Please delete.

[Vegas Disney Fan]

I don't know. I have been on this site and another Disney site since we'll before Covid and the negativity is a lot higher then I have ever seen it. I think people are upset with all the cuts and nickel and diming going on. Genie+ has been a disaster.

100% agree, Disney has always made changes that we’d gripe about but I’ve never seen so many massive changes all at once, ending Magical Express, replacing free FP with paid Genie+, requiring reservations, eliminating standby lines and introducing what’s basically a lottery to get on the newest rides, parking industrial barges in World Showcase... it’s a lot of huge (negative) changes all at once.

 

[GoneViral]

I don't know. I have been on this site and another Disney site since we'll before Covid and the negativity is a lot higher then I have ever seen it. I think people are upset with all the cuts and nickel and diming going on. Genie+ has been a disaster.

And again, you're fully entitled that opinion. As someone who has been reading Disney fan sites for decades now, this doesn't scratch the surface of what happened with Roy Disney and Eisner.

As for Disney Genie+, it has solidified Disney's financials. So, it's doing what it needed to do after the damage caused by COVID. Plus, people are buying it in higher numbers than anyone has anticipated. For this reason, loyal WDW fans may not like it -- the Disneyland ones were already used to it -- but it's the opposite of a disaster. It's a blockbuster success.

I think the equivalent is that it's like Dr. Strange in the Multiverse of Madness, which a lot of MCU die-hards don't like but has made a ton of money.

 

[Lilofan]

And again, you're fully entitled that opinion. As someone who has been reading Disney fan sites for decades now, this doesn't scratch the surface of what happened with Roy Disney and Eisner.

As for Disney Genie+, it has solidified Disney's financials. So, it's doing what it needed to do after the damage caused by COVID. Plus, people are buying it in higher numbers than anyone has anticipated. For this reason, loyal WDW fans may not like it -- the Disneyland ones were already used to it -- but it's the opposite of a disaster. It's a blockbuster success.

I think the equivalent is that it's like Dr. Strange in the Multiverse of Madness, which a lot of MCU die-hards don't like but has made a ton of money.

Some rightly so think the sky will fall on this one but like you said it is a success. Short-term yes, long-term wait and see.

 

[marni1971]

I’d disagree. Overall, on this and on other sites, on social media platforms, word of mouth, talking to friends both in and outside the industry, this is a bigger and a different feel than the Save Disney era. There is a slow, underlying disenchantment with the company and in particular WDW across the board. Call it murmurs, an overall vibe or a generalised feel for the wider status quo but I’ve not seen it like this before. And I’ve been around quite a while. I’m not saying others mileage won’t vary - of course it will. But I sense an overall vibe - again not just here but in general - of declining satisfaction, without taking my own personal feelings into account. And it’s a shame.

One more note. Paid fastpass hasn’t gone down as well in Anaheim as was planned.

 

[yensidtlaw1969]

As for Disney Genie+, it has solidified Disney's financials. So, it's doing what it needed to do after the damage caused by COVID. Plus, people are buying it in higher numbers than anyone has anticipated. For this reason, loyal WDW fans may not like it -- the Disneyland ones were already used to it -- but it's the opposite of a disaster. It's a blockbuster success.

You're forgetting the "at what cost?" part of the equation.

Guest satisfaction for Genie+ is in hell. Disney's already announced changes to the program to begin accounting for this. They're not doing that because it's so successful, they're doing it because they fully recognize there's bleeding they have to stem.

The reputation of the resort is at stake. Thank heavens they're paying attention.

 

[Lilofan]

100% agree, Disney has always made changes that we’d gripe about but I’ve never seen so many massive changes all at once, ending Magical Express, replacing free FP with paid Genie+, requiring reservations, eliminating standby lines and introducing what’s basically a lottery to get on the newest rides, parking industrial barges in World Showcase... it’s a lot of huge (negative) changes all at once.

I'm surprised Disney Springs parking garages are still free. Universal Orlando parking garage is not I believe . It is just a matter of time. I don't think WDW water parks are paid parking but if it is not, it is another way to earn more profits by charging for parking.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

I’d disagree. Overall, on this and on other sites, on social media platforms, word of mouth, talking to friends both in and outside the industry, this is a bigger and a different feel than the Save Disney era. There is a slow, underlying disenchantment with the company and in particular WDW across the board. Call it murmurs, an overall vibe or a generalised feel for the wider status quo but I’ve not seen it like this before. And I’ve been around quite a while. I’m not saying others mileage won’t vary - of course it will. But I sense an overall vibe - again not just here but in general - of declining satisfaction, without taking my own personal feelings into account. And it’s a shame.

