Parent swap changes...

[Jrb1979]

I don't understand how you can say they were cheating? Disney allowed two extra guests with the pass...was I supposed to go on FOP by myself while my two older kids just stand there, when I had a pass to allow them to come on with me and experience the ride again?

Not everything is an abuse, just because you may have not done it.

Yes you are supposed to ride alone. When I look at how Universal does it, 1 adult waits with whichever child can't ride while the other rides with the other child. Then when they get off the first adult rides alone.

 

[Homer fan]

If a family has two adults, two older kids, and one younger, one older kid should ride with one adult; the other should ride with the other adult. The older kids shouldn’t ride twice. Waiting in line allows everyone to ride once. The only kids who get to double-dip are in families where only one child will ride.

Then they wouldn't have allowed the pass to add 2 people in addition to the adult. Disney understands its a theme park and people are there to have fun with other people, not alone and if a few kids throughout the day get a second ride on something, I don't think it's a bad thing.

 

[DonaldDoleWhip]

Then they wouldn't have allowed the pass to add 2 people in addition to the adult. Disney understands its a theme park and people are there to have fun with other people, not alone and if a few kids throughout the day get a second ride on something, I don't think it's a bad thing.

It's not 'abuse' in the sense that Disney allowed it, but there's also clear potential for it to have a cumulative impact on queue efficiency.

No different from the "come back any time" era of FP, which I enjoyed at the time, but can concede it's better off gone.

 

[ToTBellHop]

Then they wouldn't have allowed the pass to add 2 people in addition to the adult. Disney understands its a theme park and people are there to have fun with other people, not alone and if a few kids throughout the day get a second ride on something, I don't think it's a bad thing.

It’s a victim of social media. It had been a nice thing Disney allowed for those who knew. Then people start advertising it online, too many start doing it, and it’s an operational problem. Then other people got angry upon learning that your kids rode twice.

Like so many other nice things Disney USED to do until everyone started demanding equal treatment.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

It’s a victim of social media. It had been a nice thing Disney allowed for those who knew. Then people start advertising it online, too many start doing it, and it’s an operational problem. Then other people got angry upon learning that your kids rode twice.

Like so many other nice things Disney USED to do until everyone started demanding equal treatment.

Like towel animals.

Supposed to be a nice little surprise...until jack-knobs started demanding it and complaining if they didn't get one.

 

[DonaldDoleWhip]

Like towel animals.

Supposed to be a nice little surprise...until jack-knobs started demanding it and complaining if they didn't get one.

Or like the TTA as an attraction itself. Used to be a hidden gem you could always walk on, then it became a hit with the influencer crowd, started garnering consistent 25-30 minute waits, and eventually broke down for what felt like forever. Ironic that it became a victim of its own success.

That said, at least MK still has a PeopleMover. Poor DL...

 

[ImperfectPixie]

Or like the TTA as an attraction itself. Used to be a hidden gem you could always walk on, then it became a hit with the influencer crowd, started garnering consistent 25-30 minute waits, and eventually broke down for what felt like forever. Ironic that it became a victim of its own success.

That said, at least MK still has a PeopleMover. Poor DL...

Influencers need to go the way of the dodo.

 

[Homer fan]

It’s a victim of social media. It had been a nice thing Disney allowed for those who knew. Then people start advertising it online, too many start doing it, and it’s an operational problem. Then other people got angry upon learning that your kids rode twice.

Like so many other nice things Disney USED to do until everyone started demanding equal treatment.

Ok, that's fair. I do remember telling people about it and no one had a clue it existed....I guess I'm a victim of my own big mouth

 

[James Alucobond]

Then they wouldn't have allowed the pass to add 2 people in addition to the adult. Disney understands its a theme park and people are there to have fun with other people, not alone and if a few kids throughout the day get a second ride on something, I don't think it's a bad thing.

