News Reedy Creek Improvement District and the Central Florida Tourism Oversight District

[lentesta]

Maybe @lentesta could weigh in on this?

The recent agreement prohibits all kinds of housing construction:

 

[Lilofan]

I've heard that Desantis is pretty upset and wants to enact toll roads all through Disney.

Besides retaliation toll roads also taxing Disney hotels, looking like my future vacations are going to get more expensive.

 

[LAKid53]

If anyone has better insight: HB9B that created the CFTOD stripped it of the right to collect tolls. Can that be amended to allow tolls to be collected, if so did the Development Agreement cover that possibility?

I'm sure the legislation can be amended.

 

[lazyboy97o]

On the topic of tolls, since the parking garages at Disney Springs were built by RCID can they add a parking fee there too? Would go back to the district and ultimately be a tax break for Disney but could be viewed as a way to punish Disney customers.

It again comes down to a willingness to simply ignore the agreements. The garages were not designed for you it, but you could send a team of people out with mobile card readers like a Chick-Fil-A drive thru. It’d probably cause chaos, chaos people would blame on Disney. It’d also require Disney to go to court to get stopped. Is a small parking fee an imminent, irreparable harm that would justify an injunction?

 

[LAKid53]

Yeah. Disney would lose control of road maintenance for the roads turned over, but they would also lose the requirement to pay for the road maintenance. Take that Mouse….we are going to punish you by taking over paying for maintenance on the roads your business uses

Except FDOT isn't the best at maintaining roads....

 

[LAKid53]

Not sure about the development agreement, but someone posted earlier that the bill that created the new board allows the district to transfer ownership of roads to FDOT and then FDOT could add the toll so collected by the state not the district. That would avoid the district collecting a toll which would ultimately just reduces Disney’s tax bill. I believe it was also posted that the state must use the toll money to repair and maintain the roads first and anything left would go to the county where the road is.

That's what the statute says. However, as witnessed by the upgrading to the toll plaza on the Turnpike near Clermont, that's going to be a long and messy project. Not what you want at the most visited place on the planet.

 

[Tha Realest]

A developer agreement that explicitly prohibits any housing development seems oppositional to one of the most pressing issues of our time: affordable housing. The CFTOD should look to see if it’s ability to remake the agreement is advisable given federal initiatives and incentives to bring more equitable and affordable housing; after all, Orlando is an increasingly expensive place to live, likely outpacing the national average.

Biden Nudges Cities to Rezone and Embrace Housing Growth - The Urbanist

# But is the president dangling enough federal grants to convince them? On Monday, President Joe Biden unveiled a new housing initiative aiming to "help close America’s housing supply shortfall in five years." Toward that end, Biden has requested $10 billion in competitive housing grants to...

www.theurbanist.org

 

[lentesta]

It wouldn’t really reduce the tax burden. The District could still collect those taxes.

No matter who collects the toll, Florida Statute 338.165 says the toll revenue goes to pay for these things, in this order:

• Bonds issued to pay for the roads. Disney pays those bonds now. I think thru FY2030 it's hundreds of millions of dollars.
• If anything is left over, the excess pays for ongoing operation and maintenance of those roads. Disney pays for that now.
• If anything is left over, the excess goes to operate and maintain the county's roads.
• If anything is left over, the excess goes to operate the state's roads.

Also, I'm pretty sure the new CFTOD includes the powers of "road and bridge" districts in the state, which means it gets to levy the tolls?

ETA: Oh yeah. Page 108 of the CFTOD legislation also gives the district the powers of a "special road district" and a "special road and bridge district":

This seems to complicate the whole "we're going to add tolls" thing.

 

[lazyboy97o]

No matter who collects the toll, Florida Statute 338.165 says the toll revenue goes to pay for these things, in this order:

• Bonds issued to pay for the roads. Disney pays those bonds now. I think thru FY2030 it's hundreds of millions of dollars.
• If anything is left over, the excess pays for ongoing operation and maintenance of those roads. Disney pays for that now.
• If anything is left over, the excess goes to operate and maintain the county's roads.
• If anything is left over, the excess goes to operate the state's roads.

Also, I'm pretty sure the new CFTOD includes the powers of "road and bridge" districts in the state, which means it gets to levy the tolls?

That whole section would require a few amendments to allow tolls at Walt Disney World. Since laws need to be changed regardless it really leaves the possibilities rather wide open.

 

[Stripes]

A developer agreement that explicitly prohibits any housing development seems oppositional to one of the most pressing issues of our time: affordable housing. The CFTOD should look to see if it’s ability to remake the agreement is advisable given federal initiatives and incentives to bring more equitable and affordable housing; after all, Orlando is an increasingly expensive place to live, likely outpacing the national average.