One more note. Paid fastpass hasn’t gone down as well in Anaheim as was planned.

In some ways, in many ways, Disney World is a proxy. It is a symbol or metaphor for American culture at large. Disney World is more or less an ode to American nostalgia - Americana.

Many parts of American culture are being questioned; some say attacked. Even if you don't like that wording, I think we all agree there is much anger/frustration over parts of our culture that we used to take for granted.

So it makes sense to see this feeling projected towards Disney World.

Look at each land of MK. Do we still see "Main Street" the same way? Do we still revere Tomorrow? Space Travel? Do we still admire jungle explorers? (Adventureland) Do we collectively admire American Presidents the same way we did 20, 30, 50 years ago? Many aspects of Fantasyland are also now being questioned to a degree that is new. [not us personally = we collectively.]

We can't easily articulate answers to the big questions being asked, so we aim for something simple.

Disney World has become a scapegoat. But it isn't even that simple. We also crave Americana.

 

[Lilofan]

In some ways, in many ways, Disney World is a proxy. It is a symbol or metaphor for American culture at large. Disney World is more or less an ode to American nostalgia - Americana.

Many parts of American culture are being questioned; some say attacked. Even if you don't like that wording, I think we all agree there is much anger/frustration over parts of our culture that we used to take for granted.

So it makes sense to see this feeling projected towards Disney World.

Look at each land of MK. Do we still see "Main Street" the same way? Do we still revere Tomorrow? Space Travel? Do we still admire jungle explorers? (Adventureland) Do we collectively admire American Presidents the same way we did 20, 30, 50 years ago? Many aspects of Fantasyland are also now being questioned to a degree that is new. [not us personally = we collectively.]

We can't easily articulate answers to the big questions being asked, so we aim for something simple.

Disney World has become a scapegoat. But it isn't even that simple. We also crave Americana.

Eisner and team were all a GO to build Disney America theme park in northern VA until the VA locals fought Disney . Disney backed down and never built the park. A few years later DAK was built. Americana would be front and center in this proposed park if it was built.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

One of the best lines in all of WDW is Sam Eagle's, "It's called, A Salute to All Nations, but Mostly America."

That one short sentence sums up so much.

 

[marni1971]

Disney World has become a scapegoat.

For who? Top Management?

The blame lies squarely at their greedy feet. Nowhere else.

 

[Lilofan]

For who? Top Management?

The blame lies squarely at their greedy feet. Nowhere else.

In 2017 Disney earned $9B in addition they received courtesy of tax cuts $1.6B, not too shabby.

 

[GoneViral]

You're forgetting the "at what cost?" part of the equation.

Guest satisfaction for Genie+ is in hell. Disney's already announced changes to the program to begin accounting for this. They're not doing that because it's so successful, they're doing it because they fully recognize there's bleeding they have to stem.

The reputation of the resort is at stake. Thank heavens they're paying attention.

The changes you reference are more along the lines of guaranteeing less in writing because the service has proven so successful. It had been eight attractions. Now it's 2 or 3. That's not something someone does to stem bleeding. It's what you do when you have more demand than supply.

As for the "at what cost" part, it's been the status quo at Disneyland since MaxPass started in 2017. So, I don't understand why anybody thinks it's different with WDW. Virtually every major theme park charges for shorter park lines. If anything, WDW could have done this much sooner and doesn't get enough credit for waiting as long as it did.

Again, there are a lot of narratives flying around here. The truth is that Disney parks are doing extraordinarily well. As Disney fans, that should please us all.

 

[yensidtlaw1969]

The truth is that Disney parks are doing extraordinarily well. As Disney fans, that should please us all.

If that were true and it were that simple, I would be right there with you.

There's more going on than your assessment accounts for.

 

[GoneViral]

If that were true and it were that simple, I would be right there with you.

There's more going on than your assessment accounts for.

All I'm discussing are park attendance, Disney Genie+, supply and demand. We can quantify those, and the data shines an extremely positive light on Disney. Palace intrigue, political discourse, and social media complaints are different subjects. None of it ever seems to impact Disney's park machine, which is the point.

 

[yensidtlaw1969]

All I'm discussing are park attendance, Disney Genie+, supply and demand. We can quantify those, and the data shines an extremely positive light on Disney. Palace intrigue, political discourse, and social media complaints are different subjects. None of it ever seems to impact Disney's park machine, which is the point.

