Rumor New Monorails Coming Soon?

[s8film40]

Correct, which new trains would not necessarily fix, since they are confined to the same track that the current ones do. A different system is the real answer. Or a third method of transport from MK to TTC. A single Skyliner route would be interesting. No need for it to go the resorts, just one line meant to help move the crowds at open and close.

The whole point of getting new trains is to decrease the likelihood of breakdowns. This is what new trains will/should fix. Even if they reduced breakdowns by 80% which would be pretty poor results for new trains this would make a huge difference.

I don’t know the numbers, but the Skyliner seems like it has very low throughput. I question wether it will even hold up where it’s been installed right now, much less trying to transport the large numbers coming out of the MK.

 

[Kamikaze]

The whole point of getting new trains is to decrease the likelihood of breakdowns. This is what new trains will/should fix. Even if they reduced breakdowns by 80% which would be pretty poor results for new trains this would make a huge difference.

This supposes that the causes for most (80%) of the breakdowns are in the trains themselves and not something with the system. Unless they fix the system at the same time.

I don’t know the numbers, but the Skyliner seems like it has very low throughput. I question wether it will even hold up where it’s been installed right now, much less trying to transport the large numbers coming out of the MK.

The Skyliner hourly capacity crushes (current) monorail capacity. It isn't even close. I did the math at one point in the Skyliner thread but it would be impossible to find now.

 

[Kamikaze]

Highly disagree, The monorail is one of the biggest “show” pieces at WDW. The entire design and premise of The Magic Kingdom relies on the monorail for exposition even before you get to the gate.

The monorail has done its job well for its entirely at WDW, If the monorail can handle the stresses it handles now, then there’s no reason for the monorail to suddenly fail. Upgrade it and maintain it.

Just because its 'show' doesn't mean its efficient or even the correct solution. Especially if crowds continue to grow. It has very little capacity to expand to meet demand. The only (one time) solution they have is to expand the stations. Or remove seating.

 

[s8film40]

This supposes that the causes for most (80%) of the breakdowns are in the trains themselves and not something with the system. Unless they fix the system at the same time.

Breakdowns currently are probably 95% or more train issues. Power and system issues are extremely rare.

The Skyliner hourly capacity crushes (current) monorail capacity. It isn't even close. I did the math at one point in the Skyliner thread but it would be impossible to find now.

well I’d be interested in seeing those numbers, I’m just going off of looking at the cars and they don’t quite look like they hold 300+ passengers each.

 

[Kamikaze]

Breakdowns currently are probably 95% or more train issues. Power and system issues are extremely rare.

I'll defer to you on that.

well I’d be interested in seeing those numbers, I’m just going off of looking at the cars and they don’t quite look like they hold 300+ passengers each.

And the monorail doesn't deliver 8 people every 10 or so seconds.

I'll do it quick: Monorail capacity is 360. Trains roughly every 5 minutes. Thats 12 trains per hour, or a total of 4320.

The system Skyliner uses delivers a cab of 8 every 10 seconds, or 80 people per minute for a total of 4800 per hour. However, it looks like we're getting some sort of double loading system which would theoretically double capacity. Even without, its ~500 more per hour on a single line.

This is without the added feature of a constant system that it doesn't dump everyone at the platform at once, making a much nicer experience to entering the park.

 

[MisterPenguin]

The Skyliner hourly capacity crushes (current) monorail capacity. It isn't even close. I did the math at one point in the Skyliner thread but it would be impossible to find now.

Breakdowns currently are probably 95% or more train issues. Power and system issues are extremely rare.
well I’d be interested in seeing those numbers, I’m just going off of looking at the cars and they don’t quite look like they hold 300+ passengers each.

Here it is..

Just because it has to leave every 7.5 seconds does not mean it only has 7.5 seconds to load. The station moves far slower than the actual line.

Monorail capacity is 360 per train. Roughly, it is 5 minutes between trains on the resort line. 60 minutes at 5 minute intervals is 12 trains per hour. That gives you capacity of 4320. On the gondola side, lets say its 8 passengers, 10 seconds between cabins, so 80 per minute. 80 x 60 is 4800.

Rough math on both sides. Gondola wins. Even if you added an entire extra monorail train to each hour, it wouldn't meet the Skyliner numbers.

You also neglect to mention that getting strollers and ECVs on the monorail is actually more of a procedure than it will be on the Skyliner.

I really wonder what @Lift Blog thinks when he sees how in the weeds we get on all this. Probably 'JFC guys, its just a gondola system'.

 

[Kamikaze]

Here it is..

You're the best.

 

[s8film40]

I'll do it quick: Monorail capacity is 360. Trains roughly every 5 minutes. Thats 12 trains per hour, or a total of 4320.

Ah, I see I think your monorail math is just way off.

I’ll break it down for you. Express monorail should cycle 4 trains every 9 minutes and resort monorail should cycle 4 trains every 12 minutes.

So express let’s just say they’re having a slow day and say 10 minutes for easier math. That’s 4 trains 6 times each hour 24 trains an hour so 8,640 passengers.

Then resorts let’s again make a more rounded and conservative number and say they’re going slow with 15 minute cycles. So that’s 4 trains 4 times per hour, 16 total trains per hour for 5,760 passenger.

Adding both of those together gives us a total capacity of 14,400 per hour at the MK.

 

[Kamikaze]

Ah, I see I think your monorail math is just way off.

I’ll break it down for you. Express monorail should cycle 4 trains every 9 minutes and resort monorail should cycle 4 trains every 12 minutes.

