Possible Changes coming to the Guest Assistance Cards (GAC)

[alissafalco]

But in that case they should have two separate GAC's, thereby increasing the number of people allowed...they could bring their whole neighborhood!

Yes, you're right they could get a gac for each son. I wouldn't care if they brought 10 people on with them either.

 

[Lucky]

Give Kids the World children get to enjoy all sorts of privileges normal WDW park guests cannot. They pay nothing to get into the park. Does this upset you?

And what about celebrities? They get far better treatment than other guests, including the disabled.

 

[englanddg]

And what about celebrities? They get far better treatment than other guests, including the disabled.

Well, from what I've observed, it seems many celebrities are disabled too.

/me runs away quickly

 

[Lokheed]

A few general follow-up thoughts:

First, I have to make it absolutely clear that I do not feel that Disney, or anyone else, *owes* my son or my family anything. We are perpetually grateful for every kindness that Disney and the WDW Cast Members have extended us over the years, and we thank them at every opportunity. If Disney were to decide tomorrow that the GAC program causes more operational problems than it is worth, I would certainly be disappointed but I would not be angry.

Next, for context, those 3,500 rides happened over the course of a decade. Given how close we live to the park, how often we go, and the fact that the ride was only three minutes long, on a day to day basis it just wasn't a number that was likely to impact other park guests adversely. For a great many of those rides it was just Ben plus one parent, occupying a single row, and we would be placed in the back row of of a cart where the next party in the regular line was larger than a single row. In other words, if we hadn't filled that particular row then the mine cart would have been sent with an empty row - in those cases we impacted absolutely no-one by occupying that row. (If you are not intimately familiar with the load/unload process for SWSA, it was more optimal to send a partially empty cart then to have a CM look for parties of 2 in the regular line. It was not unusual at all to see half empty carts get sent, because it was more important to keep the flow of carts moving in order to prevent cascading backups at the end of the ride.)

I know that a lot of the debate here has to do with other disabilities, and I can't speak to them. I can only speak to how the program has affected my family. I am disturbed, however, by the "that's not fair" crowd who insist that disabled guests should not be able to get on a ride even one moment sooner than other non-disabled guests. It strikes me as no different than a child's obsession with fairness, whining how it's not fair that someone else is getting something they are not, a simplistic world view that does not take into account any larger set of facts or concepts than the immediate moment. That's understandable from a child, it's not quite as understandable coming from an adult. It's not that disabled guests *deserve* to get on rides faster than anyone else - they don't. It's that without those accommodations, or by enforcing that notion of "fairness" that says all guests have to wait exactly the same amount of time, a great number of disabled guests would not be able to get on rides *at* *all*. Does that seem any more "fair"?

Another thought: Frequently for our family, not so much now but definitely when Ben was younger, the faster alternative access was less about getting Ben on a ride faster and more about protecting other park guests from Ben's meltdowns. He went through a long period where if he got upset or frustrated he would lash out physically at the people around him, often times with little or no warning. He would just haul off and kick some random passing person, or someone in line nearby. There were many times where I physically had to contain him, or even bodily carry him from the park in order to keep him from ruining other park guest's day. Taking the alternate entrance not only minimized the time that Ben was in close quarters with other park guests, but usually also gave us more space to keep him more effectively contained.

 

[Lokheed]

Oh, and here's a random true story:

I once "abused" our GAC on the Pirates ride. My son had some behavioral issues that adversely effected another family who had stood in line for more than an hour, and their enjoyment of the ride was spoiled. So I took advantage of the GAC to walk that family back onto the ride through the side entrance (at which point Ben and I bowed out and left them in peace), so that they could get back on the ride quickly and enjoy it properly.

How unfair! They got to ride it twice in an hour while the posted standby time was 70 minutes!

 

[Spikerdink]

One of my best friends has an autistic son. For most of the past 6 years, we took his son to WDW as a father-son bonding moment and also my friend could see how Jack has progressed (if at all) year to year.

The first year, we could not see any fireworks as the noise set him off into a fear induced hysteria that could involve him running away. (Can you imagine trying to find a small boy darting in and out of the masses there to see Wishes?) There were times when we could not get Jack out of the park quick enough and his meltdown started. One woman yelled at my friend to 'control your son!' - Well, being from NY you can imagine my friend's response to her.... Rides are iffy - forget any dark rides. We tried Pirates once and Jack nearly climbed out of the boat to get away.

Anyway, many times over the past nine years my friend has said to me that it crushes him to know he will never have a real conversation with his son, will never be able to share the joys of his son attaining milestones that other children will and that he would trade anything, ANYTHING to have a 'normal' relationship with his son.