I'm replying based on this statement you made earlier:

As for Disney Genie+, it has solidified Disney's financials. So, it's doing what it needed to do after the damage caused by COVID. Plus, people are buying it in higher numbers than anyone has anticipated. For this reason, loyal WDW fans may not like it -- the Disneyland ones were already used to it -- but it's the opposite of a disaster. It's a blockbuster success.

Genie+ really hasn't solidified Disney's financials - Disney is freaking out because even though people are buying upfront they see very clearly there's a big storm coming if they don't correct course, and soon. Which mean's it's not doing what it needed to do after the damage from COVID, because what Disney needs isn't a couple bucks today at the expense of many bucks tomorrow. They're hanging in there just fine, but they need to be able to keep hanging.

You can claim that it's a blockbuster, and you can also claim that if you define blockbuster rather narrowly then it's true, but then it's best to be real clear about that definition upfront. Because by any metric other than the conversion rate over its first six months, it's not a boon for Disney by any means. They botched the launch - everyone's buying it, but no one's happy about it. I'm not talking about social media complains or "political discourse", I'm talking about GSATS. There are intense operations behind the scenes to find the way to handle this before the scale tips too far out of their favor.

A qualified success doesn't do much for you if it brings with it an unqualified disaster.

 

[Aurorafan]

You're forgetting the "at what cost?" part of the equation.

Guest satisfaction for Genie+ is in hell. Disney's already announced changes to the program to begin accounting for this. They're not doing that because it's so successful, they're doing it because they fully recognize there's bleeding they have to stem.

The reputation of the resort is at stake. Thank heavens they're paying attention.

Depends on what changes they are making tho. I hope they will make things better.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

For who? Top Management?

The blame lies squarely at their greedy feet. Nowhere else.

Us.
But you have to read the rest of my post.

Americana culture is undergoing a major shift. = big feelings

It has been an American rite of passage to visit WDW. Disney World = Americana.

We - not you personally, not me personally - Americans/others collectively - want to direct those big feelings somewhere, so we choose easy targets. Getting mad at WDW is much easier than fixing big issues.

Both ends of the political spectrum, and many in the middle, have now taken aim at WDW.

Look at all the Americana as represented in American Adventure that is now being questioned, lots!, even the two narrators Mark Twain and Franklin!

The disenchantment directed towards WDW is more than just rising prices.

Yet many also crave a return to normalcy. We -again society- fear change. We also aren't ready to let go of all our heros.

 

[NickMaio]

We just need Katiebug to return and everything will return to normal!

She was patient zero.......

 

[GoneViral]

You can claim that it's a blockbuster, and you can also claim that if you define blockbuster rather narrowly then it's true, but then it's best to be real clear about that definition upfront. Because by any metric other than the conversion rate over its first six months, it's not a boon for Disney by any means. They botched the launch - everyone's buying it, but no one's happy about it. I'm not talking about social media complains or "political discourse", I'm talking about GSATS. There are intense operations behind the scenes to find the way to handle this before the scale tips too far out of their favor.

A qualified success doesn't do much for you if it brings with it an unqualified disaster.

So, I've read your reply entirely and have narrowed my response to this. The gist is that I'm defining blockbuster as blockbuster. The one problem Disney didn't expect to have with Disney Genie+ was it selling so well that it couldn't keep up with demand. That's my definition.

You're saying "any metric other than the conversion rate." In business, that's the metric matters more than the rest of the top five combined. You maintain nobody's happy about it. Do you have data that shows there aren't repeat buyers? If not, people definitely aren't unhappy about it. If they were, they'd stop giving it money. Disney's worried about the *opposite* this summer and just changed policy because of that.

And again, whenever the conversation comes up about Disney Genie+, any focus on WDW seemingly ignores that this service turns five in August. It's just called something else at Disneyland. So, I don't get the narrative that it's new and in its first six months and not a boon. It's a fully mature product/business concept.

More than anything in this entire conversation, I'm wondering why a vocal minority (possibly even majority) of people are so convinced that service isn't working well. Disney has normalized paying for shorter lines at WDW, and customers have shown an unexpectedly high willingness to do so. Is there any data that suggests otherwise? I'm genuinely asking and not for the first time. I know that some people here have a belief that's true, but I'm asking for something tangible.

 

[erasure fan1]

The truth is that Disney parks are doing extraordinarily well. As Disney fans, that should please us all.

It doesn't please me in the slightest. Why? Because it has only shown Disney they can continue to lower quality standards while raising cost with no pushback. They know they can do just about anything they want and people will still show up.