News New Gondola Transportation - Disney Skyliner -

[mikejs78]

The point that is being harped on is the fact that it’s 1.5 degrees warmer in the gondola than the outside air when not in motion. The whole 96.5 vs 95 degrees.

1.5 degrees Celsius, not Farenheit. So 95 degrees F = 35 degrees C = 97.7 degrees F. Plus you're in an enclosed space. So that's a bit more of a difference.

What I think is the issue though is the expectation of air conditioning. Most guests understand that walking around outside in 95 degree heat is going to be hot. The Ferries are more open air and probably perceived as such. But the gondolas appear closed and even though they have ventilation, it probably won't be noticed especially since it will feel warmer than outside. And because it's enclosed, I think people will have expectations that it should have AC. Just like one expects indoor attractions in Fantasyland to have AC. If the Gondolas were more open air, say like the old Skyway, I think people would be more forgiving. But because it's enclosed, I think Disney will get a lot of complaints. Unless there's some system to blow cool air into the cabins at the stations. Either way I agree with @Sirwalterraleigh that AC will be added within a few years.

 

[GoofGoof]

Yeah I really have no knowledge and I'll give them the benefit of the doubt for now. I'm only speculating just looking at it and from my experience in the FL heat that it appears as though it would be at least 20 degrees or more warmer inside there than the outside temperature.

If that is the case they would have to shut down operations if the temperature exceeds 85 degrees. They won’t expose guests to temperatures in excess of 105 degrees. The 1.5 degrees came from this post from @liftblog:

Since the air conditioning topic just won't seem to go away, I recently came across the below as part of an interview with the CEO of a Doppelmayr competitor (translated from French.)

> What is the Sigma solution for combating heat in the booths of urban appliances in a hot environment? Is the dream of an air-conditioned cabin feasible?
-Currently the simplest solution is ventilation. We are lucky to have a vehicle that moves, so we find easy ventilation by creating a flow of air in the cabin. We have done extensive studies on the airflow in our cabins to maintain an equivalent temperature inside and out. We also tested in climatic chambers and we found that with our ventilation system we never had more than 1.5 degrees of elevation inside the cabin compared to the outside, despite the people on board and despite the solar radiation.
Then, we are looking for other solutions. The difficulty is not to cool a cabin as such. We know how to do it, in the context of ferris wheels, as soon as we have energy. With electric power, cabin air conditioning is easy to perform. Our difficulty is to bring energy to the moving vehicle. We work on different research and solutions.

> What technical developments do you see in the near future on cabins?
-Air conditioning is an important issue, because when we find a real solution markets will open. We are also researching solutions that will consume less energy, with adiabatic coolers that do not work in all outdoor conditions. Otherwise, I think that digital onboard booths will grow more and more thanks to electrical and communications options. For now, digital is mostly present in the tourist field, but it will also happen on the snow markets.

https://www.remontees-mecaniques.ne...ecialiste-des-cabines-du-groupe-poma-172.html

This isn’t the exact product WDW is getting, but the point was a competitor can keep their internal temperatures within 1.5 degrees of the outside temperature. My point is temperature isn’t the only factor with feeling comfortable. Having air circulating and not being hit by direct sunlight can make a big difference. Think about standing in an outdoor covered queue line with fans moving the air vs standing in sun. The actual temperature may not vary more than a few degrees but there’s a huge difference in comfort. The one thing they cannot do with ventilation that AC does is cut down the humidity.

 

[cindy_k]

It does have a nice tint on the windows... I am sure more than a few will attempt to join the "Gondola-High Club"

At least little Timmy down below won't get an eyeful.

 

[GoofGoof]

1.5 degrees Celsius, not Farenheit. So 95 degrees F = 35 degrees C = 97.7 degrees F. Plus you're in an enclosed space. So that's a bit bigger of a difference.

What I think is the issue though is the *expectation* of air conditioning. Most guests understand that walking around outside in 95 degree heat is going to be hot. The Ferry's are more open air and probably perceived as such. But the gondolas appear closed and even though they have ventilation, it probably won't be noticed especially since it will feel warmer than outside. And because it's enclosed, I think people will have expectations that it should have AC. Just like one expects indoor attractions in Fantasyland to have AC. If the Gondolas were more open air, say like the old Skyway, I think people would be more forgiving. But because it's enclosed, I think Disney will get a lot of complaints. Unless there's some system to blow cool air into the cabins at the stations. Either way I agree with @Sirwalterraleigh that AC will be added within a few years.

1.5 was the max according to that post so at times less of a difference.

I think a lot of people will naturally expect AC since it’s FL but it depends on how they actually feel inside whether people will complain. I’ve never ridden in these gondolas in a warm environment so I can’t really jump to the conclusion that the ventilation will or won’t be noticed.