We get the GAC card so that if by chance we can get Jack on a ride, we can minimize any issues not only for Jack, but for others around him if problems arise. (Admit it, you see a child in meltdown and you react negatively....)

I have zero problem with my friend using the GAC card, nor do I have a problem with anyone with a handicapped child using a GAC card to move ahead. Experiencing WDW with an able bodied child or adult is incredibly tiring - imagine your tired at the end of the day but adding onto it having to push a wheelchair, carry a child onto/off of rides, deal with emotional/physical issues above and beyond what the 'average' person has to. If this means they can wait a shorter time and experience more magic, god bless them and may the happy times they have sustain them for months, if not years.

But people who use the GAC card as thier own personal fastpass/get out of line free card are another story (and they know who they are)for them I have nothing but disdain. The argument that Disney created this loophole and they are going to use it doesn't fly. It's called morals, it's called integrity, it's called empathy. This is where the changes need to be implemented.

 

[Goofnut1980]

Indeed, its a tricky situation, but whats wrong with the procedure that other parks have? If one "can't wait in long lines", they obtain a pass that is based on the wait time of the attraction. If the wait time is currently 45 minutes, they "schedule" to come 45 minutes later. That way, they're not waiting in a long line, but they're also not given the ability to use the Fastpass line unlimited.

I couldn't agree more. Isn't that why fast pass was invented? So one does not have to stand in line and wait? Also, isn't it that the current "laws" if you will, only state that a public place have to only be handicap accessible? Not that they have to give a special card to bypass waiting in lines?

We take my step dad, who is a US Veteran, down to the world every few years. Being in the military and where he was stationed back in the 60s has caused him to develop COPD, and is documented thru the military doctors as far back as the early 80s. He has 20% lung function and has to use a wheelchair/scooter at the world. He refuses to get a GAC, and as long as the entrances doesn't involve stairs, he waits in line with everyone else. If there are stairs, we get a FP and return in our window. Even tho he is allowed to take someone (3, I think) into the handicap entrance, he does not allow us to 'skip' the line. We wait our turn. Mon and myself will go thru the FP line, while he enters thru the ramp access and waits for us to make it to the front of the line. I feel that is totally fair.

One comment in addition to an early post. Why is someone with back conditions getting a GAC to skip lines and ride an attraction??? Isn't that why there are warning signs, "if you have a back condition...." JMO

 

[flynnibus]

It's not that disabled guests *deserve* to get on rides faster than anyone else - they don't. It's that without those accommodations, or by enforcing that notion of "fairness" that says all guests have to wait exactly the same amount of time, a great number of disabled guests would not be able to get on rides *at* *all*. Does that seem any more "fair"?

I get what you are saying, but I think that 'all or nothing' challenge tho is what sets a lot of people off. How is it the person can be in the park for hours a day, but not tolerate a wait that accommodates their needs? If you can't stand, here's a place to sit, come back in 30mins. If you can't take the heat, go over there in the AC and come back in 30mins, etc. If you need shade, you can wait over there, etc. Your statement infers the only way the guest can be accommodated is to give them front of the line access - I personally can't think of a disability that says 'I can't wait' and so the reasonable accommodation should be front of the line access.

There are a lot of things that front-of-the-line would negate - but I can't think of one where front-of-the-line would be REQUIRED.

Intolerance for waiting is something I'm sure you've had to deal with in many aspects. How long the car ride is.. how long until dinner is ready.. how long until you are done and you can do what your son wants to do.. All things I'm sure you've learned how to manage to try to minimize the meltdowns. You've learned what you have to do to make waits tolerable.. if that is separation, distraction, or whatever. I don't see why reasonable accommodation needs to exceed that.

Example, for children with ADHD who can't tolerate that waiting in line without acting out.. diffuse the wait by doing something else until it's your time to ride.

 

[BigThunderMatt]

And what about celebrities? They get far better treatment than other guests, including the disabled.

They also pay top dollar for that experience. By comparison, if you don't look at the cost of admission, a GAC is free.

 

[PirateFrank]

Ever given out of charity or compassion in your life? Ever think Disney makes it easier for these folks out of the idea that they have plenty of struggles in life and just maybe this little bit of extra magic in this escape from the hardships of their real life may bring some happiness to what can often be a true struggle??

Compassion... Not everyone has it because they can't remove themselves from the equation and what they get out of it...

