News Reedy Creek Improvement District and the Central Florida Tourism Oversight District

[lazyboy97o]

And Disney didn't threaten to build a nuclear plant.

And they still can! The District cannot but private electric companies like Reedy Creek Energy Services still can.

 

[LAKid53]

You already know....

They haven't paid any taxes ever. They are the only special district in the entire universe. They have never inspected anything ever. They get to write all of their own laws. They can do anything they want whenever they want and its JUsT NOt FaIR

That is patently incorrect. TWDC pays property taxes to the 2 counties the property it owns resides in, an assessment to RCID and corporate income tax to the State of Florida.

 

[GoofGoof]

That's not true. Several times when staying of site it was easier to use RCID roads to get elsewhere in the area to avoid traffic. The roads are open to the public not just those visiting Disney

Just like the street I live on. It was obviously constructed to benefit the developer who built the houses and continues to benefit the home owners in the neighborhood but ultimately is a public road open to anyone and maintained using municipal funds that come from tax dollars.

 

[LAKid53]

For a corporation time is very valuable. Having worked in a corporation that had to deal with multiple government entities for permits on pipelines we built, I can assure you that having a special entity that fast tracks every permit you need is very valuable. I've watch large construction teams sit around for weeks at a time simply because an inspector didn't show up to sign on what had been done.

And if you don't think time is money you don't understand how corporation determine the return on their investments. Disney has gained millions by having expedited services. If Disney didn't put a significant value on the way things were they wouldn't have put up such a fight to stop the state from taking it over.

I said, "other than expedited permitting"... I fully recognize that for a corporation, time is money.

 

[Vacationeer]

A simple google search shows you are wrong.

Who is the largest taxpayer in Florida?

Disney is the largest taxpayer in central Florida, paying $280 million in taxes from 2015 to 2020.

Actually…

ECONOMIC IMPACT
Walt Disney World Resort is a significant contributor to the economic well-being and vitality of Central Florida. Walt Disney World Resort has contributed $780.3 million in total state and local taxes paid and collected for FY2021.

$780 million in 2021 alone.

 

[thomas998]

You’ve just used another bad example. There is no special pass on normal permits, whatever those are. It’s the same type of process and is often considered the most onerous of the local area.

And again, the district was enforcing a building code before local governments were required to do so.

You are clueless. How many corporations and individual have to get a permit in any of the neighboring areas? thousands. Now compare that to the number in Reedy Creek, it is a drop in the bucket. So if you don't think being able to bypass the normal line that makes the DMV look fast, and instead just having your own private permitting group doesn't save time you are clueless. The special pass isn't not getting a permit it is getting one from a agency that exist for your own use only. Universal doesn't have its own permitting agency at their beck and call, only Disney has had that advantage.

 

[LAKid53]

Because the infrastructure that's being developed is for the operation of their business, it's not for public use. World Drive isn't fundamentally any different than the walking paths in Adventureland.

Incorrect. World Drive street signs are GREEN. In Florida that means they are PUBLIC, not private, roads. Private road street signs are blue.

 

[lazyboy97o]

But they’re different types of documents, each requiring different mechanisms for public hearings and required notices.

Are you suggesting the January/Feb ‘23 development agreement wasn’t required to comply with public notice requirements (newspaper notices, mailings to land owners) because it “locks in” an earlier plan?

Who said any of that? The original tweet was about the development agreement being based on something DeSantis’ government decided complied with state law. In order to void the agreement they need some compelling reason regarding public welfare that has suddenly come up in the past year.

 

[peter11435]

Yet again, I never said Disney paid less in taxes they simply get special red carpet treatment from their own corporate run government oversight board. I used taxes as an example that the poster might understand as most people are familiar with paying taxes but few have to ever deal with a local government when seeking permits and such.

Reread your original post I commented on and then say this again with a straight face.

 

[CentralFLlife]

For a corporation time is very valuable. Having worked in a corporation that had to deal with multiple government entities for permits on pipelines we built, I can assure you that having a special entity that fast tracks every permit you need is very valuable. I've watch large construction teams sit around for weeks at a time simply because an inspector didn't show up to sign on what had been done.

I've also experienced this... with RCID inspectors.

RCID did not fast track & rubber stamp building permits/inspetions. That couldn't be farther from the truth. I don't know how many times that needs to be said.

 

[lazyboy97o]

You are clueless. How many corporations and individual have to get a permit in any of the neighboring areas? thousands. Now compare that to the number in Reedy Creek, it is a drop in the bucket. So if you don't think being able to bypass the normal line that makes the DMV look fast, and instead just having your own private permitting group doesn't save time you are clueless. The special pass isn't not getting a permit it is getting one from an agency that exist for your own use only. Universal doesn't have its own permitting agency at their beck and call, only Disney has had that advantage.