Biden Nudges Cities to Rezone and Embrace Housing Growth - The Urbanist

# But is the president dangling enough federal grants to convince them? On Monday, President Joe Biden unveiled a new housing initiative aiming to "help close America’s housing supply shortfall in five years." Toward that end, Biden has requested $10 billion in competitive housing grants to...

www.theurbanist.org

Was not in the development agreement. It’s in the restrictive covenants.

 

[lazyboy97o]

A developer agreement that explicitly prohibits any housing development seems oppositional to one of the most pressing issues of our time: affordable housing. The CFTOD should look to see if it’s ability to remake the agreement is advisable given federal initiatives and incentives to bring more equitable and affordable housing; after all, Orlando is an increasingly expensive place to live, likely outpacing the national average.

Biden Nudges Cities to Rezone and Embrace Housing Growth - The Urbanist

# But is the president dangling enough federal grants to convince them? On Monday, President Joe Biden unveiled a new housing initiative aiming to "help close America’s housing supply shortfall in five years." Toward that end, Biden has requested $10 billion in competitive housing grants to...

www.theurbanist.org

That need doesn’t undo the basic idea of zoning.

 

[lentesta]

That whole section would require a few amendments to allow tolls at Walt Disney World. Since laws need to be changed regardless it really leaves the possibilities rather wide open.

I wonder if the bonds mention tolls.

 

[Tha Realest]

That need doesn’t undo the basic idea of zoning.

Some believe it does, that certain zoning laws and various restrictive covenants contribute to housing unaffordability and inequity in various communities.

 

[GoofGoof]

It wouldn’t really reduce the tax burden. The District could still collect those taxes.

They can collect the taxes but that money can only be used for District purposes not passed up to the state so eventually if a toll reduces the bond payments or reduces the road maintenance cost the expense side for the district goes down while revenue (from Disney taxes) stays the same. Eventually if the district continues to operate at a large surplus Disney can argue that the tax assessment should be reduced to reflect actual spending in the district. Now could they cook up ways to spend the money? Probably so, but that’s a lot of work to force Disney to “break even”. Not much of a punishment.

 

[GoofGoof]

A developer agreement that explicitly prohibits any housing development seems oppositional to one of the most pressing issues of our time: affordable housing. The CFTOD should look to see if it’s ability to remake the agreement is advisable given federal initiatives and incentives to bring more equitable and affordable housing; after all, Orlando is an increasingly expensive place to live, likely outpacing the national average.

Biden Nudges Cities to Rezone and Embrace Housing Growth - The Urbanist

# But is the president dangling enough federal grants to convince them? On Monday, President Joe Biden unveiled a new housing initiative aiming to "help close America’s housing supply shortfall in five years." Toward that end, Biden has requested $10 billion in competitive housing grants to...

www.theurbanist.org

It’s for a commercial property not a residential one. I am sure there are many examples of corporations with development agreements that exclude residential housing. If Boeing buys a large piece of commercial land with the intent to build a facility and bring in jobs to the county the local county may offer to sign a development agreement to facilitate that but they would want to ensure Boeing will actually follow through and not turn around and flip the property for a profit.

Initiatives to add more affordable housing are focused on housing developers not commercial properties. Nobody is telling Musk he shouldn’t build the gigafactory because we need more cheap housing.

 

[JohnD]

Of course they didn’t. They did it because Disney promised to use its resources to oppose a law they disagreed with.

Bingo! You hit the nail on the head.

 

[JohnD]

So you are trying to point out Disney acted with purpose... and not just randomly?

Compelling stuff...

And neither did the Governor or Legislature. Imagine that.

 

[LittleBuford]

Bingo! You hit the nail on the head.

No-one is denying the chain of events. We're simply pointing out that governments aren't supposed to punish companies for disagreeing with their policies.

 

[JohnD]

Yeah. Disney would lose control of road maintenance for the roads turned over, but they would also lose the requirement to pay for the road maintenance. Take that Mouse….we are going to punish you by taking over paying for maintenance on the roads your business uses

Considering my recent posts, you'll be surprised when I say this but why propose tolling roads at all? That only passes the costs on to Disney guests. Disney will just "shrug its shoulders". It doesn't punish them at all other than maybe generate fewer guests which isn't good for Disney or the State. Any revenue generated from tolls will probably be more than offset by the fewer guests who arrive.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Some believe it does, that certain zoning laws and various restrictive covenants contribute to housing unaffordability and inequity in various communities.

Certain. Context matters. Just like last time you bro it up, you’re reaching.