First, do yourself a favor and do not presume to know what my level of charity and compassion is. It's has zero to do with my opinion on this subject. Your decision to engage in an Ad Hominem attack on me to paint me as compassionless, in order to gain a perceived upper hand only reflects a poor character on yourself.

My comments are not about whether or not Disney should give these cards out. My issue is that the cards afford someone the ability to completely abuse fair use of admission. Just because someone has a condition that prevents them from standing on a line, it does *not* mean that person should cut the line and bypass paying guests at a rate of 3:1...oh, and bring along the entire family.

Give Kids the World children get to enjoy all sorts of privileges normal WDW park guests cannot. They pay nothing to get into the park. Does this upset you?

OK, So let me get this straight. You equate a paid guest who needs some type of assistance due to an apparent or non-apparent disability in order to equally enjoy the parks attractions with WDW granting VIP access to a charitable organization? No wonder cast members in this thread have indicated that the GAC issue is a true epidemic!!!

If you are hard of hearing and you walk into a theater, you'll be provided with headphones to enable you to hear, hopefully as if you didn't have the condition to begin with. Do you think you're entitled to stay all day and watch every movie in the theater? Or perhaps take the headphones home and use them for your stereo?

At what point do you stop feeling entitled to more than what you pay for because of your own perceived troubles or hardships? This is the *exact* justification used by people who engage in fraud and larceny.

So to answer your question, not it doesn't upset me. Every company in the US engages in some form of charity. This is about Disney not adequately establishing adequate controls over the use of these cards....and as a result, it's also about people self-justifying/demanding their own level of accommodation and taking it, because they feel entitled due to their hardship. Theft is theft. The reasons and justification doesn't make it less than theft.

I guess you must also have a problem with the children who are at Disney from Make a Wish foundation. They are at Disney for free paid for by peoples kind donations. This must bother you also. They were approved by make a wish foundation because they have a life threatening illness and most likely have been suffering most of their lives because it, and their lives might even be cut short because of it also. According to you nothing should entitle anyone to have a "greater share of entertainment value". I guess you feel that these children are entitled because they got to go to Disney for free? And to the front of the line? Seriously dude you need to watch the classic film called Scrooge. Have you ever heard of it? There have been plenty of versions for you to choose from. I suggest watching it and take the lesson learned from it.

See above with both theft of service vs VIP access to charity and the Ad Hominem attacks. Don't you dare presume to know my level of charity and compassion. It's a pretty underhanded attack to make such a statement about me, so you can create the perception that my point isn't valid......and it reflects poorly on yourself than anything to do with me.

 

[unkadug]

First, do yourself a favor and do not presume to know what my level of charity and compassion is. It's has zero to do with my opinion on this subject. Your decision to engage in an Ad Hominem attack on me to paint me as compassionless, in order to gain a perceived upper hand only reflects a poor character on yourself.

My comments are not about whether or not Disney should give these cards out. My issue is that the cards afford someone the ability to completely abuse fair use of admission. Just because someone has a condition that prevents them from standing on a line, it does *not* mean that person should cut the line and bypass paying guests at a rate of 3:1...oh, and bring along the entire family.



OK, So let me get this straight. You equate a paid guest who needs some type of assistance due to an apparent or non-apparent disability in order to equally enjoy the parks attractions with WDW granting VIP access to a charitable organization? No wonder cast members in this thread have indicated that the GAC issue is a true epidemic!!!

If you are hard of hearing and you walk into a theater, you'll be provided with headphones to enable you to hear, hopefully as if you didn't have the condition to begin with. Do you think you're entitled to stay all day and watch every movie in the theater? Or perhaps take the headphones home and use them for your stereo?

At what point do you stop feeling entitled to more than what you pay for because of your own perceived troubles or hardships? This is the *exact* justification used by people who engage in fraud and larceny.

So to answer your question, not it doesn't upset me. Every company in the US engages in some form of charity. This is about Disney not adequately establishing adequate controls over the use of these cards....and as a result, it's also about people self-justifying/demanding their own level of accommodation and taking it, because they feel entitled due to their hardship. Theft is theft. The reasons and justification doesn't make it less than theft.





See above with both theft of service vs VIP access to charity and the Ad Hominem attacks. Don't you dare presume to know my level of charity and compassion. It's a pretty underhanded attack to make such a statement about me, so you can create the perception that my point isn't valid......and it reflects poorly on yourself than anything to do with me.

Why do you feel that everyone is personally attacking you? How long have you had this condition?