The City of Orlando works very closely with Universal and now Orange County is doing the same. If you’re willing to pay your design staff for it, they too are allowed to schedule pre-application meetings to review designs and help ensure approval. You can also pay extra for priority review and off-hour inspections.

 

[GoofGoof]

I didn't say Disney paid any more or less in taxes, the analogy was asking if you would like it if your neighbor got a special break on taxes for life... in this instance what Disney got may not have amount to anything in lower taxes but it did provide them at the very least with a special pass on normal permits and other things that would take any other competitor much longer because they weren't going to be dealing with a oversight board that was really run by themselves.

But other corporations aren’t paying almost 100% through taxes for what the local tax authority is doing. So Universal may have to wait for Orange County or Orlando to approve stuff, but the county is also paying for half of their new road to Epic Universe. Hundreds of millions saved not having a RCID of their own.

I asked this question a number of times and nobody seems to have an answer. If RCID is a bad design because of the risk of Disney acting without oversight then surely there must be numerous examples of issues as a result over the last 50+ years. So what has Disney done to abuse their power and harm the citizens of FL? If this is the true reason to take away control there must be some support right?

 

[GoofGoof]

I've also experienced this... with RCID inspectors.

RCID did not fast track & rubber stamp building permits/inspetions. That couldn't be farther from the truth. I don't know how many times that needs to be said.

At least one more I guess

 

[peter11435]

You are clueless. How many corporations and individual have to get a permit in any of the neighboring areas? thousands. Now compare that to the number in Reedy Creek, it is a drop in the bucket. So if you don't think being able to bypass the normal line that makes the DMV look fast, and instead just having your own private permitting group doesn't save time you are clueless. The special pass isn't not getting a permit it is getting one from an agency that exist for your own use only. Universal doesn't have its own permitting agency at their beck and call, only Disney has had that advantage.

You’ve clearly never had to get a permit from Reedy Creek…

 

[MrPromey]

Except many of those roads are public, not private. So, as a taxpayer in Orange County, I appreciate TWDC paying an assessment to RCID to maintain roads my taxes would normally pay for.

Except if not for RCID, most of those roads would likely have never been public roads. Disney would likely have continued to own the property which means Disney would have been paying property tax on the land those roads sit on as well as paying directly to maintain those roads, right along with the parking garages and they would not have been able to issue government bonds to help cover the construction costs, of any of that.

I think that is what captain is talking about.

Personally, I have no issue with it, moral or otherwise but that's my personal take and I could explain why I'm okay with it but nobody cares, right?

Obviously, he and I have different personal takes on it but I can understand why someone would feel differently about this than I do.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Except it absolutely is for public use. Disney is not the only entity that benefits from that infrastructure.

Then Disney shouldn't have full control over it. I just think you have to pick one.

If it's for the business, then Disney can keep full control and fund maintenance out of their corporate opex and investments out of their corporate capex.

If it's public infrastructure, then a government entity (that isn't fully controlled by Disney) gets control and it can be funded with municipal bonds and tax revenue.

PUBLIC infrastructure wholly controlled by a PRIVATE company doesn't sit well with me.

 

[jimbojones]

That’s not answering the question. You have repeatedly claimed there is some land being held by the District that others cannot use. What is this land? Tell us. Show us on a map.

I am very curious to see a map of what is owned in whole by WDW and what is RCID, does such a map exist online? I want to know where this new non-disney theme park or prison could be built.....

 

[CaptainAmerica]

I've also experienced this... with RCID inspectors.

RCID did not fast track & rubber stamp building permits/inspetions. That couldn't be farther from the truth. I don't know how many times that needs to be said.

In your words, what did RCID do that Disney likes and is fighting to keep?

People keep saying "RCID didn't do anything special for Disney," yet Disney is awfully upset that they lost it.

 

[LAKid53]

At least one more I guess

Having worked in a state regulatory agency that issues permits...

Expedited does not mean things were rubber stamped or corners cut. It means the permit becomes top priority for review. Public meetings are scheduled sooner rather than later. TAC meetings between the permitors (us), the permitees and professionals (including lawyers) are set up ASAP.

And trust me, there are groups (make that lawyers) who will pick apart every permit decision made.

 

[LAKid53]

Except if not for RCID, most of those roads would likely have never been public roads. Disney would likely have continued to own the property which means Disney would have been paying property tax on the land they drive across as well as paying directly to maintain those roads, right along with the parking garages and they would not have been able to issue government bonds to help cover the construction costs, of any of that.

I think that is what captain is talking about.

Personally, I have no issue with it, moral or otherwise but that's my personal take and I could explain why I'm okay with it but nobody cares, right?

Obviously, he and I have different personal takes on it but I can understand why someone would feel differently about this than I do.

The Walt Disney Corporation did not issues the bonds. They were issued by and on behalf of RCID Board of Supervisors Please Google the Agreements.