Norway Pavilion Frozen construction - Frozen Ever After ride (Part 2)

Jrn14

Well-Known Member
Is this the first time this has been done? How do they split the line? is it obvious that there are two sets ?

Sorry I don't really pay much attention to characters but back in 2007-09 when I worked there making sure characters were never in the same place was a top priority .
 

FerretAfros

Well-Known Member
Is this the first time this has been done? How do they split the line? is it obvious that there are two sets ?

Sorry I don't really pay much attention to characters but back in 2007-09 when I worked there making sure characters were never in the same place was a top priority .
Multiple rooms were first used as a proof of concept during the Disney Afternoon Avenue promotion at Disneyland in 1991, where guests could meet Baloo in his Tail Spin outfit in his "dressing room" under the Railroad, in what eventually became the entrance to Mickey's Toontown. The first permanent multi-room meet & greet was Mickey's house and movie barn, which opened with the rest of Toontown in 1993

This approach has become increasingly common in recent years, as WDW tries to make meet & greets actual "attractions" as part of the MyMagic+ program, despite their abysmal hourly capacity. Pretty much all of the indoor permanent M&G locations added in the last ~5 years have multiple rooms, in an attempt to increase the capacity from a few dozen guests per hour into the triple digits. Considering the huge volumes of manpower that these locations require to operate with characters, photographers, and queue management for very low hourly throughput, it's a wonder that WDW continues to put such an emphasis on them

Unless you're really paying attention, it's tough to tell exactly what's going on. If you know what to look for, it's easy to find a door that was unceremoniously shut right behind you or multiple streams of guests exiting, but it's unlikely the average parkgoer has any idea there's more than one character in the location
 

Coaster Lover

Well-Known Member
In the Parks
No
Belle and Ariel also have identical twins...

On our last trip, we went to see Ariel in her grotto. When you see Ariel, there is always one group visiting Ariel with another group standing right there waiting to be next. We were next up and were keeping our distance because we didn't want to be rude while the group in front of us was having their turn (and also because we didn't want to accidentally get in the way of any of the photos). But the cast member kept telling us to move in/move closer (very politely mind you, but still quite persistently). It wasn't until after the fact that I realized that they have two Ariels and (I'm guessing) they didn't want the next folks in line to see us waiting for one Ariel while they were whisked away towards the other Ariel... it's a creative solution to double capacity for sure...
 

JWG

Well-Known Member
We almost had a disasterous experience visiting Mickey and Minnie at Toon Town Fair. We were coming out of our meet and greet at the same time as someone else. Something was way off in timing as we left from seeing Mickey and Minnie and were suddenly able to look into a door and see another Mickey and Minnie :jawdrop:

All magic ruined for me... :D

Seriously, we were very lucky our daughter wasn't paying any attention what-so-ever.
 

JediMasterMatt

Well-Known Member
Considering the huge volumes of manpower that these locations require to operate with characters, photographers, and queue management for very low hourly throughput, it's a wonder that WDW continues to put such an emphasis on them

Let's see:
- Low cost to operate (while it seems like it may be expensive to run, the staffing needed is hardly different from any other real attraction AND you have virtually no maintenance to factor in)
- Low cost to construct (unless you take the Jay Rasulo approach to Meet-n-Gropes)
- They don't take up much space
- The are extremely popular (for whatever reasons)
- A resort desperate for more "attractions" to fill up more activities for guests to do
- A resort desperate for more "attractions" to gobble up FP+ reservations to steer people away from the "popular" attractions

Add all of that up and you end up with the current mess.

What's odd is that this the same resort that takes pride in going to Animal Kingdom to see critters in their natural habitat and that being a superior experience than going to your local zoo to see an animal in a cage continues to pull more and more of the Disney characters off the streets and putting them in a closet, just so they can have more stuff to get people line up for. This is one thing that really stands out as a difference between DLR and WDW. You still see characters wandering around all day long in Anaheim, just like you use to in Orlando. It's quite common to find the Fab Five wandering the parks without even a handler and a lot of the time, no photographer.

You mention capacity being poor for a M'n'G. It's not like the current MouseTrap in Orlando is designed to get you through the parks faster. It's designed to slow you down. Issuing you a FastPass for 8:00PM means you will still be in the park later and not someplace else. TDO doesn't care if waits for the M'n'G is slow so long as the people in line for them are there and not in line for other attractions.
 

Wikkler

Well-Known Member
You couldn't insert more quotes!?
You couldn't insert more quotes!?
You couldn't insert more quotes!?
You couldn't insert more quotes!?
You couldn't insert more quotes!?
You couldn't insert more quotes!?
You couldn't insert more quotes!?
You couldn't insert more quotes!?
If reading the news has taught me anything, you can never have enough quotes.
It also strikes me as odd that a ride that is going to take place during the timeline of the movie would be called "ever after."
No, it takes place after the movie. The ride will expand on the plot with such events as Elsa singing Let It Go... again. Elsa creating Marshmallow... again. Anna and Kristoff visiting the rock trolls... again...

Anna: Thanks for visiting Arendelle Norway with us!
Olaf: I hope to see you again!
Elsa: And always remember to Let It Go℠!
 

Cesar R M

Well-Known Member
If reading the news has taught me anything, you can never have enough quotes.

