News Reedy Creek Improvement District and the Central Florida Tourism Oversight District

[peter11435]

The autonomy is the issue,

be specific… what was the problem

 

[UNCgolf]

I'm pretty surprised that a reputable polling company would ask a question like that. It's terribly written and almost sounds like something from a push poll.

I have a friend who used to be involved in polling in DC (not as a pollster but in a position that used polling data) and that kind of question would generally be thrown out before the poll was even put into the field. If it made it in, the results would likely be ignored by experts unless they wanted to use them specifically for PR. As an example, although I don't remember the specifics of the issues, he told me more than once about results that looked great for them but were marked it out as worthless because of serious concerns about the reliability of the data due to the question asked.

That doesn't mean it's automatically wrong -- they could have inadvertently stumbled over accurate data even with a bad question -- just that it's hard to draw any solid conclusions from it.

 

[tissandtully]

I'm pretty surprised that a reputable polling company would ask a question like that. It's terribly written and almost sounds like something from a push poll.

I have a friend who used to be involved in polling in DC (not as a pollster but in a position that used polling data) and a question like that would generally be thrown out before the poll was even put into the field, and if it made it in, the results would likely be ignored by experts unless they wanted to use them specifically for PR. As an example, although I don't remember the specifics of the issues, he told me more than once about results that looked great for them but were marked it out as worthless because of serious concerns about the reliability of the data due to the question asked.

That doesn't mean it's automatically wrong -- they could have inadvertently stumbled over accurate data even with a bad question -- just that it's hard to draw any solid conclusions from it.

Hey but at least people on a Disney forum can use it to somehow prove their point

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Are we really going back to debating the merits of the original bill that started all of this?

We're not debating the merits. We're analyzing where public opinion is on the issue. It's one level more abstract.

Debating the merits is "I think X is better than Y."

What we're doing here is "people seem to think that X is better than Y."

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

There also are traditional Democrats who don’t think it’s good for the country for powerful for-profit corporations to have First Amendment rights on par with ordinary people.

Yes, it’s obvious that many of them don’t want anyone who disagrees with them to have first amendment rights. That’s the scary part.

 

[Chi84]

There are plenty of traditional Democrats who were uncomfortable with the RCID arrangement before recent events.

Not all traditional Democrats were (or are) comfortable with Disney’s arrangement.

There also are traditional Democrats who don’t think it’s good for the country for powerful for-profit corporations to have First Amendment rights on par with ordinary people.

These political beliefs predate recent events.

What specifically about Disney's arrangement do you think made them uncomfortable before recent events? I do agree about Citizens United.

 

[mikejs78]

I'm pretty surprised that a reputable polling company would ask a question like that. It's terribly written and almost sounds like something from a push poll.

I have a friend who used to be involved in polling in DC and a question like that would generally be thrown out before the poll was even put into the field, and if it made it in, the results would likely be ignored by experts unless they wanted to use them specifically for PR.

That doesn't mean it's automatically wrong -- they could have inadvertently stumbled over accurate data even with a bad question -- just that it's hard to draw any solid conclusions from it.

I can honestly say that if I didn't know anything about this situation, there's a chance I would have said I agree, because the statement "special taxing district" makes me think they are avoiding taxes.

 

[Chi84]

I can honestly say that if I didn't know anything about this situation, there's a chance I would have said I agree, because the statement "special taxing district" makes me think they are avoiding taxes.

Seriously. Ask the Democrats if they think Disney should be paying more in taxes and reduce the costs of public inspections.

 

[GoofGoof]

I can honestly say that if I didn't know anything about this situation, there's a chance I would have said I agree, because the statement "special taxing district" makes me think they are avoiding taxes.

Actually if you go to the exact wording they said ”threatening to remove its special tax status” which I think goes beyond just calling it a special tax district (special tax districts are known to exist, at least in FL) but may be splitting hairs a little. The point is any rational person would assume a special tax status would mean a tax break.

Florida governor Ron DeSantis has tried to limit Disney's autonomy in Florida by appointing an oversight board and threatening to remove its special tax status. DeSantis' actions are widely considered a response to Disney's opposition to the legislation that DeSantis signed in 2022 that prohibited elementary school classroom discussion of sexual orientation and gender identity. Do you support or oppose DeSantis'
actions?

