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News Paradise Pier Becoming Pixar Pier

TROR

Well-Known Member
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Also go on Mission: Brake Zone so you can experience the trifecta of suck.
The Matterhorn's going to be closed when I go so I guess that's one way to get my yeti fix.
 

David2319

Well-Known Member
If you didn't like Mission Breakout, would you still feel it's an awesome park? Because for me, Hollywood Land is now bad, Paradise Pier is now bad, and half of Grizzly Peak is now not as good as it once was. The only things I personally really enjoy at DCA are Radiator Springs Racers, the area surrounding Grizzly River Run, and Buena Vista Street. That's it, though.

I view DCA's roster this way. There are six E-Tickets: Tower of Terror, Soarin' Over California, California Screamin', Toy Story Midway Mania, Radiator Springs Racers, and Grizzly River Run. Now of these six, only two are Disney quality, those two being Tower of Terror and Radiator Springs Racers. The other four are all very basic (Screamin' is a bare bones coaster, Soarin' is a movie, GRR is a rapids ride, and TSMM is a video game) and removing them wouldn't do huge damage to the park so long as their replacement was ok. For example, while Soarin' Around the World isn't as good as Soarin' over California, it's not terrible. So long as Tower of Terror and Radiator Springs Racers exist, changing up Screamin', Soarin', TSMM, or GRR isn't going to be a big deal. Now Incredicoaster is terrible but if Tower of Terror was still around, it wouldn't be a big deal because you still have Tower of Terror and RSR plus the other three. But now you don't have Tower of Terror, just Radiator Springs Racers because Mission Breakout is also terrible. So now we have an inferior version of Soarin', an ugly overlay of Screamin', a bad replacement for Tower of Terror, two basic rides, and a really good attraction in Radiator Springs Racers. That's simply not enough to really hold the park for me.
You should really say IMO. Mission: Breakout is actually a phenomenal ride— it just shouldn’t have replaced Tot and shouldn’t have gone in DCA, but the ride itself is fantastic. Of course that’s IMO, but objectively it’s a solid replacement.

And really? Disney ‘quality’. Go over to Disneyland and ride Mr. Toad. Awesome rides don’t need to be the biggest budget rides.

I love TSMM, most people do. It’s not the grandest ride in the world, but it fits in Paradise Pier, and it is FUN. It checks both of the main things for me: a good fitting theme and fun.

Pixar Pier was not a good choice, but it was more a waste of money and a failure of a theme than making me enjoy the park that much less as you are describing.

You should head on over to Hollywood Studios where only one of the four rides: Tot, by your standards, should even be there. I think it’s the best ride there but RNRC, TSMM, and Star Tours are also a ton of fun. Most people would argue that HWS is simply short on rides with only 4 (technically now more).
DCA has countless flat rides, beautiful areas, half a dozen e-tickets, a Broadway style musical, and some c-tickets, one of the best night shows ever made, and yet you are trying to tell me that the park sucks?

Boy, am I glad I am a happy enough person to be able to have fun at DCA. They’ve made some mistakes recently, and Hollywoodland has always been lacking, but the rides, the cast members, and the theme in some parts is gorgeous. It frustrates me when disney makes questionable choices, but if you refuse to have fun at DCA and have so much hate towards it, why do you even spend time on a forum dedicated to Disney? 15 years ago if we were having the same discussion obviously DCA sucked, but today? Or even a couple years ago? You must dislike Universal even more then.
 
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TROR

Well-Known Member
You should really say IMO. Mission: Breakout is actually a phenomenal ride— it just shouldn’t have replaced Tot and shouldn’t have gone in DCA, but the ride itself is fantastic. Of course that’s IMO, but objectively it’s a solid replacement.
Of course it's my opinion, but it's objectively garbage.

Really, the thing is ugly, lacks any narrative on ride, lacks atmosphere, and brilliance. You can say it's a fun ride, and you can even say it's a good ride, but is it a brilliant ride? No. Tower of Terror certainly was, however, thus making Mission Breakout inferior. I could definitely go on and on about the brilliance of Tower of Terror and the lack of it in Mission Breakout but this really isn't the place.

And really? Disney ‘quality’. Go over to Disneyland and ride Mr. Toad. Awesome rides don’t need to be the biggest budget rides.