 

[Lensman]

It does have a nice tint on the windows... I am sure more than a few will attempt to join the "Gondola-High Club"

And a one way trip on these things is going to be like three to five minutes...Its not like we are talking about spending 25 minutes in these things. Im constantly amazed at how these questions keep coming back up.

Based on the information in this thread my wife says we will not be joining the club.

 

[cindy_k]

I am trying to remember, are the stations supposed to be air conditioned? The effect may be worse if they are.
Going from hot and breezy to hot and breezy isn't that bad.
Going from cool and dry to hot and humid is definitely more of a shock.

 

[Poly1974]

Looks like a six person greenhouse to me. Hope I'm wrong.

 

[JohnD]

So what about thunderstorms? They crop up every afternoon in Florida. It's very likely people will be in gondolas when a thunderstorm blows through. (Hurricanes are different. You know one is coming. You shut down the system).

 

[s8film40]

If that is the case they would have to shut down operations if the temperature exceeds 85 degrees. They won’t expose guests to temperatures in excess of 105 degrees. The 1.5 degrees came from this post from @liftblog:

This isn’t the exact product WDW is getting, but the point was a competitor can keep their internal temperatures within 1.5 degrees of the outside temperature. My point is temperature isn’t the only factor with feeling comfortable. Having air circulating and not being hit by direct sunlight can make a big difference. Think about standing in an outdoor covered queue line with fans moving the air vs standing in sun. The actual temperature may not vary more than a few degrees but there’s a huge difference in comfort. The one thing they cannot do with ventilation that AC does is cut down the humidity.

Yeah humidity is a big factor. An enclosed space with windows and filled with people is very difficult to cool to a reasonable temperature even with a good AC. Keeping this within 1.5 degrees of the outside temperature with only ventilation seems like a miraculous feat to me. If it works I'll want to go and see it just for that alone!

 

[LieutLaww]

It's a proven design that is used around the world, there are very few Gondola systems that actually use AC

 

[s8film40]

It's a proven design that is used around the world, there are very few Gondola systems that actually use AC

Are there any examples of them being used in a similar climate to FL?

 

[LieutLaww]

@Lift Blog has stated many times in this thread that non AC is used pretty much everywhere and in places where the heat and humidity is higher than FL, AC on Gondola systems is a very rare thing.

 

[pdude81]

Are there any examples of them being used in a similar climate to FL?

https://liftblog.com/2016/08/23/in-pictures-crazy-gondola-opens-at-wynn-palace-cotai/
Not quite as hot but similar

 

[s8film40]

@Lift Blog has stated many times in this thread that non AC is used pretty much everywhere and in places where the heat and humidity is higher than FL, AC on Gondola systems is a very rare thing.

Hmm, I was just curious of examples. It honestly sounds pretty far fetched to me, but I really just don't know much about this technology. Ironically when I google gondolas in hot and humid environments the overwhelming majority of what I find is articles about the the WDW Skyliner.

 

[Lift Blog]

Those look small to me. They look like they are for four people

10 Europeans. 8 Americans.

CWA assumes 185 lbs. per person. Average American adult weighs 175 lbs.

 

[Grimley1968]

Are there any examples of them being used in a similar climate to FL?

Hong Kong, which is probably every bit as hot and humid as FL.

 

[NormC]

Looks like a six person greenhouse to me. Hope I'm wrong.

Yes, you are wrong. It is a 10 person "greenhouse".

 

[Goofyernmost]

Serviced Resort costs?

Buses are servicing resorts Martin. So how much extra have we paid for that in the past (that we know of) those buses don't run on air. Which the Gondola's kind of do!

 

[JenniferS]

There is a solution, don't stay at those resorts and don't get on one. Sometimes the solutions are simple. The reason is that you will only be on it for a short time and you will survive even if it stops for a brief time. It is mere minutes in ride time and if one cannot stand Florida temperatures for that brief period of time, perhaps going to WDW in mid summer would not be the smartest of ideas. Last time I looked the parks themselves are not AC'd. Just the buildings. We don't even know if they are going to be paying extra at this point. It's all just plain speculation.

I agree totally. It’s really no different than being the first people to load on the sunny side of the tram while you wait for everyone else to board, collapse their strollers, and rearrange their party so children are seated in the middle. It’s a few minutes.

If you can’t handle a few minutes of Florida temps, WDW is not the place for you. At least not for six months of the year.

 

[Goofyernmost]

Weird...I was thinking the same thing. Gives new meaning to seeing the Eifel tower from the backside...

I have actually walked around the Eiffel Tower and guess what... it looks the same from every direction.