News Reedy Creek Improvement District and the Central Florida Tourism Oversight District

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Cliff

Well-Known Member
schuelma said:
So when someone voted for DeSantis last election..they were voting for him to ... attack the largest employer in Central Florida over a free speech issue and threaten overly burdensome state regulations?

He had a mandate for that?
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Take the nane "DeSantis" out of your sentence and replace it with "for ANY representative in ANY government branch"

If they dont do what we want, we vote them out. Yes.. once they are seated, we trust them to do the majority's bidding. The minority that didbt vote for that person?...you wait until the next election and hope your opinion is in the majority and you get the representative you want on the next cycle.
 
C

Cliff

Well-Known Member
schuelma said:
So by this logic, since Florida voted for him ... he can do whatever he wants right? Round up the Jews, violate the Constitution. I mean, it's representative democracy, so it's all good, right?
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Really?...I cant believe you said that. ANY representative politician can do whatever their office allows them too once they are elected. The courts will shoot them down if "they" determine that representative did something unconstiutional. That is the courts job. Yes there have been countless representatives in this country...that "I" did not vote for that did things that dont represent "me". But MY vote for that person was in the minority...so I suck it up and wait to vote again someday.
 
C

Cliff

Well-Known Member
schuelma said:
So when someone voted for DeSantis last election..they were voting for him to ... attack the largest employer in Central Florida over a free speech issue and threaten overly burdensome state regulations?

He had a mandate for that?
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No...its EVERY representative's job is to be faithfull to the majority of voters that placed them there. That person "hopefully" has a feel for what their supporters want and tries to represent them accurately as best they can. Thats their job and untimately "WE" judge them and vote to re-elect them or elect somebody new.
 
flynnibus

flynnibus

Premium Member
Cliff said:
Ok....America is NOT a democracy. In an "actual" Democracy, all people vote on "ALL" bills and "ALL" laws, "ALL" the time. Nobody has time to do this!! Instead, we live in a REPRESENTATIVE REPUBLIC. This the US's closest system explanation. We elect REPRESENTATIVES to do "our" VOTING....in "our" place...so we don"t have to do it ourselves. Get it? Our legislators and executive branch "represent" OUR will and our wants
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You don't need to explain to me the idea of a representative republic.... I too took high school civics. But the that idea still does not support what you said.

You were trying to claim that the actions of DeSantis and the legislators are or match "the vast majority of floridia voters".

"DeSantis is simply the RESULT of the wants and ecpectations of the voting public!"

"Agree or disagree with Florida's voters....I get that it might be hard to accept...but the votes for these people show a CLEAR thought-pattern of the majoroty of Florida voters."

The real facts
  1. Just because someone votes for someone doesn't mean they believe or support every action that person will take after they are elected
  2. A vast majority of voters don't even vote for an individual, but vote for a party's nominee. So they vote for 'their team' -- not the things that one person may represent or do
  3. The entire topic of retailation against Disney WAS NOT PART OF THE GOP PLATFORM during the last elections. So you can't say everyone who voted for the GOP were showing their wants or agreement with these actions
  4. Once elected, the individual is free to do whatever they want independent of the people that elected them... only facing the music in 2-4 years during the next election.
So you can't use the simple fact to that these people have been elected to mean their actions match "the vast majority of Florida" wants on these decisions. Electing them was not a vote of confidence on a topic THAT DIDN'T EVEN EXIST at the time.

Which is why you were challenged to support your assertion. Instead you're just pointing at they were elected... wheeeee... you gonna claim every elected official that did something self-serving or illegal was also doing the will of the people? I mean.. they were elected right??

You expect your representatives to reflect the will of their constituents, but it is not a direct, or even required thing. And these days they will represent their PARTY before their constituients.

Cliff said:
So yes...everything that is happening with our voted-in representatives and what they are doing with Disney is an extension of them doing this FOR us.
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Naive...

Cliff said:
This is how the US system works.( and other contries too) What YOU looking for is a perfect democracy and I dont know any country in the world that does that.
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No, I'm sticking to rational arguments that do not overreach what the facts actually support.
 
flynnibus

flynnibus

Premium Member
Remember folks... when DeSantis repurposed the special session to attack Disney... he was actually doing what "the vast majority of florida" wanted! None of them wanted their government to address the topic they called the session for in the first place!!

Ron used Cerebro to tap.. WE THE PEOPLE... and learned that no one actually is worried about insurance... it's Disney that everyone is worried about! WE THE PEOPLE!
 
Stripes

Stripes

Premium Member
Cliff said:
Ok....America is NOT a democracy. In an "actual" Democracy, all people vote on "ALL" bills and "ALL" laws, "ALL" the time. Nobody has time to do this!! Instead, we live in a REPRESENTATIVE REPUBLIC. This the US's closest system explanation. We elect REPRESENTATIVES to do "our" VOTING....in "our" place...so we don"t have to do it ourselves. Get it? Our legislators and executive branch "represent" OUR will and our wants

No...we dobt get to see HB9 or many other bills/laws because we dont "directly" vote on these things...our representatives ARE our voter.

