Hrudey3032
Well-Known Member
Ah crap I must have been still stuck on the NBA rumors and thought of Sidney Moncrief. Good catch. 4am at work is kicking my butt.Sidney Moncrief, or Donte Moncrief?Good posting I agree!
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NFL 2014 Off-Season Discussion Thread
- Thread starter PUSH
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seahawk7
Well-Known Member
I was supposed to be at work myself but got called off so I can't sleep. Thats why I'm up still posting.
My top 10 QBs as of right now are this:
1. Aaron Rodgers
2. Tom Brady
3. Drew Brees
4. Peyton Manning
5. Philip Rivers
6. Ben Roethlisberger
7. Matt Ryan
8. Tony Romo
9. Cam Newton
10. Andrew Luck
Rodgers is in the prime of his career. He has great arm strength, amazing accuracy, great pocket presence and scrambling ability, and is an all around great player. I see no flaw in his game. Brady is the same, minus the scrambling ability. He is great at making players miss in the pocket, though. Brees is like Brady, only he makes more mistakes. Manning has great control over his offense, but his arm strength has noticeably decreased. Rivers is an underrated player IMO. He preformed well last season when a couple of his top target went down. Roethlisberger is also underrated IMO, and has been shadowed by the defense and running backs early in his career, but last year he proved he can lead the offense himself. Ryan is coming off a down year, but with Julio Jones coming back, I'll think he'll perform well (Especially with at least 9 games indoors). Romo is also underrated and gets unfair criticism. He's the only player on their team keeping them in playoff contention every year (although I think the Cowboys fall under 8-8 this year). Newton is a player on the rise and became more of a passer last season than he has been before. Plus he has the best ground game out of any QB in the league right now. Luck has the potential to be an Aaron Rodgers-esque player. He has the athleticism and arm to do so, but now he just has to do it.
seahawk7
Well-Known Member
I agree 100 % that Aaron Rodgers is no. !, has the best all around game, just a stellar player. He can run and scramble too, everyone giving all the credit to the RG3's and Kaepernick's while the ARod's and and Andrew Luck's are just as good as well. i would still take Tom Brady over Peyton Manning any day, he isn't a great athlete( he will say that himself) but he is just simply a guy who can play the game and a guy who knows how to win. Manning is flashy with his numbers and street credit, he is still one of the best in the game to ever play, and will be a first ballot Hall of Famer, but if he has a bad day or has to face a real tough defense he will completely crumble. Brees has the same problem as Manning, he has flashy numbers, but can crumble easily, I personally think he will leap Manning by next year though. This is were it gets trick for me though, at No. 5 I would say Roethlinsberger, only by a hair, these next few guys can leap in and out of each spot in my opinion. I say big Ben though because he is just a beast, great arm, accuracy and can brake tackles left and right. He has proven to be a winner and is the reason Pittsburgh contends for the playoffs every year. Next is Russel Wilson, he is a proven winner, has great accuracy, and is more than just a game manger. He hasn't had great targets like Andrew Luck in Indy, or Matt Ryan in Atlanta, he does more with less and has already won a SuperBowl. By the end of his career he will be up to par with Tom Brady and Aaron Rodgers. Luck is next, I also believe like Wilson that Luck will be a SuperBowl winner and top 3 QB within the next 3 years. If he rids of his interception woes he would be in the top 5. Phillip Rivers does not get the credit he deserves at all, rivers suffered the last few years because of the talent around him, if he had an offensive line he would be in the playoffs every year. Numbers 9 and 10 for me are Cam Newton, and Matt Ryan, Newton isn't as high as others would put him, simply because the others were better in my opinion. Like I said before numbers 5 to 10 can flip flop spaces very easily. Matt Ryan closes off my list because of his tough year last year. Ryan can jump back up if he can utilize julio Jones and Roddy White. Long story short, here is my list.
Aaron Rodgers
Tom Brady
Peyton Manning
Drew Brees
Ben Roethlinsberger
Russel Wilson
Andrew Luck
Phillip Rivers
Cam Newton
Matt Ryan
I think it's low, and he's definitely a top 5 player at the least. IMO he's the best player in the NFL, and I don't think that's a biased opinion.
seahawk7
Well-Known Member
Yeah I agree with you. I am a displaced Seahawk fan so I have to travel to Seattle to see them play. We get to go to one or two a year and we jumped at the chance to see them play the Packers. Much respect for your #12.
