Pirates Adventureland???

[CarlHS]

Bring back Fire Mountain!

 

[KaliSplash]

I think Disney and Universal need to stop seeing themselves as competitors.

I assure you Disney thinks they are competitors. Everything Disney does is about making money. Everything.
The product they have chosen to 'sell' is Disney Magic. But that is just what it is, a product.
Everything Disney does is designed to get you onto their campus and make sure you never see anything else. The free bus service is designed to get you straight onto Disney property from the airport. Disney backed a light rail system and offered to build a huge station on its property, IF, the train followed the Greenway from the airport to the Disney property, bypassing certain other places (Universal and SeaWorld).
Disney's meal plan is designed to make sure you never need to go anywhere else to eat. Disney's explosion in hotels since the early 1980s is designed to make sure you don't have to use the myriad of hotels off-site.
Disney's Pleasure Island was designed to get people who left Disney at night and headed to Church Street Station in downtown Orlando.
Disney-MGM Studios was rushed when Universal decided to head to Florida. There are going to be dinosaur's in the new Islands of Adventure park, voila, the Animal Kingdom. You're playing putt-putt on U-S 192. We have four wonderful courses here now. You're playing some of Orlando's fine golf courses, we now have five courses.
etc.etc.etc.
Will Disney graciously concede in tourism media interviews there are many fine attractions in the Orlando area, of course they will. They can be gracious, they have the best. And they share some of the other park's concerns with labor supply, prices, etc. But the bottom line IS the bottom line.
I've never been to Universal and perhaps one day I will. But I assure you, Disney considers them competition. And that's not bad for us as consumers!

 

[sbkline]

But I assure you, Disney considers them competition. And that's not bad for us as consumers!

It is if they stoop to idiotic measures like the one rumored that the OP mentioned, just to compete with a company that poses no threat to them.

I understand what you are saying and perhaps you are right to a large degree. But I think Disney has achieved a level of superiority such that they don't need to feel threatened anytime some "distant second" comes up with a new idea. Even when Universal finishes this Harry Potter land, that's still not gonna change the fact that Disney has 40 square miles and they don't. It won't change the fact that Disney has enough to occupy guests for a week while they don't. So again, for Disney to compete with Universal is, IMO, like the football quarterback feeling the need to compete with the captain of the Chess club.

But on the other hand, I suppose the story of the tortoise and the hare could come into play here. The hare was so cocky in his advantage over the tortoise that he fooled around too much and the tortoise ended up winning. Perhaps this is what Disney is thinking.

Either way, thanks for actually replying to my post. It's quite frustrating to take the time to type out a post and then have it go totally ignored by everyone else, while they discuss the issue as if I had never posted a word. :brick:

 

[EPCOT Explorer]

Yeah,I think that any thing more than the ride and resturant would REALLY be overkill.

The movies are great and all but one ride is enough for them.

 

[JoeRhode4ever]

I think it's stupid.

I think Disney and Universal need to stop seeing themselves as competitors. They both need to open their eyes to the fact that Universal is not threat to Disney and probably never will be.

Now I'm not a Universal basher by any means. I visited once and enjoyed it and I'm not such a WDW fanboy geek that I have to bash Universal in order to prove to myself and everyone else that I am a true WDW fanatic.

I'm simply observing the fact that Universal is in a totaly seperate ballpark from Disney. Disney has 4 parks, two water parks, two mini-golf courses, I don't know how many resort hotels, over a hundred restaraunts and plenty of activities at their resorts, such as parasailing, camping, boating, etc. and Downtown Disney. There is plenty to do at WDW for a whole week without needing to leave property, but the same cannot be said for Universal.

Universal has two enjoyable theme parks, a nightime entertainment area similar to Downtown Disney and a couple hotels. That's it. Why Disney keeps feeling the need to compete with that, I have no idea. Until Universal acquires 40 square miles of land and begins building a comparable "World" of their own, Disney has nothing to worry about. Universal needs to accept the fact that it is more on the lines of Sea World than Disney. And Disney needs to get a grip and realize that Universal will have to do much, much more than this to be any kind of threat to them.

It's almost like the big stud quarterback of the high school football team feeling threatened by the scrawney captain of the chess team and trying to compete with him for the hottest cheerleader. There's just no competition necessary there.

Maybe that comparison is a little unfair, since I do think Universal is a good place and all. Just not even close to rivaling Disney. And the sooner they both figure that out, the better.