I love TSMM, most people do. It’s not the grandest ride in the world, but it fits in Paradise Pier, and it is FUN. It checks both of the main things for me: a good fitting theme and fun.
Oh, absolutely it fits in Paradise Pier and it's absolutely fun. My point is just that it's a great supporting attraction but without other big draws like Tower of Terror or Radiator Springs Racers, it wouldn't be worth it. It's like imagining Tomorrowland with no Space Mountain and all you have is Star Tours. Star Tours is fine with Space Mountain, but without Space Mountain I'd never go to Tomorrowland just to ride Star Tours.

Pixar Pier was not a good choice, but it was more a waste of money and a failure of a theme than making me enjoy the park that much less as you are describing.

You should head on over to Hollywood Studios where only one of the four rides: Tot, by your standards, should even be there. I think it’s the best ride there but RNRC, TSMM, and Star Tours are also a ton of fun. Most people would argue that HWS is simply short on rides with only 4 (technically now more).
Tower of Terror can carry the park all by itself over there because of how grand it is. Without Tower of Terror there, I'd see no reason to visit DHS. RNRC, TSMM, and Star Tours are all skippable attractions that I would never trek out to DHS just to see, only if I was already in the park for Tower of Terror.

DCA has countless flat rides, beautiful areas, half a dozen e-tickets, a Broadway style musical, and some c-tickets, yet you are trying to tell me that the park sucks?
Countless flat rides isn't a selling point. But it certainly does have beautiful areas, a lot that really go under the radar. Other than Radiator Springs Racers, those half a dozen E-tickets aren't anything special. The Broadway style musical left in 2015. I haven't ridden The Little Mermaid yet but it looks cute.

Boy, am I glad I am a happy enough person to be able to have fun at DCA. They’ve made some mistakes recently, and Hollywoodland has always been lacking, but the rides, the cast members, and the theme in some parts is gorgeous.
Maybe I’m just a happy person.
I don't know what you're talking about, I love DCA. Throw me back two or three years and I could spend a whole day there. I was even considering it in June of 2016 before they announced Mission Breakout. That really killed any interest in DCA for me. It's such a plague on the park that's really ruined what was a great romantic history of California. There's so much potential with a California themed park that it angers me they're wasting it. I hope there's someone in ten, twenty, thirty years who went to DCA as a kid and is now a big shot at Disney and wants to give DCA its own identity. It's clear that management, Imagineers, and most fans don't have any respect for that park. Tom Staggs was our only hope.
 
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JohnyKaz2078

Well-Known Member
Tower of Terror can carry the park all by itself over there because of how grand it is. Without Tower of Terror there, I'd see no reason to visit DHS. RNRC, TSMM, and Star Tours are all skippable attractions that I would never trek out to DHS just to see, only if I was already in the park for Tower of Terror.

Countless flat rides isn't a selling point. But it certainly does have beautiful areas, a lot that really go under the radar. Other than Radiator Springs Racers, those half a dozen E-tickets aren't anything special. The Broadway style musical left in 2015. I haven't ridden The Little Mermaid yet but it looks cute.
I pretty much agree with everything else in your post but:
1) DHS now has 6 rides and this will have increased by 50% to 9 rides next year.
2) No. TOT is not the reason to go DHS. That's at least what 95% of the visitors think that, especially after the opening of Toy Story Land. And even before, there was pretty much nobody that wouldn't wanna ride Rock n' Rollercoaster, Toy Story Mania and Star Tours at least once. These are GOOD rides and they shouldn't be treated like some fillers to support ToT and have guests do something else other than riding it all the time. And the wait times speak for themselves.
3) Yes. Countless flat rides isn't a selling point. But they are doing a good job in drawing guests away from the headliners, especially if they are well done like Luigi's Rollickin Roadsters, Mater's Junkyard Jamboree and Filk's Flyers. And again the fact that one ride supports the whole park is WRONG. Who wouldn't recognize the brilliance of Soarin and Toy Story Mania and of course who wouldn't want to ride them. Mission Breakout is a different case but, objectively speaking, it's a good ride.
 

TROR

Well-Known Member
I pretty much agree with everything else in your post but:
1) DHS now has 6 rides and this will have increased by 50% to 9 rides next year.
And of those six rides, only Tower of Terror makes me want to visit. Maybe Mickey will but I haven't been sold on it yet. Galaxy's Edge is something I can get at Disneyland so it's not tempting me.