Hrudey3032
Well-Known Member
My top 10
1-Peyton Manning- Coming off a career threatening injury to put up the numbers he did last season is a testament to the preparation the guy puts in.The Super Bowl wasn't much his fault as the team just looked so unprepared and scared out there. I would have Rodgers here but he gets hurt more often and while Manning has the neck concerns he still has only missed 16 games in his entire career and that was the one season he couldn't play.Other than 1 lay missed in his career for a injury(Thanks Mark Rypien for the fumble on the handoff for that one play Manning was out!)
2-Aaron Rodgers-Killer instinct and heck of a cannon and just flat out is a great field general. I bet next season I will have him back at #1 no matter what Peyton does.
3-Tom Brady-He gets the best out of the talent around him. He is like Manning and can elevate a WR to Pro Bowl status just by slipping him a pass out of no where.
4-Drew Brees-My love for this guy goes back to his Purdue days(my favorite btw) when he led the Boilers to a Rose Bowl berth. This guy is shorter in stature but has the heart of a lion.
5-Matt Ryan-Yes he had a down year but the WR from the start were a mess. Roddy White was hobbled at the start and then Julio going down killed his numbers....and my fantasy team
6-Russell Wilson-As much as I feel Luck is more of a complete QB I can't shy away from the fact that this guy just wins. His numbers will never stick out and are average at best but he just knows when to make the right play.
7-Phillip Rivers-I hate this guy. He has been a Colts killer for years but what he did last season was a testament to how he does some amazing things. I hate the guy but he is fierce and feisty.
8-Ben Rothleisberger-I think Big Ben is on the downside of his future HOF career but 2 SB wins and elevating the lack of talent around him at times is amazing. Plays through some of the toughest injuries.
9-Andrew Luck-My boy! This guy might be the greatest to play the game when he is done. His first 2 seasons number wise are the best ever. I can only imagine what he and team could have done last season if Reggie Wayne #1WR, Dwayne Allen #1TE, Vick Ballard#1 RB, Ahmad Bradshaw #2RB and Donald Thomas starting OG had been healthy. These 5 guys were all out by week 8 and yet Luck still took this team to the playoffs with a horrible OL and a meager running attack and lets not forget that miraculous come from behind win against KC. Still have the SI cover of Luck dunking the football after the RB Brown fumbled and it went right to him.
#10-Cam Newton- I do not like this guy personally but what he did last season with the WR talent....or lack thereof was pretty amazing. I still think this guy only cares about himself and tries to think he is the only one able to do things but he has the talent no doubt.
I don't get the thing with people saying Rodgers is always injured. He's had one significant injury in his career, that being the broken collarbone obviously. Other than that he has missed one game because of a concussion. People say his concussion are a problem, but he has only had two in his career and hasn't had them in 3 years. They were likely also caused because of the helmet he wore, which has now been banned from the NFL because it's been deemed unsafe. Not picking on you, just don't understand how he gets viewed as a player who is constantly injured.
I also found it interesting that you said Roethlisberger will be a future Hall of Famer. Personally, I don't think he'll make it to Canton. Yes he's won two SBs, but he was never the greatest at his position for any period of time. I think the only HoF-worthy QBs in the NFL right now are Peyton Manning and Tom Brady. I think Rodgers will get there after a few more seasons, and I think he'll be viewed as one of the best players in NFL history. I think Drew Brees will go in sometime, too, but I don't think he's a first-ballot HoFer. Yes he puts up the stats, but he's also been more mistake-prone than Manning, Brady, or Rodgers.
Hrudey3032
Well-Known Member
My comment was he gets more hurt than Manning.Maybe he just seems injured more because he seems more dinged up at times. Peyton for as great as he is usually takes the sack by folding up and basically having to just be hand checked to be down where as Rodgers may try to stay in pocket until he gets hit. So you see A Rod up limping or hurting more. Maybe that is all I am thinking of.
As far as Big Ben he has put up some really good numbers with some lackluster talent at WR and has led his team to 3 Super Bowls(2 wins). I think Brees is first ballot too. He is a gunslinger and sometimes those guys make mistakes because they are going for the throat(lets not forget the coach may have called those plays too as that is Payton's MO) but I think by the end of his career it will show he was one of the very best to play the game. His Saints are in similar boat as my Colts in that the Defenses were never that great and cost them many games. Who can forget Marshawn Lynch shedding tacklers for like a 80 yard touchdown to beat the Saints in the NFC Wild Card game a few seasons ago. I believe there were 8 or 9 missed tackles on that play alone.