So yes...everything that is happening with our voted-in representatives and what they are doing with Disney is an extension of them doing this FOR us.

This is how the US system works.( and other contries too) What YOU looking for is a perfect democracy and I dont know any country in the world that does that.

This is why voting is so important. Once you vote for a person...and they win...they become YOUR "voice" for most daily workings of bills and laws creations.

Florida voters wanted DeSantis by a strong margin and he is representing the people that voted for him. (For good or for bad)

No Kool Aid here...this is how representatives work!!
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You are correct in that we have a representative republic not a democracy.

As a republic, we have a constitution which prevents our representatives from doing whatever the heck they want even if the voters are in favor.

DeSantis keeps highlighting the fact that he won and therefore the voters approve of his actions. Even though that doesn’t logically follow, it doesn’t matter. If the voters want him to do something unconstitutional then he can’t do it.
 
Patcheslee

Patcheslee

Well-Known Member

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C

Cliff

Well-Known Member
flynnibus said:
You don't need to explain to me the idea of a representative republic.... I too took high school civics. But the that idea still does not support what you said.

You were trying to claim that the actions of DeSantis and the legislators are or match "the vast majority of floridia voters".

"DeSantis is simply the RESULT of the wants and ecpectations of the voting public!"

"Agree or disagree with Florida's voters....I get that it might be hard to accept...but the votes for these people show a CLEAR thought-pattern of the majoroty of Florida voters."

The real facts
  1. Just because someone votes for someone doesn't mean they believe or support every action that person will take after they are elected
  2. A vast majority of voters don't even vote for an individual, but vote for a party's nominee. So they vote for 'their team' -- not the things that one person may represent or do
  3. The entire topic of retailation against Disney WAS NOT PART OF THE GOP PLATFORM during the last elections. So you can't say everyone who voted for the GOP were showing their wants or agreement with these actions
  4. Once elected, the individual is free to do whatever they want independent of the people that elected them... only facing the music in 2-4 years during the next election.
So you can't use the simple fact to that these people have been elected to mean their actions match "the vast majority of Florida" wants on these decisions. Electing them was not a vote of confidence on a topic THAT DIDN'T EVEN EXIST at the time.

Which is why you were challenged to support your assertion. Instead you're just pointing at they were elected... wheeeee... you gonna claim every elected official that did something self-serving or illegal was also doing the will of the people? I mean.. they were elected right??

You expect your representatives to reflect the will of their constituents, but it is not a direct, or even required thing. And these days they will represent their PARTY before their constituients.


Naive...



No, I'm sticking to rational arguments that do not overreach what the facts actually support.
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On your "real facts":

#1 I fully agree with you.
#2 You are correct again
#3 Yes...but how can every future issue be outlined in a politician's platform in advance. Everybody we ellect...we "hope" they do exactly what we want. That's all we can do and it applies to any party and any representative.
#4 Yes, you are correct. How many times has Senator Joe Mansion gone AGAINST his party and done his own thing? It happens every day in this country.

I voted for DeSantis. I WANT him to be tough on Disney but I also want him to be equal and FAIR with them. I do NOT want to hear him doing all the "Woke" talk. That "Woke" issue is a different discussion completely and does NOT belong here.

So there you go. I support "part" of what DeSantis is doing and I'm also ANGRY at the other half of what he is doing. He is representing only HALF of my position and he screwing up the other half.
 
C

Cliff

Well-Known Member
flynnibus said:
So you acknowledge you didn't vote for these actions - so we can drop the their elected position means their choice reflect everyone who voted for them nonsense.
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Have you ever in your life met an elected politician that matched your "exact" political views? I suspect not! No representative is supposed to do everything you and I want!

The idea goes....in a group of 10 people, identify and support the person that "best" matches you. If you can find somebody that matches you 75%...that would be a a huge success if they can make it into office. Then?...you just try to learn to accept the 25% that you disagree with.

Nobody ever gets everything they want and that is not even the goal. The goal is to give the majority of voters the majority of issues they want.

I like like DeSantis sometimes and also dont like him too at other times.
 
C

Chip Chipperson

Well-Known Member
Cliff said:
Have you ever in your life met an elected politician that matched your "exact" political views? I suspect not! No representative is supposed to do everything you and I want!

The idea goes....in a group of 10 people, identify and support the person that "best" matches you. If you can find somebody that matches you 75%...that would be a a huge success if they can make it into office. Then?...you just try to learn to accept the 25% that you disagree with.

Nobody ever gets everything they want and that is not even the goal. The goal is to give the majority of voters the majority of issues they want.

I like like DeSantis sometimes and also dont like him too at other times.
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Then why did you try to use the "he was elected, therefore this is what the people want" argument to justify his actions?
 
JoeCamel

JoeCamel

Well-Known Member
Elijah Abrams said:
I’m worried the legislators will kill the Disney/Reedy Creek agreement and ruin Walt Disney World.
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Ok to be worried but it probably is right there with winning the lotto that Disney does not come out on top.
They make a bunch of enemies along the way but they will not let the temporary occupiers of the seats in Tallahassee damage their business or brand. It has long been said you just don't **** with the mouse.... and for good reason, mick can be pugnacious
 

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