correcaminos
Well-Known Member
You don't want to hear my thoughts on EpcotWait... so you're saying that if someone has been going to a place for 40 years, they may know a thing or two about that particular place?
*Heads over to every Epcot thread*
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News New Polynesian Resort DVC villas building to open 2024
- Thread starter wdwmagic
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Epcot82Guy
Well-Known Member
A major issue is that Disney is a nostalgia company. And, (personal opinion) leadership is coming from a branding/merchandise and film perspective - not a hospitality perspective. The issue there is replacement. When you create a remake of the Lion King, the original Lion King still exists. When you replace Festival of the Lion King with a new show, the old show no longer exists. That's an important difference when creating things. That means you need to (or at least should) consider a broader audience and make the smallest change possible where there is actual nostalgia, focusing on areas where nostalgia is lower. Plus, you have to really understand the return on investment of the given change.
If you have an audience that wants change (which is a lot), often they are satisfied with any change. The main goal is seeing something fresh, something new. For a creative company, that's great because it lets them focus the change on the nostalgia crowd. Preserve what they want most (even if it's a new version of it) and then change other things - satisfying the "change crowd".
I would argue many of Disney's decisions in the last 5 years are intentionally against large portions of their nostalgia crowds, focusing on a very specific brand-loving crowd. So, it leaves everyone else out of the cold. And, those who like change get vilified - because you represent the audience that is destroying our enjoyment and out nostalgia. I'm not saying that's fair. But, it's unfortunately the reality Disney has created by dividing its fan base like this. If they focused more on speaking to as much of their base as possible, the complaints would be present but lower. But, "Disney is a business..."
(EDIT: That last line was not directed at you, @helenabear! Rather those that say Disney shouldn't bother focusing on any of the naysayers since it's just a business who should maximize immediate profits.
)
If you have an audience that wants change (which is a lot), often they are satisfied with any change. The main goal is seeing something fresh, something new. For a creative company, that's great because it lets them focus the change on the nostalgia crowd. Preserve what they want most (even if it's a new version of it) and then change other things - satisfying the "change crowd".
I would argue many of Disney's decisions in the last 5 years are intentionally against large portions of their nostalgia crowds, focusing on a very specific brand-loving crowd. So, it leaves everyone else out of the cold. And, those who like change get vilified - because you represent the audience that is destroying our enjoyment and out nostalgia. I'm not saying that's fair. But, it's unfortunately the reality Disney has created by dividing its fan base like this. If they focused more on speaking to as much of their base as possible, the complaints would be present but lower. But, "Disney is a business..."
(EDIT: That last line was not directed at you, @helenabear! Rather those that say Disney shouldn't bother focusing on any of the naysayers since it's just a business who should maximize immediate profits.
)
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correcaminos
Well-Known Member
Lol I didn't think it was, but thank you!A major issue is that Disney is a nostalgia company. And, (personal opinion) leadership is coming from a branding/merchandise and film perspective - not a hospitality perspective. The issue there is replacement. When you create a remake of the Lion King, the original Lion King still exists. When you replace Festival of the Lion King with a new show, the old show no longer exists. That's an important difference when creating things. That means you need to (or at least should) consider a broader audience and make the smallest change possible where there is actual nostalgia, focusing on areas where nostalgia is lower. Plus, you have to really understand the return on investment of the given change.
If you have an audience that wants change (which is a lot), often they are satisfied with any change. The main goal is seeing something fresh, something new. For a creative company, that's great because it lets them focus the change on the nostalgia crowd. Preserve what they want most (even if it's a new version of it) and then change other things - satisfying the "change crowd".
I would argue many of Disney's decisions in the last 5 years are intentionally against large portions of their nostalgia crowds, focusing on a very specific brand-loving crowd. So, it leaves everyone else out of the cold. And, those who like change get vilified - because you represent the audience that is destroying our enjoyment and out nostalgia. I'm not saying that's fair. But, it's unfortunately the reality Disney has created by dividing its fan base like this. If they focused more on speaking to as much of their base as possible, the complaints would be present but lower. But, "Disney is a business..."
(EDIT: That last line was not directed at you, @helenabear! Rather those that say Disney shouldn't bother focusing on any of the naysayers since it's just a business who should maximize immediate profits.
I do think for the masses you cannot please them all. Like the IP infusion drives me batty. I love subtle. Others eat it up. Everyone cannot be happy all the time.
Epcot82Guy
Well-Known Member
Agreed. Though they are making a lot of changes for the sake of change. It seems like there may be more ego and spreadsheets involved vs authentic calls of the masses. My issue is that giving people what the say they want has rarely created nostalgia. You have to go for something greater.