2) No. TOT is not the reason to go DHS. That's at least what 95% of the visitors think that, especially after the opening of Toy Story Land. And even before, there was pretty much nobody that wouldn't wanna ride Rock n' Rollercoaster, Toy Story Mania and Star Tours at least once. These are GOOD rides and they shouldn't be treated like some fillers to support ToT and have guests do something else other than riding it all the time. And the wait times speak for themselves.
If The Great Movie Ride was still there I would agree, but I've been on Toy Story Midway Mania and Star Tours. I don't care for the new Star Tours and Midway Mania's nothing brilliant. I love Aerosmith but if there was no Tower of Terror I would not trek all the way to DHS just for that one ride.

3) Yes. Countless flat rides isn't a selling point. But they are doing a good job in drawing guests away from the headliners, especially if they are well done like Luigi's Rollickin Roadsters, Mater's Junkyard Jamboree and Filk's Flyers. And again the fact that one ride supports the whole park is WRONG. Who wouldn't recognize the brilliance of Soarin and Toy Story Mania and of course who wouldn't want to ride them. Mission Breakout is a different case but, objectively speaking, it's a good ride.
Why do people keep doing this? Good is an opinion, thus subjective. Something can't be objectively good or bad. If you're just judging Mission Breakout on its thrill levels, then sure it's good. Of course it's good, Tower of Terror was good on that basis alone. But Tower of Terror was so much more. The slow reveal of everything, the detail, the atmosphere, the set pieces. Everything worked so well in that attraction. Mission Breakout is a bunch of screens and mindless noise.

The original Soarin' over California was definitely a good show, but it wasn't that grand. The music was great and so was the movie, but it's no Peter Pan's Flight. Toy Story Midway Mania, like I said, is nothing more than a video game that used to have a beautiful exterior. LEGOland and other amusement parks have the same thing. It's nothing special. I mean, even other places have copies of Soarin' that do the job just as well as Soarin' Around the World does. Incredicoaster's not good. Mission Breakout's not good. Grizzly River Run would be really good if they added wildlife animatronics. Radiator Springs Racers is the only big pull for me and I'm not willing to spend an entire day at DCA just for that. I wouldn't even parkhop if I wasn't gifted tickets.

The Broadway Style Musical was never there PERIOD.

No show at the Hyperion even comes close to a Broadway Show. I've seen better regional theatre than the Hyperion shows.
Talk about a controversial opinion! My goodness!

Anyways, Aladdin: A Musical Spectacular had better music than Hamilton. Don't @ me.
 
The Broadway Style Musical was never there PERIOD.

No show at the Hyperion even comes close to a Broadway Show. I've seen better regional theatre than the Hyperion shows.
Did you not see Aladdin? Its pretty darn close to many professional shows I've seen. Sure, the book isn't as complex because its based on a Disney cartoon and its an hour, but in terms of production value, design, and pacing the show was nearly flawless. I enjoyed it a lot more than the actual Broadway version of Aladdin. And much better than Disney's The Little Mermaid on Broadway.
 
Did you not see Aladdin? Its pretty darn close to many professional shows I've seen. Sure, the book isn't as complex because its based on a Disney cartoon and its an hour, but in terms of production value, design, and pacing the show was nearly flawless. I enjoyed it a lot more than the actual Broadway version of Aladdin. And much better than Disney's The Little Mermaid on Broadway.
I saw Frozen, never saw Aladdin (but I have watched it online).

The entire Aladdin show makes me cringe and its not good compared to the Broadway production. Sure you can enjoy it more, but that doesn't mean its better. The costumes, the sets, the new song, everything about it is just okay. Aladdin's sets at DCA was 2D cardboard cut outs. My high school makes better sets. Nothing wowing like Broadway, where everything is spectacular.

vs.

Neither one is bad, but you can obviously tell that one is far worse than the other.
 

JohnyKaz2078

Well-Known Member
And of those six rides, only Tower of Terror makes me want to visit. Maybe Mickey will but I haven't been sold on it yet. Galaxy's Edge is something I can get at Disneyland so it's not tempting me.

If The Great Movie Ride was still there I would agree, but I've been on Toy Story Midway Mania and Star Tours. I don't care for the new Star Tours and Midway Mania's nothing brilliant. I love Aerosmith but if there was no Tower of Terror I would not trek all the way to DHS just for that one ride.

Of course it's good, Tower of Terror was good on that basis alone. But Tower of Terror was so much more. The slow reveal of everything, the detail, the atmosphere, the set pieces. Everything worked so well in that attraction. Mission Breakout is a bunch of screens and mindless noise.