EXCELLENT POINT:sohappy: :sohappy: :sohappy: Thats the way i feel about it myself. I personally enjoy most of USFs rides the same as Disneys but have that feeling in the pit of my gut that... 'Universal is really wasting there time. There is no way they will ever beat Disney. Disney is even familiar to 3 year olds. Its dumb to even attempt to beat them. There real competitor is Sea World type parks".

 

[Animaniac93-98]

80% of Disney's Theme Park and Resorts (including the other 4 resorts around the world) profits come from Walt Disney World. Even a minor decline is the equivalent to a large sum of money.

As for Pirates I would not mind them too much. after all, ANYTHING is better than the current Tiki Room.

 

[sbkline]

Maybe others have researched the data much more than me and have come to an opposite conclusion, but it seems to me (without doing any research to back it up) that if Universal does suck any money away from Disney, it is probably the local day visitors more than anything. People who are driving in from Tampa, Miami, Jacksonville, etc. People who choose to take a day off work and go to Universal instead of Disney. In those cases, Disney is losing customers to Universal who would otherwise be paying 70 bucks or so for admission, 10 bucks for parking, and whatever else on food and souveniers.

On the other hand, those who are going to Disney for a week or so, and decide to drive off property and visit Universal aren't costing Disney as much money as the day visitors...at least the way I figure it, which admittedly may be flawed. But the way I see it, say someone is staying for 9 nights and they decide to visit Universal for one of those days. Either they get an 8 day pass instead of a 9 day, in which case it isn't costing Disney much, since the extra day at that point only costs a few bucks. Either that, or they buy the full 9 days anyway, planning on being out of Universal early enough to hit one of the Disney theme parks for supper and fireworks or something.

If they are on the Dining plan, they are paying for 9 nights regardless of how many days they spend on Disney property. And, of course, Disney is still getting their cash for the room that night regardless of where they spent the day.

Heck, even in my case, I am planning a longer vacation next year because I want to have enough time to visit Sea World, Busch Gardens and Universal. So, however much money Disney loses from me by me spending it at those places instead of Disney, they are still getting 185 bucks a night (or however much it will be in 2008 rates) for those extra nights on THEIR property so that I can do these other parks. And I guarantee you, that money outweighs the money that I spend at those three other parks instead of Disney, so WDW is STILL coming out ahead.

So add that to the other explanation I gave earlier of why Disney needs to quit trying to compete with everything Universal does. I really don't see them as much of a threat to WDW at all.

 

[CarlHS]

Why do you think Disney wants to pick you up at the airport? Without a car you won't go off and spend money somewhere else! The competition is fierce my friends.....

 

[sbkline]

Why do you think Disney wants to pick you up at the airport? Without a car you won't go off and spend money somewhere else! The competition is fierce my friends.....

For all the reasons I gave, I disagree that the competition is as "fierce" as you believe it to be. I think there is a fine line between healthy competion and plain ol' greed.

 

[Shaman]

So add that to the other explanation I gave earlier of why Disney needs to quit trying to compete with everything Universal does. I really don't see them as much of a threat to WDW at all.

Disney shouldn't ignore Universal. They lost out on Potter and Universal won big. Potter gives them a family-friendly extremely popular franchise. Forget being able to hold their own "Potter Days"...which will bring in tons of people...kids will WANT to go Universal. KIDS. That's the Magic Kingdom crowd. Disney should be somewhat concerned.

Competition is good for the fan. So in a way I'm happy that Uni got Potter. It also helps Disney use Universal as an experiment for that type of themed atmosphere. Will it get old quick? Or get better with the years?

I agree Disney and Universal are not on the same level in terms of what they have to offer, but each one wants SOMETHING the other has....Universal just added more to that with acquiring the rights for Potter.

:shrug:

 

[CarlHS]

Agreed!

Competition is a fact and it's not going to go away. It is the nature of the industry. Any park that adds something big and new gets bragging rights and gets the crowds.

I hope Potter draws away a ton of people so WDW gests off their duffs and starts fixing and expanding at the rate they should...

MK has had negative E-Ticket growth since 1982's Splash Mountain hit. Pretty pathetic...

 

[comics101]

Disney shouldn't ignore Universal. They lost out on Potter and Universal won big. Potter gives them a family-friendly extremely popular franchise. Forget being able to hold their own "Potter Days"...which will bring in tons of people...kids will WANT to go Universal. KIDS. That's the Magic Kingdom crowd. Disney should be somewhat concerned.