As far as Big Ben he has put up some really good numbers with some lackluster talent at WR and has led his team to 3 Super Bowls(2 wins). I think Brees is first ballot too. He is a gunslinger and sometimes those guys make mistakes because they are going for the throat(lets not forget the coach may have called those plays too as that is Payton's MO) but I think by the end of his career it will show he was one of the very best to play the game. His Saints are in similar boat as my Colts in that the Defenses were never that great and cost them many games. Who can forget Marshawn Lynch shedding tacklers for like a 80 yard touchdown to beat the Saints in the NFC Wild Card game a few seasons ago. I believe there were 8 or 9 missed tackles on that play alone.
flynnibus
Premium Member
The list is for 2013... not player potential
The guy missed 7 games... nearly half the season.
Actually the list is for the upcoming season.The list is for 2013... not player potential
flynnibus
Premium Member
No, it's '2014' because it is 2014 now
It's the players ranking everyone's performances - not trying to predict who will be what. You see it all through the list.. people who didn't perform last year (due to injury or play) drop. It's the 2014 list because they do it each year..
No, it's for the upcoming season - the 2014 season, which has not occurred yet. They say it on the post shows. However, the players are sometimes short-sighted and expect performances to be the same every year.No, it's '2014' because it is 2014 now
seahawk7
Well-Known Member
Regarding Big Ben becoming a HOFer, I think that is a stretch, I think it is possible for him to get a gold jacket but I think it is a stretch. He won't be first ballot, and might not even make it. Yes he won two super bowls and is one of the best in the game, but there is so only so many spots for great players. With so many great players who are trying to reach the HOF, those who are playing ( Larry Fitzgerald, Adrian Peterson, Peyton Manning, Troy Polomalu) and those who are retired who are still vying for a gold jacket (Ed Jones, Jerome Bettis, and Brett Favre,) it would become very tough for Big Ben to get in, especially by the time he retires since other players would be eligible.
I look at it like this. There are 3 QBs in the game today that would go in ahead of him (that are his age or older). Manning and Brady are for sure 1st ballot. Brees is potentially a 1st ballot. Then you have guys like you mentioned from other positions. Fitzgerald is potentially a HoFer, Peterson will for sure be one. Also in the discussion will be Polamalu, Champ Bailey, Robert Mathis, etc. Then there is a huge backlog of players who aren't in there already: Marvin Harrison, Jerome Bettis, Terrell Davis, Roger Craig, Tim Brown, Kevin Greene, John Lynch, Will Shields etc. Then the non-players you have to factor in: Jimmy Johnson, Don Coryell, Paul Tagliabue, Eddie Debartolo Jr, potentially Tom Coughlin. Only 5 players can go in each year (with an optional 2 senior candidates). The HoF is not about letting people in, it's about keeping people out. If everyone was let in, it wouldn't be the Hall of Fame.
seahawk7
Well-Known Member
No, it's for the upcoming season - the 2014 season, which has not occurred yet. They say it on the post shows. However, the players are sometimes short-sighted and expect performances to be the same every year.
I disagree, in the past shows they never distinctly said that the list was for next year, in fact they were arguing about this same subject. My opinion is that it should be the top 100 players of last year. Look at it this way, if you had a top 5 every year, great player who deserves to be on the list based on their production last year, but they retire, and don't play in the upcoming season, they should still show up on the list right? They shouldn't be kept off it just because they're retiring. Also look at a few years back, Peyton Manning was voted at No. 50, after the year he didn't play at all, if the list was based off of the merits of the upcoming season, he should be in the top 10 at least, but no he was voted at No. 50, because he didn't a play a single snap that year. Now this year with Aaron Rodgers, he was injured for nearly half the season, but did still come back to take GB to the playoffs. I think he should still be the 4th ranked QB, ahead of Russell Wilson, but he should be around 15 or 16 instead of 11. I think is a bit high for someone who unfortunately lost 7 games of the season.
Except the NFL Network "analysts" (I have trouble calling them that sometimes) have said on the Top 100 Reaction Show that it's intended to be a list for the upcoming season, and not one of last season.
As for the Manning thing, if it was a list for the previous season, then why was he on it at all? He didn't play a single snap, so he shouldn't have been on it at all. The injury he suffered was concerning to his future, which is why he wasn't voted into the top 10 and rather 50. He was projected to lose some quality in his play.