This was so that you had flexibility in how you split up your group. If you have more than two riding-age children, some can go with the first adult and some with the second. If you're a multigenerational family, you can pair grandparents with parents to help watch children and keep one another company.

It's bonkers to me that people think this was intended to reward two-parent families of a very specific size with free rides. Disney was certainly part of the problem inasmuch as they let it go and didn't publish or enforce any additional rules related to the system, but such a system would actively punish children with too many siblings or single parents relative to their peers living in different circumstances beyond their control. Doesn't seem very fair.

 

[Homer fan]

This was so that you had flexibility in how you split up your group. If you have more than two riding-age children, some can go with the first adult and some with the second. If you're a multigenerational family, you can pair grandparents with parents to help watch children and keep one another company.

It's bonkers to me that people think this was intended to reward two-parent families of a very specific size with free rides. Disney was certainly part of the problem inasmuch as they let it go and didn't publish or enforce any additional rules related to the system, but such a system would actively punish children with too many siblings or single parents relative to their peers living in different circumstances beyond their control. Doesn't seem very fair.

That's a bit dramatic...there are only a couple rides where this exists anyway. Whether both parents take one kid or two isn't changing anyone's day.

 

[James Alucobond]

That's a bit dramatic...there are only a couple rides where this exists anyway. Whether both parents take one kid or two isn't changing anyone's day.

Some of the very real outcomes of the system as it is being used today are as follows:

Suzie gets to ride twice in a row because she has a mom and dad who can both take her on the ride, but Amy can only ride once because she only has a mom.

Or …

James gets to ride twice in a row because his parents only had two children, but Mark can only ride once because his parents had four.

I’m not begrudging you for taking advantage of the system since Disney didn’t really seem to care or clarify their intent, but I think it’s easy to see why the system is unfair. If I were using the system in this way, my reaction to this news would be, “Whelp, party’s over.” Instead, we have an article claiming that they’re actively harming specific kinds of families.

 

[Homer fan]

Some of the very real outcomes of the system as it is being used today are as follows:

Suzie gets to ride twice in a row because she has a mom and dad who can both take her on the ride, but Amy can only ride once because she only has a mom.

Or …

James gets to ride twice in a row because his parents only had two children, but Mark can only ride once because his parents had four.

I’m not begrudging you for taking advantage of the system since Disney didn’t really seem to care or clarify their intent, but I think it’s easy to see why the system is unfair. If I were using the system in this way, my reaction to this news would be, “Whelp, party’s over.” Instead, we have an article claiming that they’re actively harming specific kinds of families.

Now we're punishing 2 parent households because their kids can go on a ride a second time?

Also, those kids don't know that others may be going twice, it's not really an issue.

 

[orky8]

This was so that you had flexibility in how you split up your group. If you have more than two riding-age children, some can go with the first adult and some with the second. If you're a multigenerational family, you can pair grandparents with parents to help watch children and keep one another company.

It's bonkers to me that people think this was intended to reward two-parent families of a very specific size with free rides. Disney was certainly part of the problem inasmuch as they let it go and didn't publish or enforce any additional rules related to the system, but such a system would actively punish children with too many siblings or single parents relative to their peers living in different circumstances beyond their control. Doesn't seem very fair.

It's bonkers to me that you think this was because wanted to accommodate the edge cases of 6 children families that couldn't figure out how they wanted to divy up child-watching responsibilities. 1+1 would have been perfectly sufficient to cover any such case. You never needed 1 + 2. Disney of yesteryear would have wanted children to get to ride with both parents. If a small number of children got to cut the line and ride twice, so be it. The Disney of yesteryear not only would not have cared, they designed a system with exactly that it mind. That Disney is gone and succomb to a society of everyone gets a trophy and this isn't fair because I want to ride twice too and this place isn't for families and children anyway.

