that doing this was right...I would probably too affraid of the company & fan retrubution.

 

[mikejs78]

It was always just talk and complaining. Neither party had the gutts to actually take action. This one did and so did the Florida Legislators. Quite amazing that they actually had courage to go against the mouse.

Honestly, if I were a legislator, even if I thought that doing this was right...I would probably too affraid of the company & fan retrubution.

But it's not right. Doing something to suppress speech is never right.

 

[Lilofan]

I’m amazed the legislature is still playing along, I hate that politicians ride coattails but I can understand the logic behind it, there doesn’t seem to be any coattails left at this point though, his numbers have cratered, he’s being abandoned by mega donors… makes me wonder why the legislature is still playing along.

I'm at a loss too. Perhaps some are fearful of the vengeful happy DeSantis and doesn't want to his wrath to reign down on who speak out against him?

 

[mightynine]

It was always just talk and complaining. Neither party had the gutts to actually take action. This one did and so did the Florida Legislators. Quite amazing that they actually had courage to go against the mouse.

Yes, I too always consider steps toward the government stifling of free speech as “courage”.

 

[Cliff]

I'm at a loss too. Perhaps some are fearful of the vengeful happy DeSantis and doesn't want to his wrath to reign down on who speak out against him?

Is it possible that the majority of Legislators are not supporting this because they "pressured" into it...but because the sincerely AGREE with this district change?

We act like DeSantis forced these people to do it. I suspect this is not the case and they "wanted" to do this. Its easy to blame DeSantis as a sole "king"...but the legislators seemed to be on board with the concept.

It was easy....if a company doesnt donate to a party...you lose the "loyalty" you once paid for.

 

[Cliff]

Yes, I too always consider steps toward the government stifling of free speech as “courage”.

I 100% believe in the freedom of speech...even speech that bothers me or speech that I find horrible. Yes, I will support a persons right to offend me with that speech.

I also am 100% "against" left and right cancel culture for the words they each say. Im not affraid to be offended by words i disagree with. Its part of life.

I hope this new board will be fair with Disney in the future....I suspect they will be fair as this begins to play out in time. Yes....Disney will ALSO need to be fair with them too!

 

[lazyboy97o]

I’m amazed the legislature is still playing along, I hate that politicians ride coattails but I can understand the logic behind it, there doesn’t seem to be any coattails left at this point though, his numbers have cratered, he’s being abandoned by mega donors… makes me wonder why the legislature is still playing along.

He has other tools he has shown a willingness to lose. Line item budget vetos, firing people, etc.

 

[lazyboy97o]

It was always just talk and complaining. Neither party had the gutts to actually take action. This one did and so did the Florida Legislators. Quite amazing that they actually had courage to go against the mouse.

Honestly, if I were a legislator, even if I thought that doing this was right...I would probably too affraid of the company & fan retrubution.

Are you saying OPPAGA report is a lie? Why won’t you provide evidence? Why do you keep randomly changing your position?

 

[Lilofan]

Is it possible that the majority of Legislators are not supporting this because they "pressured" into it...but because the sincerely AGREE with this district change?

We act like DeSantis forced these people to do it. I suspect this is not the case and they "wanted" to do this. Its easy to blame DeSantis as a sole "king"...but the legislators seemed to be on board with the concept.

It was easy....if a company doesnt donate to a party...you lose the "loyalty" you once paid for.

You have good points however if the media finds out which they usually will if Mr or Ms, elected official agrees with DeSantis perhaps that's the type of coverage the official doesn't want to answer questions to in front of the camera or protesters confronting that official.

 

[flynnibus]

We act like DeSantis forced these people to do it. I suspect this is not the case and they "wanted" to do this. Its easy to blame DeSantis as a sole "king"...but the legislators seemed to be on board with the concept.

Do you have no concept of how the poltical parties operate in the legislature?

And if you truly believe this hypothesis… you should even be more worried why legislators would be so emphatically for something so new to them, without any asking any questions, when something just appears out of the blue, that they would advance it without any debate or investigation. That would mean they are even more careless with their authority

 

[mikejs78]

Is it possible that the majority of Legislators are not supporting this because they "pressured" into it...but because the sincerely AGREE with this district change?

Most of the legislators said they were doing this to punish Disney for their speech.

 

[GoofGoof]

I 100% believe in the freedom of speech...even speech that bothers me or speech that I find horrible. Yes, I will support a persons right to offend me with that speech.

