News Reedy Creek Improvement District and the Central Florida Tourism Oversight District

Vacationeer

Vacationeer

Well-Known Member
In the Parks
No
Maybe that part of the poll was gauging impressions? Most of the US public haven’t delved into all the layers, and likely won’t unless FL vs Disney escalates. The poll shows how people reacted to that wording, for many of them opinions formed on not much more than headlines alone. It could be the current temperature. If this doesn’t simmer down and hits the courts then I expect more of the public will be motivated to understand the details.

Disney seems to be preparing for all roads. The quiet one where they just hang on until ‘this too shall pass’ while trying to limit damage from the new board until a better climate. The legal one keeping their ducks in a row. One where Disney need to shine in the court of public opinion, as seen in the recently updated disneyconnect and the reedy creek PR websites.

Not easy. Not their first rodeo either. I don’t think they prefer to educate the public, but it’s looking necessary if higher courts get involved. Winning legal battles isn’t enough without protecting positive public perception of the brand.
 
JAB

JAB

Well-Known Member
As an example:

"Are you in favor of removing the district that gives Disney special tax status?"

vs

"Are you in favor of making Orange and Osceola county taxpayers pay for Disney's municipal services instead of Disney paying for all of their own services?"

Both are asking the same question. But they would likely get very different responses because someone not familiar with the details might assume "special tax status" means "tax break" and answer "yes" to the first question, but "no" to the second.
 
lazyboy97o

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
ParentsOf4 said:
You're missing the point.

How does the average person answering the poll view this?

Can they get their own special district? Can their parents get their own special district? Can their neighbor get a special district? Does the ordinary person working a regular job have a realistic chance of creating their very own special district?

Another mega-corporation (i.e. Universal/Comcast) is just another example of a huge corporation getting special treatment.

RCID was created by Walt Disney himself buddying up with Governor Burns. How many get to shmooze with a governor? How many get to have the legislature create a law just for them?

That's the point. It typically takes means far beyond the average person to get a special district. To the average person, any corporation getting a special district is preferential treatment.
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One family has been behind a cluster of about a dozen special destructs in the middle of the state.
 
Chi84

Chi84

Premium Member
ParentsOf4 said:
Corporations generally have poor track records in how they treated people, the environment, and the country. United States history is filled with examples of corporations behaving badly. Most American students have been taught something about the history of muckraker journalism. Or they grew up watching 60 Minutes and its frequent attacks on corporations. Or they or their parents have been laid off, underpaid, mistreated, etc. by corporations they worked for. Or they have felted ripped off by corporations in some product they purchased or service they received. The point is, many have negative views of corporations before you ask a single survey question.

In Disney's case, RCID does represent preferential treatment. With the "one vote per acre" election, Disney 100% determined who was on the RCID board. Disney controlled its local government. Corporate Disney was receiving a special consideration.

Those of us who follow this closely know that this benefited Disney, the State of Florida, and its residents. We know that RCID worked, and it worked well.

However, when you ask a causal observer, they typically only know the basics. Disney is a huge, super-rich, mega billion-dollar corporation. Disney received special treatment. Disney charges a lot to vacation in Florida.

So, when you ask the masses should Disney continue to receive special treatment, it's not surprising that the majority say "no". To the casual observer, the details don't matter.
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Well I agree that if the Democrats polled didn’t know how RCID works and heard the words special tax district without independent oversight they wouldn’t support it.

Disney 100% controlled the board and ran its own government because that’s the way it was intended. (See the RCID charter and the oft-cited Florida law review article explaining it.) If this isn’t a good arrangement, what’s better? What benefit is served by giving a couple of people from Orange and Osceola counties control of the board?
 
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Zummi Gummi

Zummi Gummi

Pioneering the Universe Within!
Meanwhile, the legislative session here in Florida ends in less than two weeks, and they haven’t even started on the budget yet (which, as has been pointed out in this thread, is the one constitutional obligation the legislature has in the state).

We are almost assuredly moving to a special session, which would be of great expense to the taxpayers.
 
L

Lilofan

Well-Known Member
Zummi Gummi said:
Meanwhile, the legislative session here in Florida ends in less than two weeks, and they haven’t even started on the budget yet (which, as has been pointed out in this thread, is the one constitutional obligation the legislature has in the state).

We are almost assuredly moving to a special session, which would be of great expense to the taxpayers.
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FL is still part of the laid back more chill - South where it is not exactly Northeast- high stress , faster paced lifestyle , always in a hurry , and getting items done at a quicker pace.
 
GoofGoof

GoofGoof

Premium Member
mkt said:
Just my personal beliefs. Government needs to be controlled by the people.