 

[flynnibus]

First, do yourself a favor and do not presume to know what my level of charity and compassion is. It's has zero to do with my opinion on this subject. Your decision to engage in an Ad Hominem attack on me to paint me as compassionless, in order to gain a perceived upper hand only reflects a poor character on yourself.

I'm only reacting to what YOU posted. You posted that there is 'nothing that entitles anyone' unless they PAY for it. A position that is completely devoid of compassion. Do you hate on organizations like 'Make a Wish' too because they give someone something more than you without paying for it? Because they get a private M&G that you don't get and they didn't pay for it?

Consider for a second the possibility that Disney ACCEPTS that legitimate users of the GAC get this type of access you don't - because they are being compassionate towards the struggles these guests have to face day to day outside of their vacation. Trying to make their trip a little more special because they know the non-vacation life isn't all roses. Like the poster before who mentioned getting re-rides without having to get out of the vehicle. There is no law requiring Disney to do that. Yet Disney does it because with compassion they know how difficult it is for the family to transfer in and out of the vehicle. A little compassion goes a long way.

Imagine if you showed up at Disney after a miserable travel experience... and Disney gave you a free upgrade on your room. By your logic, you don't deserve it unless you pay for it. Ignoring the possibility that Disney may be GIVING things instead of everyone just TAKING things.

My comments are not about whether or not Disney should give these cards out. My issue is that the cards afford someone the ability to completely abuse fair use of admission.

What the heck is 'fair use of admission'?

You must hate on Family of the Day, Birthday magical moments, and all those other things because they get something that not everyone gets - and they didn't pay more for it. Disney offers those perks they give out, just like Disney is the one controlling if GAC users can do more.

You are blindly lumping everyone together under abusers. My post was to point out that there is the possibility these loopholes are intentional - out of the idea of trying to make these people's trips more special. Just like a birthday button, a free dessert, etc.

You need to be able to separate your hate for the 'too open access' of the GAC and alt access.. from what the GAC actually grants.

 

[PirateFrank]

Why do you feel that everyone is personally attacking you? How long have you had this condition?

Oh please. I didn't say everyone. But nice try at trying to paint me as an crazed outlier. I specifically pointed out comments made to me by two people who felt it important to claim, that since I didn't agree with them, that I must therefore be cold-hearted and compassionless. Get out a dictionary and look up Ad Hominem and think before you claim someone has a condition because he/she doesn't agree with you.

why is it that whenever these issues are discussed, pejorative discourse and attacks on character become more central than the issues?

There's clearly a problem with the GAC card. There's a problem with the controls over its granting. There's problems with controls over its use.

 

[unkadug]

Oh please. I didn't say everyone. But nice try at trying to paint me as an crazed outlier. I specifically pointed out comments made to me by two people who felt it important to claim, that since I didn't agree with them, that I must therefore be cold-hearted and compassionless. Get out a dictionary and look up Ad Hominem and think before you claim someone has a condition because he/she doesn't agree with you.

why is it that whenever these issues are discussed, pejorative discourse and attacks on character become more central than the issues?

There's clearly a problem with the GAC card. There's a problem with the controls over its granting. There's problems with controls over its use.

Perhaps you should look it up:

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/ad hominem

​

marked by or being an attack on an opponent's character rather than by an answer to the contentions made​

 

[flynnibus]

some people just can't face their own words. When you make everything be about equal investment REGARDLESS of situation - that shows a lack of compassion to listen or understand the situation being presented. Especially when its something petty like money...

I bet PirateFrank doesn't get upset when someone gives him a discount they didn't have to.. or gives him something slightly extra he didn't pay for. But if it's someone else getting something he didn't.. he's upset.

 

[Tigger1988]

OK, So let me get this straight. You equate a paid guest who needs some type of assistance due to an apparent or non-apparent disability in order to equally enjoy the parks attractions with WDW granting VIP access to a charitable organization?

I'm not equating anything. I'm responding to you who said this "There's nothing that entitles anyone to a *greater* share of entertainment value, unless parents of children with mental or physical disabilities pay more than those without children of such need."

According to you absolutely nothing entitles ANYONE benefits that normal guests cannot enjoy. So, who is the one doing the equating here?

 

[rob0519]

That's very kind of you.

