Possible Changes coming to the Guest Assistance Cards (GAC)

[Gabe1]

DisneyJoe/HIPAA laws

You are absolutely correct. They cannot ask. Presenting proof is totally the guests choice.

 

[Tom Morrow]

When we do see others with the card, they all seem very needy of it. I don't think the abuse, at least from what we have seen, is really that bad at all.

Yet we have multiple people with first hand accounts confirming that it is a huge problem. Again, unless you are the one handing them out, or the one having to check them every 10 seconds, it won't seem like a problem to you.

 

[AEfx]

Yet we have multiple people with first hand accounts confirming that it is a huge problem. Again, unless you are the one handing them out, or the one having to check them every 10 seconds, it won't seem like a problem to you.

There is a difference between huge, and widespread.

While it's true that there is abuse, and it's also true that there are some people that will lie to get one, in general, most people don't even know they exist, and the dirtbags that do get one fraudulently are the same people who would just rent a wheelchair instead if the GAC wasn't available. A wheelchair "acts" like a GAC (according to Disney, if you have a wheelchair you don't need the actual card). And there is no way around letting wheelchairs use alternate entrances that skip the queues in many cases (or they would have to rebuild the queue, this is especially true in MK as so many are so old), and even in the ones where a wheelchair can go in the queue, many you have to use another entrance because you need to board somewhere else (like the HM, where you board at the exit).

To be honest, the only place I've really seen it personally as an observable problem is at the bus stops. When there are six bus loads of people standing in line, and someone comes up just as the bus arrives with a scooter, has a dozen family members in tow, and they all spread out taking up as many seats as possible. The bus drivers have been instructed they MUST board a wheelchair first, even if they were last to arrive (we actually "fought" with one once - we were like, it's ok, we'll wait for the next one and he would not let us). My family (child in wheelchair + 3 adults) always stand when my niece and her wheelchair are secure. We kind of crowd around it to let waiting people get seats. I don't think everyone needs to do that, but when people are taking up two seats per person with ten or a dozen people, it takes up half the bus.

And the thing is - all you need is a wheelchair to do so and no GAC is needed (they don't do anything out of the park).

Just some food for thought.

 

[s&k'smom]

We have had a GAC for years and usually just bring the old one and get it updated but I have lost it since our last trip and plan to get another for my son on our trip next year. Luckily with traveling in October we've rarely had to use it but I like to have it just in case. The lines are usually so much more manageable off season and he goes on so few rides that it's not usually an issue.

The first time we got it for him I think he was about 6 and oh man the past year had been so tough, anyhow we go to WDW and the whole week won't ride on a thing I swear we could barely get him on the Monorail, so the very last day what does he decide to do, go on the the cars at the MK ( I can think of the name the ones right near Tomorrowland) and of course there is a terrible line, so I show the card thinking we can just wait our turn to the side but the blessed CM brought us up to the front and even was kind enough to take our picture in the car. I was sobbing by the time the ride was over as this is the first time I was able to ever do anything with him at WDW, she even offered to let us go again but Sammy had had enough. This act of kindness was a real blessing to me and an unexpected gift. So when I hear of someone abusing the GAC it get my blood going but I just let it go, well I mutter under my breath and then let it go.

 

[Poofiesdream]

what are the different stamps on the GAC and what do they stand for? Anyone know?

 

[Tom Morrow]

There is a difference between huge, and widespread.

While it's true that there is abuse, and it's also true that there are some people that will lie to get one, in general, most people don't even know they exist, and the dirtbags that do get one fraudulently are the same people who would just rent a wheelchair instead if the GAC wasn't available. A wheelchair "acts" like a GAC (according to Disney, if you have a wheelchair you don't need the actual card).

Not true in most cases. A wheelchair does nothing for you outside of the few attraction queues that are still not wheelchair accessable, and that isn't very many anymore. Even then, you don't get to go right on, you just do a different boarding process. A GAC with an alternate entrance stamp (which is what the vast majority of them are stamped with) gets you immediate and instant access to the Fastpass queue for any attraction with Fastpass. THIS is the main problem. The cards become an unlimited Fastpass and are used and abused as such.

Also, clearly many people know they exist, just look at the article in the OP, and even more people know every day.

