New theme park competition coming for WDW in Florida!

CaptainAmerica

Well-Known Member
No, but if you are looking at adding a beach portion to your Disney trip, this may sway people that way instead of Cocoa Beach or Sanibel. The beaches in Miami are some of the best in the country.
Again that's not the argument. The beaches being nice is a completely independent fact from whether they build this mall or not. Regardless, you're already working with a very small piece of the tourist population that 1) has a beach trip from Disney planned in the first place, 2) happens to stumble across this mall thing (not sure how they would), and 3) really REALLY cares about a mall enough to drive two+ extra hours over what it would take to get to Cocoa.

This really is a ridiculous argument. This will have absolutely NO impact on WDW whatsoever. It won't ever once be mentioned in the halls of TDO.
 

Disneyhead'71

Well-Known Member
Again that's not the argument. The beaches being nice is a completely independent fact from whether they build this mall or not. Regardless, you're already working with a very small piece of the tourist population that 1) has a beach trip from Disney planned in the first place, 2) happens to stumble across this mall thing (not sure how they would), and 3) really REALLY cares about a mall enough to drive two+ extra hours over what it would take to get to Cocoa.

This really is a ridiculous argument. This will have absolutely NO impact on WDW whatsoever. It won't ever once be mentioned in the halls of TDO.
My point is that if this would have any impact on WDW at all, it would be positive. Because this type of thing would be an add-on rather than "instead off".

And, do you know about the Mall of America and The West Edmonton Mall? I do. Why do I know about a mall in Edmonton? IDK, but I do. And I bet you do too. This probably won't be a secret covert operation stealthily build under the cover of darkness.
 
You do realize that Miami is already a world class tourist destination. There is quite a bit more to Miami than a future mall.

Miami Beach and South Beach are fantastic vacation destinations.
I know, but there seems to be different tourist groups. Like people who go to Florida for the theme parks vs. people who go to Florida to sightsee and visit the beaches. I realize that sometimes these two overlap I was generalizing a bit.
 

Donald Razorduck

Well-Known Member
I've known people to fly to Minny just to spend a weekend at MoA.

Yes, the same company has taken up the Xanadu cluster and trying to get American Dream done but you can only go fast as Jersey politics will let you plus the NFL teams hitches and moaned forever.

If built, this mall will seem to have a good sized Merlin presence With a Lego Discovery Center. Each new one seems to grow.

Example of MOA amusment park, Nick Universe, in Minny.

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This isn't a threat to Disney World. No. Now what if my family is planning a Cruise, this might sway me to sail out of Miami instead of Canaveral as this would be a neat place to do before or after it. The nice feature is it's weather proof.
What would Miami get? A no IP based park like Edmonton, Nick like Minny or DreamWorks that is suppose to define the indoor ride area of American Dream.
 

Progress.City

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
All Aboard Florida is far from certain at this point. At the very least, don't hold your breath.



Is that why so many intercity trains run sold-out (or nearly so) day after day, week after week?

Where in the world did you ever get the idea Americans dislike trains, anyway?
The section from Miami to West Palm Beach is 100% certain and construction of the stations and tracks is ongoing. The remaining sections are on hold, but that hold will be lifted soon. The Treasure Cost is trying to litigate to derail the project because they are going through a "not in my back yard" syndrome. These types of things are simply annoyances that are dealt with but annoyances nonetheless.
 

Progress.City

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Here's a rundown of all the projects being developed right now for Downtown Miami. Keep in mind, this is just the downtown area. A whole lot more is going on in the general metro area!

 

NowInc

Well-Known Member
As someone who works (and used to live) in Miami, I can say that pretty much everyone I come in contact with (quite a few) can't wait to get OUT of the city. The corrupt government, the bad traffic (that no new train can fix, the Tri-Rail isn't making a dent), as well as the cost of living are all issues that only get worse. Yes, there is south beach, which has also changed dramatically in the past few years to be beyond the affordability of the average tourist. The real "Gem" of the county is in fact Zoo Miami, but thats quite a drive from where most people visit in the area. To its credit, the city has drastically reduced the crime rates in the past decade, but its still FAR from safe after dark.

There is of course Miami Pride, every town has people who are proud of it, but there are a lot whom aren't fans of what Miami has become. If it was such an up and coming place to live, there wouldn't be half empty high rises in downtown.
 

NowInc

Well-Known Member
Here's a rundown of all the projects being developed right now for Downtown Miami. Keep in mind, this is just the downtown area. A whole lot more is going on in the general metro area!



I can tell you for a fact that a lot of those projects are now indefinitely "on hold" due to strong opposition of surrounding residents. After the new Marlins Stadium debacle, a lot of these plans are being re-evaluated.
 

Progress.City

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
I can tell you for a fact that a lot of those projects are now indefinitely "on hold" due to strong opposition of surrounding residents. After the new Marlins Stadium debacle, a lot of these plans are being re-evaluated.
The AAF station development, Miami World Center, convention center, and many others have broken ground and are busy construction sites. Some others are further along. The only one that is held up is Miami World Resorts.

And these are private developers and land owners and has nothing to do with government, other than the usual permit approval process.
 