So express let’s just say they’re having a slow day and say 10 minutes for easier math. That’s 4 trains 6 times each hour 24 trains an hour so 8,640 passengers.

Then resorts let’s again make a more rounded and conservative number and say they’re going slow with 15 minute cycles. So that’s 4 trains 4 times per hour, 16 total trains per hour for 5,760 passenger.

Adding both of those together gives us a total capacity of 14,400 per hour at the MK.

So you're saying a new train leaves TTC every 2 minutes and 30 seconds?

I've always heard 10,000 per hour is the average for all three lines.

 

[s8film40]

So you're saying a new train leaves TTC every 2 minutes and 30 seconds?

I've always heard 10,000 per hour is the average daily for all three lines.

I’ve seen them leave TTC less than every two minutes. At peak times the next train should enter the station roughly 60 seconds after the previous train leaves. Load/unload should take less than 60 seconds. They used to have digital counters in the station so everyone could see them and know once it got to 45 seconds it was time for the train to go.

 

[msg7]

If you're combining the lines to get to that 3 hours, you have to multiply the hours of operation by 3. The numbers I was using are 1 line with a total outage of that line. If you're saying all three lines, then using the same 14 hour day you'd have 42 hours of operation total, which with a 3 hour downtime total would be about a 92-93% uptime. (Each 10% is 250 minutes or 4 hours plus).

Yep... All 3 lines combined... I would have done the math but I was pressed for time while posting, just as I am with this post so forgive me if I missed anything lol....

 

[Disone]

I’ve seen them leave TTC less than every two minutes. At peak times the next train should enter the station roughly 60 seconds after the previous train leaves. Load/unload should take less than 60 seconds. They used to have digital counters in the station so everyone could see them and know once it got to 45 seconds it was time for the train to go.

I don't think they can do that anymore. It really is more like four minutes between trains now due to how much slower the automation has made pulling into the stations. Its kind of painful to watch the monorail almost stop 1-1.5 car lengths short of the stations end, and then inch along that last 1- 1.5 car length before stopping and opening the door.

 

[s8film40]

I don't think they can do that anymore. It really is more like four minutes between trains now due to how much slower the automation has made pulling into the stations. Its kind of painful to watch the monorail almost stop 1-1.5 car lengths short of the stations end, and then inch along that last 1- 1.5 car length before stopping and opening the door.

Yeah, that’s why I used more conservative numbers. I’m sure they don’t do 8-9 minute cycles on Express or 10-11 minute cycles on resort anymore either.

 

[the.dreamfinder]

I don't buy into this for the monorails either. I think this is more for dining experiences like the space restaurant and the Star Wars hotel.

One day, just not today. LG’s OLED tech points the way.

 

[Disone]

Yeah, that’s why I used more conservative numbers. I’m sure they don’t do 8-9 minute cycles on Express or 10-11 minute cycles on resort anymore either.

I clocked Gold a few days ago while just people watching. It was on the express been and doing 11-12 minute round trips. My RT ride on the resort beam was 22 minutes long, MK - Contemp - TTC - Poly - Grand - MK.

 

[Jonathan Wang]

Based on what I have heard they wouldn't be able to do that with the route they want to go. That can still of course change.

im sure it was mentioned already from what i was reading since this was posted, but sounds like a power change on the beams... and if so that wouldnt allow for a train by train change... at the same time im curious if they would make the trains run faster than the current fleet to accomodate for the current rate of people at the parks.

Less time for the trains to arrive the better for the turnaround on guests.... and of course this can all be safe/timed properly via the automated systems.

If anyone here has been to japan, they have the subways BLOW through stations quite safely. I'm sure disney could do something of the same.

 

[s8film40]

I clocked Gold a few days ago while just people watching. It was on the express been and doing 11-12 minute round trips. My RT ride on the resort beam was 22 minutes long, MK - Contemp - TTC - Poly - Grand - MK.

Yeah those sort of things happen. There’s a big difference between discussing theoretical capacity versus real world results.

 

[s8film40]

im sure it was mentioned already from what i was reading since this was posted, but sounds like a power change on the beams... and if so that wouldnt allow for a train by train change... at the same time im curious if they would make the trains run faster than the current fleet to accomodate for the current rate of people at the parks.

Less time for the trains to arrive the better for the turnaround on guests.... and of course this can all be safe/timed properly via the automated systems.

If anyone here has been to japan, they have the subways BLOW through stations quite safely. I'm sure disney could do something of the same.

I would love to see them go faster, but I highly doubt it would happen. It’s not really about what the train can do but what speeds are safe. It also probably wouldn’t really make much difference would just result in trains waiting for clearance. Station times are a far bigger deal than the actual driving time.

 

[Disone]

Yeah those sort of things happen. There’s a big difference between discussing theoretical capacity versus real world results.

Not sure what you mean, but I want to clearify that I think those times are the normal run times now and not the exception. There was no notable delay in the operation in either case. It was just the pacing. In the case of the resort ride, it did hold between MK and Contemp, and again between Poly and Grand but both were short holds. Perhaps it could have done the trip in 20 minutes instead of 22, but the 22 minute trip time also did not include the station time of at MK itself.

 

[Jonathan Wang]

I would love to see them go faster, but I highly doubt it would happen. It’s not really about what the train can do but what speeds are safe. It also probably wouldn’t really make much difference would just result in trains waiting for clearance. Station times are a far bigger deal than the actual driving time.

Yea I agree however if they time the automation right I think they could do it. In japan if a train is 30 seconds late they are apologizing. It’s about how they implement it. If they follow how japan has done it, I think it would help.

Also I should clarify they should speed up the Epcot line.