[/quote]And there is no way around letting wheelchairs use alternate entrances that skip the queues in many cases (or they would have to rebuild the queue, this is especially true in MK as so many are so old), and even in the ones where a wheelchair can go in the queue, many you have to use another entrance because you need to board somewhere else (like the HM, where you board at the exit).[/quote]Again, doesn't mean they do or should get instant access. Space Mountain, for example, makes you return at a time based on how long the standby queue is.

 

[M.rudolf]

Yet we have multiple people with first hand accounts confirming that it is a huge problem. Again, unless you are the one handing them out, or the one having to check them every 10 seconds, it won't seem like a problem to you.

So why exactly do you care? It has very little effect on most of the posters here vacation. As for your comment on the definition of terminally ill, it seems a very rash. There have been people who abuse the system for thousands of years and it won't change and if you think screaming, hollering and having a temper tantrum will change it,guess what it won't. If a hundred people abuse the gac and 1 truly needy person uses it I say so be it, at least it helped that 1 person that truly needed it. Doesn't anyone mind there own business and enjoy there vacation. And as for the employees that have provided the info here remember until you are a doctor you shouldn't be diagnosing whether a person is truly ill or not. When your 40 and they diagnose you with ALS, when you have a mentally challenged child, when you have motor skill issues or when you have those oh so precious minutes left then maybe you should judge until then enjoy your vacation and thank your personal god that your not dealing with these issues. And if you ask me you truly have to have a mental defect to ask for a gac if you don't need one, so maybe this group of people are also covered. Just remember not too long ago, before the net, people used to mind their own business.

 

[AEfx]

/sigh

Not true in most cases. A wheelchair does nothing for you outside of the few attraction queues that are still not wheelchair accessable, and that isn't very many anymore. Even then, you don't get to go right on, you just do a different boarding process. A GAC with an alternate entrance stamp (which is what the vast majority of them are stamped with) gets you immediate and instant access to the Fastpass queue for any attraction with Fastpass. THIS is the main problem. The cards become an unlimited Fastpass and are used and abused as such.

I'm using Disney's own words there. A Wheelchair acts as a GAC, according to them, unless the policy has changed in the last year or so.

Also, clearly many people know they exist, just look at the article in the OP, and even more people know every day.

To paraphrase the Unofficial Guide, when explaining why getting "Touring Plans" out there in a book
would "ruin" them if everyone did it, that only a small percentage of people would ever be exposed to them, much less use them.

Yes, I read the article. I still think people are over blowing this to all proportions. In fact, threads like this where people like yourself are going on very angrily are just going to increase any abuse by exposing it to more people.

Again, doesn't mean they do or should get instant access. Space Mountain, for example, makes you return at a time based on how long the standby queue is.

No, I didn't say it did. Sometimes it does. I can tell you, we may not have stood in the line proper when we have a child with a wheelchair with us, but we often had to wait at load for them to be able to stop the ride or whatever the boarding procedure was, just as long as the line (which is fine). But to think you just march/wheel up and the whole world stops is a misnomer.

And, in fact, when we did save line time, the truth is, we still saw just the same as everyone else. That's because it takes us far longer to get between rides, or a bathroom break (most families can do that in what, five, ten minutes? With us it's at least a half hour operation, including finding a bathroom that is accessible to someone who needs a companion, waiting for able-bodied people who "prefer" to use them to get out of the one we NEED to use), extra time at shows before and after to get seated and get out, extra boarding time for busess and everything else - the courtesies Disney gives basically even it out to us getting the same "entertainment value" (or ride count) as "normal" guests who just walk about the park and do what they want all day without having to plan the logistics of every single attraction, bathroom break, etc. We'd gladly trade with you, if it was possible - to be able to go to Disney and not have to think constantly and plan constantly and try to minimize the impact on a child who has to live every moment of her life like that and still trying to stay cheery and enjoy WDW.

Regardless, you seem very angry about this, and I'm just offering up our experience. No need to jump down my throat or act as if I have some hidden agenda. As I said earlier in this thread, this is a tough call - and I don't have the answer. It's a very complicated issue. Arguing about it does no good, though - so let's just let people share their thoughts and experiences, without slamming the discussion into the ground.