It's also bonkers that folks think this is because of TikTok influencers. For the last 10 years, every guidebook has clearly spelled this intentional loophole out -- TouringPlans has a YouTube video from 2019 explaining the system and even stating that a child can ride twice (though only 4500 views, TP, so sorry). This is because Disney isn't going to give away more FPs than they need to when they soon can be quantified at $10-$20 a pop. Period.

And, for the record, YES, this new rule is imminently fair. But let's stop pretending the change is because Disney is suddenly (and conveniently) concerned about rampant "abuse" at the exact same time they are trying to figure out how to charge you for a fastpass because this system is still be subject to that exact same abuse. For a family of 4, the taller child still gets to ride twice. Now, for a family of 5, you just need to pick which child you like better. And for the people that will flat-out abuse rider swap by [REDACTED] and then use their rider swap -- they can still do that. There has been nothing changed here -- NOTHING -- to stop the abusers. The only thing that is changing, is how many extra slots will now be available as a paid FP option.

 

[DonaldDoleWhip]

It's bonkers to me that you think this was because wanted to accommodate the edge cases of 6 children families that couldn't figure out how they wanted to divy up child-watching responsibilities. 1+1 would have been perfectly sufficient to cover any such case. You never needed 1 + 2. Disney of yesteryear would have wanted children to get to ride with both parents. If a small number of children got to cut the line and ride twice, so be it. The Disney of yesteryear not only would not have cared, they designed a system with exactly that it mind. That Disney is gone and succomb to a society of everyone gets a trophy and this isn't fair because I want to ride twice too and this place isn't for families and children anyway.

Weird to turn this into an "everyone gets a trophy" case, when Disney is actually taking away trophies from visitors who never really earned one.

If you want your trophy, get in line before the next group or utilize whatever system Disney's planning next.

 

[James Alucobond]

Now we're punishing 2 parent households because their kids can go on a ride a second time?

Also, those kids don't know that others may be going twice, it's not really an issue.

I agree that the new system is less flexible and that the old one is preferable. I even listed some situations a few posts ago that are fair and no longer possible. Still, I disagree that the intent was ever to give extra consecutive rides to families of a specific size. That, in your estimation, the impact to others is relatively small or that their ignorance of your actions leaves them unaware of the unfairness does not make it fair. You are making the call that the benefit to your children outweighs the cost to others, and you may be right, but I still think it’s strange to have ever viewed this as an intentional entitlement rather than a loophole.

It's bonkers to me that you think this was because wanted to accommodate the edge cases of 6 children families that couldn't figure out how they wanted to divy up child-watching responsibilities. 1+1 would have been perfectly sufficient to cover any such case. You never needed 1 + 2. Disney of yesteryear would have wanted children to get to ride with both parents. If a small number of children got to cut the line and ride twice, so be it. The Disney of yesteryear not only would not have cared, they designed a system with exactly that it mind. That Disney is gone and succomb to a society of everyone gets a trophy and this isn't fair because I want to ride twice too and this place isn't for families and children anyway.

It's also bonkers that folks think this is because of TikTok influencers. For the last 10 years, every guidebook has clearly spelled this intentional loophole out -- TouringPlans has a YouTube video from 2019 explaining the system and even stating that a child can ride twice (though only 4500 views, TP, so sorry). This is because Disney isn't going to give away more FPs than they need to when they soon can be quantified at $10-$20 a pop. Period.

And, for the record, YES, this new rule is imminently fair. But let's stop pretending the change is because Disney is suddenly (and conveniently) concerned about rampant "abuse" at the exact same time they are trying to figure out how to charge you for a fastpass because this system is still be subject to that exact same abuse. For a family of 4, the taller child still gets to ride twice. Now, for a family of 5, you just need to pick which child you like better. And for the people that will flat-out abuse rider swap by [REDACTED] and then use their rider swap -- they can still do that. There has been nothing changed here -- NOTHING -- to stop the abusers. The only thing that is changing, is how many extra slots will now be available as a paid FP option.