Bocabear
Well-Known Member
NOBODY wants the Polynesian to look like a Marriott...There are ways of refreshing the design without ruining the aesthetic and idiom of a resort... It feels like they no longer have the talent pool that can pull it off.
I don't think they receive tons of letters asking them to remove theme from the hotels and please make everything more generic... To think that is what the crowds are asking for is ridiculous... Theme, Design, and Charm are the things that made the company...and why they have been able to charge luxury prices for a "nice" room with a little theme...
Remove the theme, and what is so special aside from location?
I don't think they receive tons of letters asking them to remove theme from the hotels and please make everything more generic... To think that is what the crowds are asking for is ridiculous... Theme, Design, and Charm are the things that made the company...and why they have been able to charge luxury prices for a "nice" room with a little theme...
Remove the theme, and what is so special aside from location?
Epcot82Guy
Well-Known Member
This is not true!! It just so happens all the people who want it are currently receiving paychecks from TWDC.
"If they don't see Moana and Stitch everywhere at Poly, how else will the consumers know they are at WDW?" - TDO management
I kid, but that seems to be the approach that has been taken more often than not in recent years - Consumers are stupid, so we need to beat them over the head with "Disney!!!".
I kid, but that seems to be the approach that has been taken more often than not in recent years - Consumers are stupid, so we need to beat them over the head with "Disney!!!".
correcaminos
Well-Known Member
This is why I am grateful the DVC rooms were not plastered with Stitch. Subtle is appreciated by me. While they are doing it more to resorts, they seem to mostly be leaving DVC out of it
Epcot82Guy
Well-Known Member
The problem I see is not that they think all consumers are stupid. Rather, there is a segment of the population that fits that. And, they are focusing all efforts on that segment - which they deem as the most valuable from an ROI perspective.
Right. Focus is on the lowest common denominator, who provide the highest ROI. Bottom line MAGIC!!!
Beacon Joe
Well-Known Member
LOL WUT?
Minthorne
Well-Known Member
My first poly trip was 1979. It is my favorite resort. I miss the old lobby, but I understand why it changed and appreciate the new lobby. I am DVC so haven't been in a regular Poly hotel room since 2013, but the new room with Moana look good to me in pictures. For me the overall feel of the resort has become more frenetic. But that is true of the entire WDW beyond Poly. It's not the resort it used to be. Everything changes (except my underwear - why mess with a winner!).
The new Poly DVC tower, I'll reserve my judgment. I am not a fan of the Riviera Resort.
As for the walking path - I am definitely one of those 10 that walk it. I only like resorts that I can walk to other areas from, Boardwalk being my other favorite.
The new Poly DVC tower, I'll reserve my judgment. I am not a fan of the Riviera Resort.
As for the walking path - I am definitely one of those 10 that walk it. I only like resorts that I can walk to other areas from, Boardwalk being my other favorite.
CaptainAmerica
Premium Member
I loathe the exterior and the grounds of Riviera. I adore the lobby, the rooms, and the Skyliner. So I'm very conflicted.
Though I'll say that the Gran Destino Tower lobby looks an awful lot like Riviera with a splash of color added, and it's 1/3 the price.
correcaminos
Well-Known Member
I dislike the amount of concrete around Riviera. That's my biggest issue there. The exterior I'm ambivalent to. The rooms are well done, though not my vibe.
Like you, I enjoy easy access to other locations. Preferably by foot but boat will do.
correcaminos
Well-Known Member
We do not know yet. I'm waiting for the official answer myself on that. Do I sell or just add on once I see point charts.
Bocabear
Well-Known Member
I thought the room we had was very nice...3 Bedroom Grand Suite... It was huge and well appointed and very new... It looked like a very expensive suite at any large hotel chainThere was absolutely nothing that would have told me that is was about the Riviera...it was just a very nice modern hotel suite... and it was very nice...
It was also a hotel with absolutely no discernable theme.
That included the grounds and lobby...if the theme as current elegant modern hotel, then they nailed it.. And maybe that is enough for some... I grew up with Disney being the leader in the themed entertainment industry... They created the market, then in the last decade have lost their way and no longer care...
zapple
Well-Known Member
They haven’t announced if it will be a new association or an addition to the current one, like VGF. If it’s a new association, resale points bought since 2019 won’t work at the new building, and you won’t get 11 month booking at the new building if you own at the original Poly. If it’s the same association, you have home resort priority for all the buildings.
CaptainAmerica
Premium Member
Sadly, Disney has gone where the market has gone. They can charge double for Riviera as they can for Animal Kingdom Lodge.
UNCgolf
Well-Known Member
I wouldn't even say they nailed this -- at least not on the exterior. The exterior looks incredibly cheap. The interior is a different story.