 

[jaklgreen]

I think people missunderstand what the ADA is for. Everyone thinks that it means Disney would "get in trouble" for not giving people a "front of the line pass". The guidelines set by the ADA are there to insure that people with a handicap are able to access areas that are open to the public. example, the grocery store, the bank, the museum, by providing ramps and other accessability. It is not meant for people to have an "entitled attitude of me first". Disney does not have to give out GAC. They have already complied with ADA by making the rides wheelchair accessible(where possible). Everything else that Disney does to try to accomidate every possible human conditions is a bonus. Like most of the people that actually have a handicap have already posted, that they are more then willing to let Disney know their condition and needs in order to get extra help. If you are not willing to do that you need to find a way to cope however you can. By maybe renting a wheelchair if you can not stand or go at slower times of the year and use fastpass if your child is autistic(btw my niece is autistic and that is what my sister does with her and has not useds a GAC). I know everyone feels like going to WDW is a "right" but honostly if it is too much of a hardship for you or a your child(like some have posted that their child has had some major meltdowns) then you should ask yourself if going to an amusement park of that size is something you should do. I grew up oldschool and knew that everyone has limitations and you just can't do everything you want in this life.

 

[flynnibus]

I think people missunderstand what the ADA is for. Everyone thinks that it means Disney would "get in trouble" for not giving people a "front of the line pass". The guidelines set by the ADA are there to insure that people with a handicap are able to access areas that are open to the public. example, the grocery store, the bank, the museum, by providing ramps and other accessability. It is not meant for people to have an "entitled attitude of me first". Disney does not have to give out GAC. They have already complied with ADA by making the rides wheelchair accessible(where possible). Everything else that Disney does to try to accomidate every possible human conditions is a bonus.

This is incorrect - that is only ONE part of the ADA. The point of the ADA is ensure those with disability (not limited to just mobility handicaps) have equal access. The ADA is FAR more reaching then simply wheelchair access. This does not mean Disney owes people 'front of the line passes' - but this idea that 'we are handicap accessible, we are done' is simply WRONG.

I grew up oldschool and knew that everyone has limitations and you just can't do everything you want in this life.

While there are limitations - the point of the ADA is to ensure people these people are not discriminated against because of their disabilities. That means removing barriers when possible as well.

 

[amzgirl]

Here's another GAC user here. I can say with fairly high confidence that my spouse would not have agreed to try disney without a GAC, and we would certainly not be passholders without it. We just got passes again last week after a 2+ year hiatus.

My autistic son (14) pretty much ONLY likes rides. Some shows, maybe. Fireworks would cause a panic attack until a couple of years ago. We have never seen Fantasmic for that reason. He cannot tolerate waiting and letting his sister enjoy a game of Kim Possible or playing one of the games in Innoventions. If we go into stores he heads straight for the candy and has to be dragged away. He needs to have his hand held tightly, frequently. Outside of Disney, "normal" family attractions like the zoo or museum are not enjoyable for him, except maybe some parts of a children's museum or the petting zoo portion of the zoo. I plan on taking by daughter alone with me to Washington DC because it would be a miserable experience for my son. He simply lacks the cognitive capacity to appreciate such things. Disney is one of the few things we all can enjoy together with very few problems, thanks to the GAC.

We now have used the GAC for all our Disney trips. He is able to wait for about 15 to 20 minutes or so but gets quite antsy after that. He makes noises which can get loud and continual as he gets more stressed and he would disturb other people around him, though fortunately he does not display any aggression towards others when stressed. I also think his legs get tired somehow when standing for too long, because he tends to sit on the floor when he has to stand and wait for more than a few minutes. I have to keep telling him to get up or pulling him up.

He now knows Disney very well. If we were to come up to, say, Everest and get a pass to come back later, you can bet there would be a fit as he realizes we are not getting in line. He would have to be dragged away. He is rapidly approaching my weight and that will not work forever. Now that he is used to the current system, making that major change would result in our probably not going to Disney much if at all. Don't believe me? Some friends have an autistic son who enjoys Universal. They made that change to their version of the GAC a year or so ago. They no longer go, because their son has a fit when they go up to a ride to get a pass, only to leave the ride behind. He simply does not understand. And he is considerably higher functioning than my son.