The irony of this is about a year ago Reuters released a poll related to this situation and the original bill that showed 62% of Americans said “they were less likely to back a candidate who supports going after companies for their views”. When that poll was posted here a number of posters claimed Reuters was biased, the question was biased and polls are always wrong. I believe most of those posts got deleted (maybe these will too) but it shows that both sides don’t want to believe a poll that says they may be wrong

 

[GoofGoof]

Seriously. Ask the Democrats if they think Disney should be paying more in taxes and reduce the costs of public inspections.

A corporate tax rate reduction was one of the central pieces of the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act back in 2017. I don’t think any Dems voted for it in the House or Senate. It’s not controversial to say Dems are opposed to Corporate tax breaks.

 

[mkt]

Why did it need to go?

Just my personal beliefs. Government needs to be controlled by the people.

Something as simple as replacing the Disney board with a 5 person elected board comprised of 3 Orange County, 1 Osceola County, and 1 Disney rep would've been good to me.

 

[mikejs78]

Just my personal beliefs. Government needs to be controlled by the people.

Something as simple as replacing the Disney board with a 5 person elected board comprised of 3 Orange County, 1 Osceola County, and 1 Disney rep would've been good to me.

The problem I have with that is that it takes away the link of a body that can set tax policy from those being taxed. IMO Reedy Creek should exist as it is (my preference) or should be dissolved completely and just rely on the counties to provide the services.

 

[Brian]

Just my personal beliefs. Government needs to be controlled by the people.

Something as simple as replacing the Disney board with a 5 person elected board comprised of 3 Orange County, 1 Osceola County, and 1 Disney rep would've been good to me.

A very reasonable and sensible proposition.

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

The problem I have with that is that it takes away the link of a body that can set tax policy from those being taxed. IMO Reedy Creek should exist as it is (my preference) or should be dissolved completely and just rely on the counties to provide the services.

I agree, you don’t fix a potential advantage by placing them at a disadvantage, you fix it by placing them under the same rules as everyone else.

They just went from one wrong to a new wrong on the other side.

 

[Chi84]

A very reasonable and sensible proposition.

But wouldn't that leave the taxation/representation problem described above by @mikejs78. If the people don't want Disney to have special privileges, then why should Disney bear the burden of public services? I thought I saw that they pay something like 85% of the taxes (no idea of accuracy) and they occupy almost all the land- and they would have 1 rep out of 5?

 

[Fido Chuckwagon]

I came here to post this poll, but I see it has already been dismissed by most out of hand. Meanwhile internal polling Len Testa cited showing DeSantis/legislature are not polling well was not questioned. I mean zero offense to Len, and my intention is not to cast doubt on his information; just pointing out the discrepancy in the reaction to the two differing polls by most.

View attachment 711777

I trust Len Testa more than I trust Newsweek.

 

[Chi84]

I trust Len Testa more than I trust Newsweek.

Who doesn't?

 

[lazyboy97o]

The problem I have with that is that it takes away the link of a body that can set tax policy from those being taxed. IMO Reedy Creek should exist as it is (my preference) or should be dissolved completely and just rely on the counties to provide the services.

Which ignores how the counties actually operate. They’d sign land development agreements and let Disney decide a lot for themselves just like the do with Universal and SeaWorld.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Corporations generally have poor track records in how they treated people, the environment, and the country. United States history is filled with examples of corporations behaving badly. Most American students have been taught something about the history of muckraker journalism. Or they grew up watching 60 Minutes and its frequent attacks on corporations. Or they or their parents have been laid off, underpaid, mistreated, etc. by corporations they worked for. Or they have felted ripped off by corporations in some product they purchased or service they received. The point is, many have negative views of corporations before you ask a single survey question about them.

In Disney's case, RCID does represent preferential treatment. With the "one vote per acre" election, Disney 100% determined who was on the RCID board. Disney controlled its local government. Corporate Disney was receiving a special consideration.

Those of us who follow this closely know that this benefited Disney, the State of Florida, and its residents. We know that RCID worked, and it worked well.

However, when you ask a causal observer, they typically only know the basics. Disney is a huge, super-rich, mega billion-dollar corporation. Disney received special treatment. Disney charges a lot to vacation in Florida.

So, when you ask the masses should Disney continue to receive special treatment, it's not surprising that the majority say "no". To the casual observer, the details don't matter.

Special districts with land holding based voting is not, to this day, a special treatment. It is offered to others. Universal is in the process of getting just such an arrangement established. Something openly offered isn’t exactly special.

 

[LittleBuford]

I trust Len Testa more than I trust Newsweek.

The poll wasn’t run by Newsweek. This is the second time people have dismissed the information itself just because Newsweek happened to report on it. That makes no sense to me.