The original Soarin' over California was definitely a good show, but it wasn't that grand. The music was great and so was the movie, but it's no Peter Pan's Flight. Toy Story Midway Mania, like I said, is nothing more than a video game that used to have a beautiful exterior. LEGOland and other amusement parks have the same thing. It's nothing special. I mean, even other places have copies of Soarin' that do the job just as well as Soarin' Around the World does. Incredicoaster's not good. Mission Breakout's not good. Grizzly River Run would be really good if they added wildlife animatronics. Radiator Springs Racers is the only big pull for me and I'm not willing to spend an entire day at DCA just for that. I wouldn't even parkhop if I wasn't gifted tickets.
1) Tower of Terror is perfect everywhere it is or, in the case of DCA, it was. It was a fantastic ride that combined thrill with awesome story-telling and it's one of the best rides disney ever made. Mission Breakout is definitely inferior but nevertheless, it's a good ride despite it's peculiar location. And definitely not a set of screens.
2) You are talking from the perspective of someone who makes regular visits to DL and DCA. That's not the case though with 90% of guests that visit WDW. Most either come from the east or central US while others come from aboard like Canada and Latin America. And Disney is capitalizing on this.
3) TSM was quite extraordinary when it opened back in 2008.
4) So was Soarin. Many other theme parks copied Disney after that. The latest case is with Volentarium in Europa Park that takes you through a tour across Europe. The music is still good though but Peter Pan's Flight is a completely different case and they aren't comparable.
5) Incredicoaster is neither good nor bad. But Disney could have re-themed something else with this money (Goofy's Sky School is in a much more desperate need of replacement)
6) Grizzly River Run is good. Much better than Kali River Rapids. The animatronics would make it even better.
 
I saw Frozen, never saw Aladdin (but I have watched it online).

The entire Aladdin show makes me cringe and its not good compared to the Broadway production. Sure you can enjoy it more, but that doesn't mean its better. The costumes, the sets, the new song, everything about it is just okay. Aladdin's sets at DCA was 2D cardboard cut outs. My high school makes better sets. Nothing wowing like Broadway, where everything is spectacular.

vs.

Neither one is bad, but you can obviously tell that one is far worse than the other.
They weren't cardboard, they were pretty standard theatrical flats with professional painting. If your high school can pull off sets that quality, then I'm very surprised. The Broadway version has higher tech pieces with trackless technology, but they lack the style and fun of the DCA version. The Broadway version also suffers from a bloated script. In the end, the Broadway version was a huge disappointment to me and I much preferred the design and direction of the DCA version. Also, if you do theatre, you should understand that a personal camcorder recording of a stage production isn't a proper representation of the look/energy of the live production. Aladdin at DCA was a fantastic production, and seeing it on youtube doesn't give you an adequate representation of it.
 
They weren't cardboard, they were pretty standard theatrical flats with professional painting. If your high school can pull off sets that quality, then I'm very surprised. The Broadway version has higher tech pieces with trackless technology, but they lack the style and fun of the DCA version. The Broadway version also suffers from a bloated script. In the end, the Broadway version was a huge disappointment to me and I much preferred the design and direction of the DCA version. Also, if you do theatre, you should understand that a personal camcorder recording of a stage production isn't a proper representation of the look/energy of the live production. Aladdin at DCA was a fantastic production, and seeing it on youtube doesn't give you an adequate representation of it.
I’d agree. Watching Aladdin on Broadway after being a fan of the DCA was a huge letdown. Story felt overly bloated during the second act. Just didn’t have the heart that the shorter DCA version packed.
 