I agree that there is abuse and some of it has been perpetuated by yours truly and my spouse by riding rides multiple times. I have justified it in the past to myself due to the fact that there is a large portion of Disney that our family cannot enjoy with him without risking a major meltdown and ruining ours and other's experience. See above. That being said, I appreciate that there is a problem and would be quite open to reasonable attempts to solve it. Telling autistic children to "come back later" however is not a reasonable solution.

With the RFID chips there is now a relatively easy solution to this problem. The GAC can be preloaded with "anytime" fastpasses - either 1)one for every attraction in the park or 2) a set number of attractions or 3)a selection of attraction that the child/family chooses. Furthermore, the GAC could be programmed to "know" exactly how many people are in that child's family (Disney already has this info if you have ever stayed in one of their hotels) to eliminate the "12 people" thing. (By the way, we frequently tour the parks with our friends, so you have 8 people with 2 GACs, and it would be easy for an outsider to miss seeing that second one. Autistic families tend to hang together.) Finally, a separate line at GR with specially trained "Accessibility CMs" would help to ferret out the liars.

If these changes are made, we would be dealing with two changes - not being able to ride a ride twice, and having to go to GR every time we enter a park. But I would be willing to put up with these changes and still enjoy Disney. If they adopt the "here's a pass come back in 30 minutes" approach, I can't see us renewing that AP at all. I hope I have enlightened some of you as to why that "simple solution" some are proposing is not at all a good solution for most of us with autistic children.

 

[doctornick]

So why exactly do you care? It has very little effect on most of the posters here vacation.

Well, the question is whether unscrupulous abuse of the GAC program is widespread enough to affect most people on vacation at Disney. And I have no idea. But it's probably a reasonable thing for Disney too look at and determine.

My personal guess is that the impact at WDW to the "regular" guest is probably minimal and there little reason to justify significant changes to the GAC set up. But the more widespread use of GAC at DLR (if the original article is to be believed) and possible higher percentage of those distributed GAC's being unscrupulous may lead TDA to change their policies or implementation there.

This is not a debate for message board posters though, but hopefully whatever changes occur in the future they are done for the best interest of all guests, including those who need GACs.

 

[RSoxNo1]

Here's another GAC user here. I can say with fairly high confidence that my spouse would not have agreed to try disney without a GAC, and we would certainly not be passholders without it. We just got passes again last week after a 2+ year hiatus.

My autistic son (14) pretty much ONLY likes rides. Some shows, maybe. Fireworks would cause a panic attack until a couple of years ago. We have never seen Fantasmic for that reason. He cannot tolerate waiting and letting his sister enjoy a game of Kim Possible or playing one of the games in Innoventions. If we go into stores he heads straight for the candy and has to be dragged away. He needs to have his hand held tightly, frequently. Outside of Disney, "normal" family attractions like the zoo or museum are not enjoyable for him, except maybe some parts of a children's museum or the petting zoo portion of the zoo. I plan on taking by daughter alone with me to Washington DC because it would be a miserable experience for my son. He simply lacks the cognitive capacity to appreciate such things. Disney is one of the few things we all can enjoy together with very few problems, thanks to the GAC.

We now have used the GAC for all our Disney trips. He is able to wait for about 15 to 20 minutes or so but gets quite antsy after that. He makes noises which can get loud and continual as he gets more stressed and he would disturb other people around him, though fortunately he does not display any aggression towards others when stressed. I also think his legs get tired somehow when standing for too long, because he tends to sit on the floor when he has to stand and wait for more than a few minutes. I have to keep telling him to get up or pulling him up.

He now knows Disney very well. If we were to come up to, say, Everest and get a pass to come back later, you can bet there would be a fit as he realizes we are not getting in line. He would have to be dragged away. He is rapidly approaching my weight and that will not work forever. Now that he is used to the current system, making that major change would result in our probably not going to Disney much if at all. Don't believe me? Some friends have an autistic son who enjoys Universal. They made that change to their version of the GAC a year or so ago. They no longer go, because their son has a fit when they go up to a ride to get a pass, only to leave the ride behind. He simply does not understand. And he is considerably higher functioning than my son.

I agree that there is abuse and some of it has been perpetuated by yours truly and my spouse by riding rides multiple times. I have justified it in the past to myself due to the fact that there is a large portion of Disney that our family cannot enjoy with him without risking a major meltdown and ruining ours and other's experience. See above. That being said, I appreciate that there is a problem and would be quite open to reasonable attempts to solve it. Telling autistic children to "come back later" however is not a reasonable solution.