I also am 100% "against" left and right cancel culture for the words they each say. Im not affraid to be offended by words i disagree with. Its part of life.

I hope this new board will be fair with Disney in the future....I suspect they will be fair as this begins to play out in time. Yes....Disney will ALSO need to be fair with them too!

1. This whole thing is 100% done to punish speech so is 100% anti-free speech. You can’t believe in free speech but then be ok with this. Not saying you are ok with it, not really sure at this point. Seems like maybe.
2. The whole idea of the Governor punishing a company for disagreeing with his politics is the epitome of cancel culture. He is using government power to try to harm Disney. Just like point 1 you can’t be against cancel culture and in favor of this.
3. I don’t think there’s any hope that this particular board will be “fair” to Disney and there’s no reason for Disney to be “fair“ back. The board was selected specifically to harm and interfere with Disney. They are all people who contributed to DeSantis and/or support his causes. I call them “friends of the program” which is a term borrowed from college sports boosters. None of these people is remotely qualified to run a special district. So far the board of a special district designed to encourage tourism and economic growth hasn’t mentioned a single thing they plan to do to encourage tourism or economic growth in the district. They have no intent of honoring their responsibilities.
4. In the future once DeSantis is long gone Disney may be able to work with the state to repair the relationship and maybe they could work with a different board once these political hacks are gone. That assumes they lose on all 4 counts in court which seems unlikely. If they win I assume Disney will continue to grow WDW and entertain guests business as usual while adding jobs and paying tax to the state and local governments.….like they have for the past 50+ years.

 

[scottieRoss]

The District does enforce regulations, the most famous being the EPCOT Building Code. It created a regulatory environment where one largely did not exist.

Building codes do serve the residents and visitors to the district. It ensures their safety. And the district created the codes before there were building codes in the state. It has always been a hallmark of the services from Reedy Creek.

 

[scottieRoss]

In O'Hare Truck Service v the City of Northlake, the Court's two most stanch conservatives (Scalia and Thomas) argued that Freedom of Speach protections are limited:

The First Amendment guarantees that you and I can say and believe whatever we like (subject to a few tradition based exceptions, such as obscenity and "fighting words") without going to jail or being fined. What it ought to guarantee beyond that is not at all the simple question the Court assumes.​

In Citizens United, the Court's four most liberal justices (Stevens, Sotomayor, Ginsburg, and Breyer) argued that Freedom of Speach protections can be based on the "speaker's identity":

“Our jurisprudence over the past 216 years has rejected an absolutist interpretation” of the First Amendment. WRTL, 551 U. S., at 482 (opinion of ROBERTS, C. J.). The First Amendment provides that “Congress shall make no law . . . abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press.” Apart perhaps from measures designed to protect the press, that text might seem to permit no distinctions of any kind. Yet in a variety of contexts, we have held that speech can be regulated differentially on account of the speaker’s identity, when identity is understood in categorical or institutional terms. The Government routinely places special restrictions on the speech rights of students, prisoners, members of the Armed Forces, foreigners, and its own employees.​

We have both liberal and conservative justices arguing that Freedom of Speach rights are not absolute, that the Constitution provides only limited protection. Note that both cases involve corporations.

Citizens United is a 5-4 decision, and most of us are old enough to remember that it was (and remains) highly controversial. The news media in particular viciously attacked the ruling.

The current Court has not shied away from overturning precedent they believe was decided wrongly. Indeed, during his confirmation process, there was much hope that Gorsuch would vote to overturn Citizens United, if given the opportunity.

As you note, a decision from the Supreme Court could "significantly change how free speech works for corporations."

It should be pointed out that these arguments were not from the opinion of the court, but rather from dissenting opinions.

 

[Cliff]

Easy way to understand me:

1,) This RCID move should have been done years ago. Long before the Parental Rights in Education Bill ever bacame a thing.

2.) MKT made a point. I do not want the RCID or ANY new district to be a puppet government for Disney or any other political force.

3.) I want Disney to he held to the exact same expectations that any other corporation in Florida...and also not be "targeted" unfairly or specifically too. Zero special "perks" that nobody else has.

If Disney wants to have a woke message? Fine, that will be up to the consumers to not buy Disney products. Its not the roll of govt. to take sides in the culture war in this way.

I'm right down the middle on this and that's something that is confusing to some people.

I dont think that Disney EVER should have been granted RCID...especially when they didnt build EPCOT like they said they would. EPCOT was the driver of the RCID idea and it was flawed from the start back in 1967.