1) Tower of Terror is perfect everywhere it is or, in the case of DCA, it was. It was a fantastic ride that combined thrill with awesome story-telling and it's one of the best rides disney ever made. Mission Breakout is definitely inferior but nevertheless, it's a good ride despite it's peculiar location. And definitely not a set of screens.
2) You are talking from the perspective of someone who makes regular visits to DL and DCA. That's not the case though with 90% of guests that visit WDW. Most either come from the east or central US while others come from aboard like Canada and Latin America. And Disney is capitalizing on this.
3) TSM was quite extraordinary when it opened back in 2008.
4) So was Soarin. Many other theme parks copied Disney after that. The latest case is with Volentarium in Europa Park that takes you through a tour across Europe. The music is still good though but Peter Pan's Flight is a completely different case and they aren't comparable.
5) Incredicoaster is neither good nor bad. But Disney could have re-themed something else with this money (Goofy's Sky School is in a much more desperate need of replacement)
6) Grizzly River Run is good. Much better than Kali River Rapids. The animatronics would make it even better.
1. Mission BO is certainly a set of screens. There's two floors and one is only a screen without any real framing set pieces like Universal does and the other is a 5 second look at a hallway to see a small electric explosion represented on a screen. There's no real mixing of mediums or integration.
2. I went to WDW 2 years ago after not being to Disneyland or DCA in about 3-5 years. Even still, I only visited DHS for TOT and TGMR. We have Midway Mania and its okay, but their version didn't even have Mr Potato Head. I don't like Star Tours 2.0. RNR is a decent coaster, but I'd much rather ride USO's The Mummy if I'm looking for an enclosed coaster through blacklight archways.
3. Midway Mania was enjoyable, but I wouldn't call it extraordinary. Most people balked at initial videos and news of how bare the attraction was without any show scenes or AA's. Luckily, the ride is engaging on a cell phone game level, but I don't think anyone was really blown away by the attraction, it was just fun.
4. Not a fan of Soarin'. Soarin' perfectly represents DCA 1.0 to me. A great idea that was stripped down to bare bones. The sensation is wonderful, the cutting of the film, the exposed ride system, and the bland queue is not Disney quality. Luckily, like Midway Mania, the sensation is enjoyable enough to overlook the many flaws and minimal nature to the attraction.
5. I'd call Incredicoaster bad. Not terrible, but it took a 7/10 attraction and knocked it down to 4/10 for me. The static figures, poor looking "scenes" and lack of imagination turned a fun relaxing coaster into a badly done darkride on a coaster track.
6. Everything is better than Kali River Rapids. That is probably the worst rafting attraction I've been on. GRR isn't terrible, it's just not "Disney." It's nicely decorated, but there's no magic to it.
 

raven24

Well-Known Member
I saw Frozen, never saw Aladdin (but I have watched it online).

The entire Aladdin show makes me cringe and its not good compared to the Broadway production. Sure you can enjoy it more, but that doesn't mean its better. The costumes, the sets, the new song, everything about it is just okay. Aladdin's sets at DCA was 2D cardboard cut outs. My high school makes better sets. Nothing wowing like Broadway, where everything is spectacular.

vs.

Neither one is bad, but you can obviously tell that one is far worse than the other.
YouTube videos don’t count.
 
Aladdin was a great show, and I saw it each time I visited, but it was time for it to be switched out. It was tired. DLR isn't broadway and no show is good enough to stay indefinitely. I haven't seen the Frozen musical yet, but I absolutely support its right to be there. That was one element of DCA that was begging to be changed and I'm happy they followed through.
 

TROR

Well-Known Member
Aladdin was a great show, and I saw it each time I visited, but it was time for it to be switched out. It was tired. DLR isn't broadway and no show is good enough to stay indefinitely. I haven't seen the Frozen musical yet, but I absolutely support its right to be there. That was one element of DCA that was begging to be changed and I'm happy they followed through.
Aladdin was at DCA longer than Tower of Terror was.
 
I understand that YouTube videos don't count. I actually wouldn't be making this point unless I saw it, but I did see DCL's Aladdin, and while they are not identical, they sure are VERY VERY similar.

I'm not saying that you can't like Aladdin, and I'm not trying to convince you that Aladdin on broadway is better. I'm just saying that compared anything at the Hyperion to Broadway shows is not right because they are nothing alike. Broadway shows are giant productions with jaw dropping sets, elaborate costumes, and amazing choreography and staging.

Broadway sets are elaborate, and detailed. There sets always wow the audience. The theatrical flats in Hyperion Shows don't do that for me. I was not even close to wowed during Frozen. The actors in Frozen the Musical, while talented, aren't even close to Broadway actors.

The production is not bad, I did enjoy Frozen and Aladdin on DCL, all I'm saying is its nothing close to Broadway quality. If DCL Aladdin or Frozen at the Hyperion was placed on Broadway all you would hear from critics and audiences is how cheap it is and how unworthy it is of being on Broadway. That's what happened with Charlie and the Chocolate Factory. The Broadway sets used theatrical flats and it bombed for the reason of the sets, as well as other minor reasons like story choices.

Compare this:




to this:





Neither is necessarily bad, it's just obvious to know what the higher quality one is.
 
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