With the RFID chips there is now a relatively easy solution to this problem. The GAC can be preloaded with "anytime" fastpasses - either 1)one for every attraction in the park or 2) a set number of attractions or 3)a selection of attraction that the child/family chooses. Furthermore, the GAC could be programmed to "know" exactly how many people are in that child's family (Disney already has this info if you have ever stayed in one of their hotels) to eliminate the "12 people" thing. (By the way, we frequently tour the parks with our friends, so you have 8 people with 2 GACs, and it would be easy for an outsider to miss seeing that second one. Autistic families tend to hang together.) Finally, a separate line at GR with specially trained "Accessibility CMs" would help to ferret out the liars.

If these changes are made, we would be dealing with two changes - not being able to ride a ride twice, and having to go to GR every time we enter a park. But I would be willing to put up with these changes and still enjoy Disney. If they adopt the "here's a pass come back in 30 minutes" approach, I can't see us renewing that AP at all. I hope I have enlightened some of you as to why that "simple solution" some are proposing is not at all a good solution for most of us with autistic children.

Having grown up with an autistic brother, I can definitely relate. As much as any of us dislike change, more often than not we can at least understand it. For someone with autism, change to their routine is one of the hardest things they deal with. Combine that with depriving them of something they want and forcing them to exhibit patience and it's a horrible combination.

 

[s&k'smom]

I had to chuckle because I so get the change in routine. Mercy what we go through with my son. I have to say taking him to Disney has been wonderful, we've had our challanges but every trip gets a little better. This last trip we even were able to let him go down to the pool on his own for a few minutes while we gathered our belongings in our room. That's one of the things I love about staying on property the safety for my son.

 

[BigThunderMatt]

On a side note, South Park did a glorious job of lampooning the ECV issue at Disney parks last night.

 

[unkadug]

On a side note, South Park did a glorious job of lampooning the ECV issue at Disney parks last night.

Perhaps Trey and Matt are members of this forum!

 

[RSoxNo1]

On a side note, South Park did a glorious job of lampooning the ECV issue at Disney parks last night.

This is going to come off as very egotistical, but there were so many components of that episode that pointed to our show it's legitimately puzzling. We have complained about the "pain in the a$$ scooter people", mocked James Cameron, and mocked Randy Newman.

 

[stlbobby]

This is going to come off as very egotistical, but there were so many components of that episode that pointed to our show it's legitimately puzzling. We have complained about the "pain in the a$$ scooter people", mocked James Cameron, and mocked Randy Newman.

Yes, because you are the first people to ever mock Randy Newman.

Sorry, I just couldn't resist.

Please take that as good natured sarcasm and not as a slam as it could so easily be read. It really says more about Mr. Newman than you.

 

[AEfx]

This is going to come off as very egotistical, but there were so many components of that episode that pointed to our show it's legitimately puzzling. We have complained about the "pain in the a$$ scooter people", mocked James Cameron, and mocked Randy Newman.

This isn't the first time this has happened. I'm trying to remember the last time - maybe four or five years ago?

I'm genuinely convinced that some member of the South Park writing staff visits these boards.

Some may find that silly, but I remember thinking about it before, and I definitely think it now. This is the premiere WDW board (the only serious WDW board, if there were such a thing), and it often puzzles me when people don't think that "famous" people or people in Hollywood, or even Disney, read message boards, too.

 

[RSoxNo1]

This isn't the first time this has happened. I'm trying to remember the last time - maybe four or five years ago?

I'm genuinely convinced that some member of the South Park writing staff visits these boards.

Some may find that silly, but I remember thinking about it before, and I definitely think it now. This is the premiere WDW board (the only serious WDW board, if there were such a thing), and it often puzzles me when people don't think that "famous" people or people in Hollywood, or even Disney, read message boards, too.

If there wasn't the Disneyland tie in the episode I would chalk it up as a coincidence, but it really didn't seem that far fetched. I think if my co-hosts and I were to have made a South Park episode we would have come up with something very similar. Having said that, I'm sure nobody cares about this so I'll drop it unless someone else continues to engage the topic.