I never said Disney’s motives in this were pure. In fact, I said the opposite. My only argument is that the article in the OP is absurd and suggests Disney is removing an intended benefit for specific kinds of families. If the article bemoaned the loss of flexibility in how you divide your party, I would not have commented.

Also, as the previous poster mentioned, the comparison to everyone getting a trophy is ludicrous.

 

[orky8]

Weird to turn this into an "everyone gets a trophy" case, when Disney is actually taking away trophies from visitors who never really earned one.

If you want your trophy, get in line before the next group or utilize whatever system Disney's planning next.

Oh, I'm sure all of us on these boards will get the real trophy by quickly figuring out the next "loophole." And, like I said, this "loophole" has not, in any way, been closed. But, what I meant was the mindset of "hey, that's not fair, what about me." As an example, as a middle-aged adult that has been on [INSERT RIDE] a dozen times, does it or should it really bother me that little Suzy and Tommy gets to ride twice, once with their mom and once with their dad? I feel like 20 years ago, Disney would have and DID establish a system precisely because they wanted that family to get to that but now has to kowtow to the lowest common denominator, which continues to rapidly sink. I didn't mean to trigger anyone with that comment. Apologies if I did.

 

[DonaldDoleWhip]

Oh, I'm sure all of us on these boards will get the real trophy by quickly figuring out the next "loophole." And, like I said, this "loophole" has not, in any way, been closed. But, what I meant was the mindset of "hey, that's not fair, what about me." As an example, as a middle-aged adult that has been on [INSERT RIDE] a dozen times, does it or should it really bother me that little Suzy and Tommy gets to ride twice, once with their mom and once with their dad? I feel like 20 years ago, Disney would have and DID establish a system precisely because they wanted that family to get to that but now has to kowtow to the lowest common denominator, which continues to rapidly sink. I didn't mean to trigger anyone with that comment. Apologies if I did.

I’ve literally never given this topic a second thought before today, and it’s not something that would have occurred to me that needed correcting.

The only frame of reference I have is the pre-FP+ elimination of “return any time”. Exact same discussion. It made me sad at the time, while others were rejoicing that the abuse/‘cheating’ would end.

Ultimately, the change made sense and helped FP operate more efficiently, and it seems like whatever Disney has in the works may be better for standby queues than the old FP/FP+ system. That’s why I’m giving them the benefit of the doubt here - there’s an operational reason that makes sense.

 

[orky8]

I’ve literally never given this topic a second thought before today, and it’s not something that would have occurred to me that needed correcting.

The only frame of reference I have is the pre-FP+ elimination of “return any time”. Exact same discussion. It made me sad at the time, while others were rejoicing that the abuse/‘cheating’ would end.

Ultimately, the change made sense and helped FP operate more efficiently, and it seems like whatever Disney has in the works may be better for standby queues than the old FP/FP+ system. That’s why I’m giving them the benefit of the doubt here - there’s an operational reason that makes sense.

Fair enough. And, like you, I never thought this was something that needed correcting. But I'm not willing to give them the benefit of the doubt anymore because this correction is incredibly and suspiciously timed with rumors of inbound paid fastpasses and so while there is an operational reason that this makes sense to me, that operational reason is that it allows for the sale of more FPs and this is just another example of Disney taking something was free Disney magic and putting a price tag on it.

 

[larryz]

Then they wouldn't have allowed the pass to add 2 people in addition to the adult. Disney understands its a theme park and people are there to have fun with other people, not alone and if a few kids throughout the day get a second ride on something, I don't think it's a bad thing.

Of course it's not a bad thing -- to you. Your kid gets to ride twice.

Every other kid in line that doesn't have an undersized sibling only gets to ride once.

 

[Homer fan]

Of course it's not a bad thing -- to you. Your kid gets to ride twice.

Every other kid in line that doesn't have an undersized sibling only gets to ride once.

But they don't know what they're missing. Even with this change, it's only one less kid per family, that participates in parent swap, that gets to ride. I don't think it's going to change your experience much.