Something as simple as replacing the Disney board with a 5 person elected board comprised of 3 Orange County, 1 Osceola County, and 1 Disney rep would've been good to me.
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Brian said:
A very reasonable and sensible proposition.
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I think Disney would actually have been fine with that approach. They could have still negotiated a development agreement like most of the major players have but it would have been more arms length and the board would be set to the task of overseeing the actual responsibilities of the district (roads, infrastructure and EMS) instead of boasting about building prisons, hiring endless consultants and lawyers (surely all friends of the program), enacting bogus Covid policies and looking for ways to charge Disney more in taxes.
 
Brian

Brian

Well-Known Member
Zummi Gummi said:
Meanwhile, the legislative session here in Florida ends in less than two weeks, and they haven’t even started on the budget yet (which, as has been pointed out in this thread, is the one constitutional obligation the legislature has in the state).

We are almost assuredly moving to a special session, which would be of great expense to the taxpayers.
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I'm confident the budget will be taken care of just fine. Because of Florida's fiscal responsibility, growing tax base (of which Disney is a big contributor), and prior years' surplus, it should be an easy one to draft and pass.
 
GoofGoof

GoofGoof

Premium Member
ParentsOf4 said:
In Disney's case, RCID does represent preferential treatment. With the "one vote per acre" election, Disney 100% determined who was on the RCID board. Disney controlled its local government. Corporate Disney was receiving a special consideration.

Those of us who follow this closely know that this benefited Disney, the State of Florida, and its residents. We know that RCID worked, and it worked well.
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I mostly agree with the original point of your post too, but taking this section out of context a bit to make a point and it’s not really directed at you. I agree most people are skeptical of big corporations and worry they are greedy. If someone proposed the full RCID setup today it would likely not receive positive public sentiment. But with that being said we have 50+ years of history to look at. As you said RCID worked well and benefited not just Disney but the state of FL and especially the local residents. During those 50+ years Disney didn’t wield their “quasi-government control” to turn a quick profit at the detriment of FL residents. They didn’t cut corners on building codes. They didn’t over develop and cause harm to the environment. I think even supporters of the Governor would have a hard time pointing out what harm RCID has done. So why the need to change now? I know the real answer, but just food for thought to those attempting to justify what’s happening. I could see if Disney began to abuse the relationship saying it’s time to kill the district and move on.
 
J

Joe S.

New Member
ParentsOf4 said:
You're missing the point.

How does the average person answering the poll view this?

Can they get their own special district? Can their parents get their own special district? Can their neighbor get a special district? Does the ordinary person working a regular job have a realistic chance of creating their very own special district?

Another mega-corporation (i.e. Universal/Comcast) is just another example of a huge corporation getting special treatment.

RCID was created by Walt Disney himself buddying up with Governor Burns. How many get to shmooze with a governor? How many get to have the legislature create a law just for them?

That's the point. It typically takes means far beyond the average person to get a special district. To the average person, any corporation getting a special district is preferential treatment.
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There aren't any average people that I know who own 40+ sq. miles of property over two counties, built and maintained all of their own road systems and cared for waterways, built and maintained their own water and wastewater systems, maintained fire and security service along with paying the Orange & Oseola County Sheriff's Offices a fortune to patrol that 40+ sq. miles. In a word this resulted in 50 years of 'efficiency' and has a great way contributed to 50 years of joy for a lot of people.

I was the director of a special improvement district corporation in another state. It served all of the businesses in one section of the town in which I lived. It certainly wasn't as big a RCID but the concept is the same. The benefit to the businesses in the district is getting improvements and repairs done more quickly and efficiently and they're willing to pay for that. The benefit to the government agency is that they don't have to spend resources doing those improvements and repairs within the district and they don't have to set aside part of their budget for that. It's a win-win for everybody.
 
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S

scottieRoss

Well-Known Member
UNCgolf said:
I'm pretty surprised that a reputable polling company would ask a question like that. It's terribly written and almost sounds like something from a push poll.

I have a friend who used to be involved in polling in DC (not as a pollster but in a position that used polling data) and that kind of question would generally be thrown out before the poll was even put into the field. If it made it in, the results would likely be ignored by experts unless they wanted to use them specifically for PR. As an example, although I don't remember the specifics of the issues, he told me more than once about results that looked great for them but were marked it out as worthless because of serious concerns about the reliability of the data due to the question asked.

That doesn't mean it's automatically wrong -- they could have inadvertently stumbled over accurate data even with a bad question -- just that it's hard to draw any solid conclusions from it.
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Or, and this is probably more likely, the pollsters have no clue about the issue and just used headlines and a few media stories to create the question.
 

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