Competition is good for the fan. So in a way I'm happy that Uni got Potter. It also helps Disney use Universal as an experiment for that type of themed atmosphere. Will it get old quick? Or get better with the years?

I agree Disney and Universal are not on the same level in terms of what they have to offer, but each one wants SOMETHING the other has....Universal just added more to that with acquiring the rights for Potter.

:shrug:

I think everything you said about Potter and Uni is true, for the next 10-20 years. Now that Rowling is done with the books, the movies are the only thing to look foward to with the franchise, and in 3 years when movie seven is released, I think the franchise will die, slowly, but surely. I think it'll possibly last two maybe three more generations, but after that, It's going to be like any clasic novel, and kids won't even know what HP is. I also have a feeling Disney gave up HP, bc in the long run, PIXAR made more sense. I think Eisner was after HP after he lost PIXAR to prove to ppl Disney could still make deals with creative geniuses, and after he left, HP was sort of up in the air. Then Iger comes in and says, HP won't last long bc the last book is coming out this year, so he decides to go after PIXAR instead, and I think by now most of you know my feelings on that...

This is just an assumption, and could be completely wrong. If it is, it sure made a nice story didn't it??

 

[the-reason14]

Yea, I agree with the ones who said it will be overkill. And yes, I also agree that Disney views Universal as competition, as well as all the other theme/amusement parks and tourists spots in Orlando. Why? Because they are all virtually doing the same thing. They are in the theme park business, each of the different ones offer different things. I also agree that Disney has the edge over their competition, just for the simple fact of them being disney and they really have almost everything for every member of the family. That cant really be said at most of their competitors.

In response to more on topic, I think I pirate coaster or some kind of coaster in AL would be great, but chaning the whole land into pirateland, no I dont think that would be wise, give it about 10 years when the children of this decade have their own and have nothing to show or say but, "Oh yea, this use to be a very hot movie franchise back in my day" the new kids will be clueless. Leave the classics like Jungle Cruise and the treehouse, those are things that have surpassed the test of time.

 

[comics101]

I think it's stupid.

I think Disney and Universal need to stop seeing themselves as competitors. .

Disney will never not view tourists attractions outside of their property as compitition, simply bc Disney likes to be #1. I think of Pirateland as a welcome addition, if done right. I don't believe it should take up all of adventureland, just the area surrounding POTC. If Disney wants to go ahead and build the Black Pearl and a Rollercoaster behind Pirates, cool. That should be enough for a Pirateland, right?

 

[EPCOT.nut]

Well, Not to Universal Bash, but I just won tickets to Universal on a local radio station. I would not spend my DISNEY MONEY to go to Universal! :ROFLOL:
But since the admission is free, yay! Can't wait! I do wish at WDW you could buy the fastpass at the door like they have at Universal. I'd love the option to pay $20 more at the door to get fastpass at every ride.

 

[yoyoflamingo]

MK has had negative E-Ticket growth since 1982's Splash Mountain hit. Pretty pathetic...

I'm sure this is a typo, but Splash Mountain was 1992. Either way it's much too long for the MK to be without a new E ticket.

 

[sbkline]

Disney shouldn't ignore Universal. They lost out on Potter and Universal won big. Potter gives them a family-friendly extremely popular franchise. Forget being able to hold their own "Potter Days"...which will bring in tons of people...kids will WANT to go Universal. KIDS. That's the Magic Kingdom crowd. Disney should be somewhat concerned.

Like I said, I may very well be wrong...but it seems to me that most of these people will spend one of their vacation days visiting Universal while still coming back to sleep at their Disney resort hotel that night. And, speaking for myself, I am planning to leave a day early next year so that I can have an extra night in our WDW hotel so that we can have extra time to be able to go off property to these other theme parks. So, what dollars Disney loses in ticket sales, they more than gain back in the hotel.

Or look at it this way. What's the price difference between a 6 day pass and a 5 day pass? I can't remember myself, but I do know the difference gets smaller the more days you add. So let's say a family wants to do Universal one day so they make sure to stay an extra night in order to do so. But since they are doing Universal, perhaps they end up getting a 5 day pass instead of a 6 day pass. So, they are spending less on tickets, but they are spending alot more than that in getting the extra night at their resort. Either that, or they still pay for the extra day on their Disney ticket, planning to go back into the park later that night for supper and fireworks or something.