Progress.City

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
As someone who works (and used to live) in Miami, I can say that pretty much everyone I come in contact with (quite a few) can't wait to get OUT of the city. The corrupt government, the bad traffic (that no new train can fix, the Tri-Rail isn't making a dent), as well as the cost of living are all issues that only get worse. Yes, there is south beach, which has also changed dramatically in the past few years to be beyond the affordability of the average tourist. The real "Gem" of the county is in fact Zoo Miami, but thats quite a drive from where most people visit in the area. To its credit, the city has drastically reduced the crime rates in the past decade, but its still FAR from safe after dark.

There is of course Miami Pride, every town has people who are proud of it, but there are a lot whom aren't fans of what Miami has become. If it was such an up and coming place to live, there wouldn't be half empty high rises in downtown.
Miami has its good and bad. I live in West Palm Beach, which is a 45 minute drive from I-95. I guess it's better to visit Miami than to live there; but, if you can afford to live there, Miami is truly awesome. For me, I'm happy to just crawl aboard Tri-Rail from its WPB station, leaving my car behind, and taking it to Metrorail and Metromover to get around. The Metromover is the most complete automated people mover system in an urban environment, with interconnecting loops and a separate system connecting Metrorail to the airport. All the new developments are being built on Metromover stations.
 
This just seems like a bad idea. There are already so many malls in Miami-Dade/Broward that are seemingly struggling to stay open. Where was I, I went to Sunrise Mall a couple of weeks ago in Miami Dade and half of it has seemingly closed down in the two and a half years since I was last there. No idea how that Barnes and Nobles has managed to outlast some of the stores. At least the Seaport tunnel and the Airport direct connection to the highways was funded by the $2-4 Billion dollars in stimulus money and not local money.

The Metrorail rail and all these things never make money and with the ever growing lines here to there and everywhere, it just going to end up costing more and more to keep operational. I think I read its operating deficit is $100 million a year. Maybe it is less now. When the original line open, they expected over 200,000 riders a day, and I think we get less than 20,000 now.

The Miami Zoo is also getting rid of their monorail as soon as major repairs are needed.
 

NowInc

Well-Known Member
The AAF station development, Miami World Center, convention center, and many others have broken ground and are busy construction sites. Some others are further along. The only one that is held up is Miami World Resorts.

And these are private developers and land owners and has nothing to do with government, other than the usual permit approval process.


The casino, The tower in bayside (one bafront center), and a few others are in a halt due to various reasons. Private development makes no difference on the ability to build, red tape is red tape.

Trust me, I would love to see Miami clean up and become a better destination, but it has a long battle ahead of it. The reality of it is the Miami advertised on TV and in brochures only showcase a very small part of the EXTREAMLY large city. A great example (and this is only one) of what I mean is in regards to the downtown courthouse district (Flagler). It has gotten so bad with crime that judges are no longer allowed to keep a jury past 6pm (NO exceptions) as people (in one instance a Judges wife) keep getting mugged walking the 2 blocks to the parking garages once the sun goes down. Flagler, as you may know, is designated as historic (in particular the Miami Dade County Courthouse). They are unable to keep the crime levels manageable there, and its supposed to be a major sightseeing location (and honestly in my opinion that building has one of the most impressive histories in the country). Orlando has one of the highest crime rates in the country, yes...but that is mostly in their downtown area which is far from the tourist spots. Miami's crime is unfortunately right in the same areas as most of these projects.

Back onto the original topic:

IF this mall gets built (which from what I've come to understand its being opposed by the builders of all the major malls of the south florida region), it still will have the issue of location. Miami is MASSIVE in size. As it is right now, the public transportation wouldn't work in reaching its proposed location, and the "locals" will only travel so far. Believe it or not, its pretty much well known that Broward/Palm Beach residents seldom want to travel south (outside of work commutes), where Miami residents will always venture north. This is mostly due to the highway systems (which are currently a disaster). Traffic (the 10 mile stretch between the golden glades and downtown via 95 takes approx an hour every day on most weekdays), tolls (which as of the last year are all automated so unknowing travelers end up paying without realizing), as well as the CONDITION of the roads are widely noticed.

For those curious as to why the other mall builders are trying to avoid this, its pretty obvious. Almost all of the malls in the area have recently (as in within the last 10 years) gotten major investments for expansion (especially Aventura which has quadrupled in size since it first opened). The problem is that (and was mentioned in another post on this thread) is that its hard to keep tenants as it is now. A major new outlet will pretty much murder all others, and thus eliminate more jobs/economy than the new one would create. At least thats the argument.

To make this all interesting, lets not forget that Warner Brothers supposedly got their green light to build a theme park in Miami as well. THAT, would be the bigger concern.
 

shernernum

Well-Known Member
So basically this thread was a promotional ploy to talk about the posters love for Miami but because the miscellaneous threads don't get the traffic the OP came up with a self-admittedly bogus connection to WDW so that it could go in a higher traffic place in the forum...yep...can we move this now.
 

Siren

Well-Known Member
Wow, I totally posted this story here first -- except it didn't see the light of day, probably because I added the controversy stemming from this development!

Anyway, the proposed theme park was to be adjacent to the Miami Zoo and called Miami Wilds, sponsored by 20th Century Fox -- and themed after Ice Age. They are now, supposedly, trying to acquire 240 acres of Coast Guard land.

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This is the first time I have heard of the mall concept. It's okay I guess but a huge downgrade from what was initially proposed.
 

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