I guess my other point is, cries of "that's unfair, they shouldn't get to go more often than regular guests" really just disappoint me. The cynical side of me wants to say: Tell you what, I'll trade you. You get to ride Star Tours three times in an hour, and I get to have a son who will grow up, move out, get married, have kids of his own, and lead a long and fulfilling life. Because I'm here to tell you, baring a dramatic medical breakthrough my life is pretty much going to be taking care of my now-adult son day in and day out for decades to come, until the day that I get too old and frail to care for myself, let alone Ben. Some day I am going to die, and Ben is still going to be physically perfectly healthy, and he won't understand why I am gone and he has to go live with total strangers. I will never have grandchildren. Ben will never live independently. Most of his life is a minute-to-minute struggle against a world he simply cannot understand. So forgive me if I do not feel any pangs of guilt when, for a few hours every now and then, I get to see my son experience pure and unbridled joy by going on a theme park attraction. If that's abusing the system, then pardon me while I abuse the hell out of the system at every possible opportunity.

I have really tried to stay out of this discussion because there really is no answer that will satisfy either side, but this response is so well written and so true, I have to comment.

I will be cynical. I'll gladly give you or your child my son's disabilities and our GAC for him to have the normal life you all enjoy. Our son will never grow up, move out, drive, get married, have children or do 90% of the things the non-disabled world can do. He cannot take care of himself and will more than likely outlive us, leaving his sisters to care for him his and their later age. And yes, believe it or not we do feel some guilt pangs from the stares and comments of strangers as we struggle the queues with his wheelchair and help him into his seat, but that's just part of the whole picture and we deal with it.

We don't "abuse the system". He can't or won't ride RockNRoll Coaster or Tower of Terror or Everest or Space Mountain, so we're not even taking up space on most of the major attractions. If we're lucky his health allows him to ride several attractions twice a day before he needs to rest. So if there is a magic wand somewhere that can make give someone his life struggles and a GAC to Disney World, step right up. You can have both, as well as everything I own for him to have your normal life.

To those who are sympathetic and compassionate towards people like my son, I'm sorry for this rant. To me this thread is now dead.

 

[startraveler]

I have really tried to stay out of this discussion because there really is no answer that will satisfy either side, but this response is so well written and so true, I have to comment.

I will be cynical. I'll gladly give you or your child my son's disabilities and our GAC for him to have the normal life you all enjoy. Our son will never grow up, move out, drive, get married, have children or do 90% of the things the non-disabled world can do. He cannot take care of himself and will more than likely outlive us, leaving his sisters to care for him his and their later age. And yes, believe it or not we do feel some guilt pangs from the stares and comments of strangers as we struggle the queues with his wheelchair and help him into his seat, but that's just part of the whole picture and we deal with it.

We don't "abuse the system". He can't or won't ride RockNRoll Coaster or Tower of Terror or Everest or Space Mountain, so we're not even taking up space on most of the major attractions. If we're lucky his health allows him to ride several attractions twice a day before he needs to rest. So if there is a magic wand somewhere that can make give someone his life struggles and a GAC to Disney World, step right up. You can have both, as well as everything I own for him to have your normal life.

To those who are sympathetic and compassionate towards people like my son, I'm sorry for this rant. To me this thread is now dead.

Amen!

 

[doppelv]

Apparently now based on the repsonses I've been seeing I'm now unsympathetic to families with individuals with disabilities. I truly apologize if I have offended anyone, that was certainly not my intent. Much like any issue, I think the concept that needs to be addressed is balance. How does Disney go above and beyond while still keeping in mind all guests? What bothers me about what my family had done wasn't that they rode ST three times in an hour, it was that they picked the busiest time that ride will likely ever see to do so. I absolutely have no issues with GACs being issued to families that need them, but the simple truth is as long as they provide a benefit that would look enticing to groups that do not need them, they will continue to be abused. Not everyone in a park is going to get to go on every ride every day, it's a simple matter if ride capacity. For lower to moderate demand rides like Snow White, it's probably not a huge deal, and I am very proud the company I love can make magic for such a deserving family. I do have to think though, that if a similar situation was happening on one of the mountains, it could presumably lead to someone not getting to experience something that they may never have the opportunity to do so ever again. Some families save up years and years to get to WDW once. I am grateful that I can come so much, but I tend to take that for granted. If Space Mountain has a two hour wait with no fastpasses, I can return another day, many families can't. This, I reiterate my point that there needs to be a way to ensure this is a tool to assist and, yes, even provide some extra magic wherever possible, but there needs to be a way to provide that balance to ensure all guests of all needs can have the best day possible. Every family has burdens to bear, sometimes they just happen to be less visible than others.

 

[Lucky]

They also pay top dollar for that experience. By comparison, if you don't look at the cost of admission, a GAC is free.

Not just anybody with the money can get a VIP pass that lets them skip the lines, among other things. Celebrities get preferential treatment - they can purchase it but others can't.