Either way, Universal isn't costing Disney very much money in this scenario. On the contrary, one might argue that Universal is helping Disney to make MORE money from this family...because if they didn't plan to go to Universal, they may stay one less night on property. At least that's how it's working out in my case. This year, we arrived on Monday and checked out on Monday. Next year, however, since I want to fit in Universal, Sea World and Busch Gardens (or at the very least, two of those three), I plan to check in Sunday and check out the following Monday. Staying at a moderate resort, that's around 200 bucks that Disney is getting from me to go to Universal. Now you could argue that if I wasn't doing those three parks, Disney could be making that much more money off me by me going into THEIR parks those days and spending money there instead, on souveniers, food, etc. But that's not necessarily the case. I already have 6 days planned in which I go into the theme parks, and that's totally enough for me. So if I wasn't doing those parks, I would probably just be staying a shorter amount of time, which again...would cost Disney about 200 bucks for each night that I'm not staying there.

So again, I'm not a marketing expert, so I may be totally offbase here. But from my POV, it seems that Disney should WANT their guests to do Universal, Sea World, etc...in hopes that they would stay an extra day or two to accomodate that as well as the amount of time they want to spend at Disney. Because most people probably don't want to mess with staying in a cheaper offsite hotel to do these other things and then relocate to Disney for the rest; they would probably rather just stay more time in their Disney resort hotel. But again...I'm not the one educated, trained and paid to make such business decisions, so my opinion could very well be flawed.

 

[SDav10495]

Disney can breathe easy for the time being as far as bringing in money--as sbkline said, HP is a big plus for Universal but I doubt it's going to leave much of a painful dent in Disney's pocket book.

What Disney should be more concerned about is the creative talent cropping up at competition like Universal. It may take decades, but if former Imagineers keep moving to Universal (and WDI gets staler and staler) then the Universal parks will have a visible edge...and that's when the Universal brand of theme parks could start taking the reins from Disney. Sounds almost impossible, but Disney isn't guaranteed its top spot forever...that's why it's so incredibly important that the recent restructuring of WDI really works and attracts the talent it needs to keep Disney on top. In recent years we've seen some less than stellar stuff...

 

[raven]

A good rule of thumb for rumors is that if you read it on Jim Hill's site it's probably inaccurate.

 

[CarlHS]

I think it's stupid.

I think Disney and Universal need to stop seeing themselves as competitors. They both need to open their eyes to the fact that Universal is not threat to Disney and probably never will be.

Now I'm not a Universal basher by any means. I visited once and enjoyed it and I'm not such a WDW fanboy geek that I have to bash Universal in order to prove to myself and everyone else that I am a true WDW fanatic.

I'm simply observing the fact that Universal is in a totaly seperate ballpark from Disney. Disney has 4 parks, two water parks, two mini-golf courses, I don't know how many resort hotels, over a hundred restaraunts and plenty of activities at their resorts, such as parasailing, camping, boating, etc. and Downtown Disney. There is plenty to do at WDW for a whole week without needing to leave property, but the same cannot be said for Universal.

Universal has two enjoyable theme parks, a nightime entertainment area similar to Downtown Disney and a couple hotels. That's it. Why Disney keeps feeling the need to compete with that, I have no idea. Until Universal acquires 40 square miles of land and begins building a comparable "World" of their own, Disney has nothing to worry about. Universal needs to accept the fact that it is more on the lines of Sea World than Disney. And Disney needs to get a grip and realize that Universal will have to do much, much more than this to be any kind of threat to them.

It's almost like the big stud quarterback of the high school football team feeling threatened by the scrawney captain of the chess team and trying to compete with him for the hottest cheerleader. There's just no competition necessary there.

Maybe that comparison is a little unfair, since I do think Universal is a good place and all. Just not even close to rivaling Disney. And the sooner they both figure that out, the better.

Disney would prefer to keep you all the days you're there. If you are buying food, souvineers, etc. That's one of the reasons for the meal plan. Don't think that everyone stays in a Disney hotel while visiting Universal or Tampa, most people don't.

Regardless, I like the competition, because is causes improvments at all the parks. Look how DL's grown with Universal, Knott's etc. keeping the competition up. WDW's had it to easy on the competition front.

I hope it brings a pirate mini land with the coaster and resturant...