No, it takes place after the movie. The ride will expand on the plot with such events as Elsa singing Let It Go... again. Elsa creating Marshmallow... again. Anna and Kristoff visiting the rock trolls... again...
That last quote.. Will that be a banner in the exit of the bathrooms?
 

FerretAfros

Well-Known Member
Let's see:
- Low cost to operate (while it seems like it may be expensive to run, the staffing needed is hardly different from any other real attraction AND you have virtually no maintenance to factor in)
- Low cost to construct (unless you take the Jay Rasulo approach to Meet-n-Gropes)
- They don't take up much space
- The are extremely popular (for whatever reasons)
- A resort desperate for more "attractions" to fill up more activities for guests to do
- A resort desperate for more "attractions" to gobble up FP+ reservations to steer people away from the "popular" attractions

Add all of that up and you end up with the current mess.

What's odd is that this the same resort that takes pride in going to Animal Kingdom to see critters in their natural habitat and that being a superior experience than going to your local zoo to see an animal in a cage continues to pull more and more of the Disney characters off the streets and putting them in a closet, just so they can have more stuff to get people line up for. This is one thing that really stands out as a difference between DLR and WDW. You still see characters wandering around all day long in Anaheim, just like you use to in Orlando. It's quite common to find the Fab Five wandering the parks without even a handler and a lot of the time, no photographer.

You mention capacity being poor for a M'n'G. It's not like the current MouseTrap in Orlando is designed to get you through the parks faster. It's designed to slow you down. Issuing you a FastPass for 8:00PM means you will still be in the park later and not someplace else. TDO doesn't care if waits for the M'n'G is slow so long as the people in line for them are there and not in line for other attractions.
Yes, they're undeniably cheaper and easier to add, with a built-in popularity, but that savings seems to dry up pretty quickly when you start to think about the day-to-day operating costs. Consider the staffing for a location like Princess Fairy Tale Hall, with 2 rooms on each side:
  • 2 character performers per room (with 2 alternates, due to the 1:1 work/break schedule they have)
  • 2 photographers per room
  • 2 greeters/crowd control per side
Each side requires at least 8 cast members to operate, but is only able to process 360 guests per hour, or 1 cast member for every 45 guests

Compare that to a simple spinner attraction, which is known for being very low capacity but can process around 600 guests per hour while only using 1 or 2 CMs (plus an overnight mechanic, shared with other rides), or 1 CM for every 300+ guests

Now consider something a little more unique like the PeopleMover or Carousel of Progress, both of which operate with 2-3 cast members and are capable of processing over 3,000 guests per hour (and seem to get no maintenance attention), or 1 CM for every 1,500+ guests

In a resort where they're cutting any excess staffing possible and even reducing the park operating hours in an attempt to save money, why is there such continued emphasis on these experiences with inherently high overhead costs? The break-even point can't be that far down the road for a ride compared to a M&G, but they're so focused on short-term spending that they can't see the forest for the trees. How many real attraction additions have been skipped over because of the high operating cost for M&Gs, relative to the number of guests who are able to experience them each day?

And yes, waiting in line is a part of the theme park experience and is to be expected. But Disney knows that every moment you're waiting in line is time that you're not spending money; why else would they have implemented MM+ to get people out of lines and into shops and restaurants? And how many more bodies can they get into their parks each day to fill those shops and restaurants if the attractions are capable of processing meaningful numbers of guests?
 

mimitchi33

Well-Known Member
The Royal Sumerhaus will have several rooms, I believe 3? So that should keep the lines down, Anna and Elsa's lines haven't been as long at PFTH recently and they only have two rooms.
I think the lines aren't that long now because more people want to meet Joy and Sadness than Anna and Elsa. The queues for the former pair can be up to two and a half hours long, to the point where people sit in the queue!
That last quote.. Will that be a banner in the exit of the bathrooms?
I guess it's his prediction for what they'll say at the end of the ride.
 

jensenrick

Well-Known Member
The Royal Sumerhaus will have several rooms, I believe 3? So that should keep the lines down, Anna and Elsa's lines haven't been as long at PFTH recently and they only have two rooms.

That makes NO sense! They built a brand new building for this, but no FP line? Stupidity on their part!
 

brb1006

Well-Known Member
We almost had a disasterous experience visiting Mickey and Minnie at Toon Town Fair. We were coming out of our meet and greet at the same time as someone else. Something was way off in timing as we left from seeing Mickey and Minnie and were suddenly able to look into a door and see another Mickey and Minnie :jawdrop:

All magic ruined for me... :D

Seriously, we were very lucky our daughter wasn't paying any attention what-so-ever.
I remember leaving the Stars And Motor Cars Parade back in 2006 and I seen Sorcerer Mickey meet and greet building half opened and I seen Sorcerer Mickey and Mickey during the parade at the same time.
 

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
That makes NO sense! They built a brand new building for this, but no FP line? Stupidity on their part!
It is my sincere wish that they would do away with all FP's. It would make the overall experience a much more enjoyable one. Unless, of course, legalized line cutting is your source of enjoyment, then I guess it would be beneficial to keep it going.
 

YodaMan

Well-Known Member
That makes NO sense! They built a brand new building for this, but no FP line? Stupidity on their part!

Not really. They built Launch Bay with Fastpass lines for both character, but never turned them on and now they just awkwardly sit there. Believe it or not, wait times stay fairly manageable for meet and greets when Fastpass is eliminated.
 

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