News New Gondola Transportation - Disney Skyliner -

Creathir

Creathir

Well-Known Member
nickys said:
Also, because Riviera is a DVC resort, it's reasonable to assume that many of the ECV riders will be repeat visitors and used to riding ECVs on and off buses and monorails at least, which will make loading and unloading at this station easier.
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This is not always the case.

I’ve watched MANY an ECV rider get stuck and need assistance from the bus driver while waiting to board the bus at Kidani.

I don’t care how experienced one is at driving an ECV, boarding a motorized vehicle which is sliding sideways and possibly on a curve is going to be quite challenging on a motorized scooter.

We’ll see how it goes when it opens. I’m confident Disney will have it addressed and figured out quickly if there is indeed and issue on day 1.
 
lazyboy97o

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
creathir said:
This is not always the case.

I’ve watched MANY an ECV rider get stuck and need assistance from the bus driver while waiting to board the bus at Kidani.

I don’t care how experienced one is at driving an ECV, boarding a motorized vehicle which is sliding sideways and possibly on a curve is going to be quite challenging on a motorized scooter.

We’ll see how it goes when it opens. I’m confident Disney will have it addressed and figured out quickly if there is indeed and issue on day 1.
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Riviera will still board along a straight line, not in the corners themselves.
 
lazyboy97o

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
Flalex72 said:
It's too bad the lifting frame on top of the tower integrates supports for the catwalks and couldn't be removed to reduce the visual impact.

For those who might not understand what I mean, the trapezoidal metal structure atop the tower serves as an attachment point to lift the cables up onto the tower, at installation and should the cable fall off or need to be removed for maintenance. It also supports the communication lines between towers. Some lifts have been built without lifting frames as a cost cutting measure, in which case a frame can be lifted up and bolted on if it is needed.

For this one tower, if the lifting frame could have been removed, or redesigned to fold down if it wasn't in use, that would have been neat to see.
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That sort of modification would have probably reduced the height enough for the tower to be blocked by the new facades on the rear of the pavilion, not that those would have an interesting backside.
 
Lift Blog

Lift Blog

Well-Known Member
Flalex72 said:
It's too bad the lifting frame on top of the tower integrates supports for the catwalks and couldn't be removed to reduce the visual impact.

For those who might not understand what I mean, the trapezoidal metal structure atop the tower serves as an attachment point to lift the cables up onto the tower, at installation and should the cable fall off or need to be removed for maintenance. It also supports the communication lines between towers. Some lifts have been built without lifting frames as a cost cutting measure, in which case a frame can be lifted up and bolted on if it is needed.

For this one tower, if the lifting frame could have been removed, or redesigned to fold down if it wasn't in use, that would have been neat to see.
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This was actually done on the last tower of a new chairlift at Jackson Hole to reduce visual impacts on a nearby restaurant. The lifting frame is on the tower but folded down behind the bronco. Unfortunately the catwalk and railings were required to be in place at all times under code so it didn’t make too much difference.
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yensidtlaw1969

yensidtlaw1969

Well-Known Member
Goofyernmost said:
Is it just me or is that the park level is above the river level just the argument that I was just using. I cannot be above the level and below it at the same time. So let's just leave it on the fact that none of the gigantic show building is visible to any of us and it usually comes as a shock that we have never noticed it. Any sight blocking would be adjusted to the proximity of the ground level no matter where it is.

View attachment 282285
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The term Park Level is being used to refer to Guest-Accessible Areas. It does not mean the entire park, including backstage spaces, are on that same level. It is true that the foundations for The Haunted Mansion and Small World show buildings both sit noticeably lower than the Park Level that guests are at when they enter those attractions. If they sat at guest level there would be give or take 15 more feet more height to disguise from view of guest areas, which would be much harder to miss.

Be Our Guest in New Fantasyland is similar but different in that guests never change park level anywhere from the approach to the building or throughout the restaurant, but if you were to be evacuated backstage you'd be walked down two flights of stairs from the park level (at which the guests experience the restaurant) to the ground level (on which the foundation sits).
 
MisterPenguin

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
Goofyernmost said:
Not that I recall. As soon at you make the corner going toward Fantasyland you start going downhill, but, frankly not important enough to argue about. The point was they know how to cover things when the want to. HM is right along side the rivers of America and it is above it. That river has to be completely level to maintain water levels, so it would take some hard facts to convince me that it is below the river level.
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Park level that the guests walk around on is marked with P. As you can seek, the level of Park Level in Fantasyland is at the same level of the roof of the back entrance to the utilidors. The ground level is the floor level of the utilidors. Note that it's also the ground floor level of the HM show building.

1525623649336.png


And here you can see that the HM facade building is a story taller than the show building. The entrance is a story above the water.

1525623973746.png


So, the entrance building is lifted up to park level, but the show building and the water is at actual ground level.
 
Goofyernmost

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
peter11435 said:
You are missing the point. The foundation of the show building is at the same level as the river. If the bottom of the show building was at the same level as the park level outside the mansion then the show building would rise higher above the tree line from the guest perspective. They were aided by the fact that a portion of the building could be hidden below the perspective of the guests.
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No, I got that point, you don't get mine. I don't care if it were below the river or above that castle, they still would have been able to hid the show building just like they did Small World and all the rest of the show buildings. Why do you want to insist that it is not possible anywhere on sight if they want too? Don't bother answering I know you are just going to find some other reason why it was a piece of cake to hide that whole building like they put a sign in the way or something. So even though I don't see the evidence that it is the same exact level you do and you will continue to find reasons to take the conversation in a direction that is just profoundly irrelevant and just for the sake of argument. Carry on on your own that is not what my post was about, it was about people that see an object during construction and automatically get all upset because they are sure it will show when it is all complete. My point was that they can hide whatever they think is necessary or possible to hide and we pretty much have to get over it.
 
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NobodyElse

NobodyElse

Well-Known Member
MisterPenguin said:
Park level that the guests walk around on is marked with P. As you can seek, the level of Park Level in Fantasyland is at the same level of the roof of the back entrance to the utilidors. The ground level is the floor level of the utilidors. Note that it's also the ground floor level of the HM show building.

View attachment 282320

And here you can see that the HM facade building is a story taller than the show building. The entrance is a story above the water.

View attachment 282321

So, the entrance building is lifted up to park level, but the show building and the water is at actual ground level.
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While I appreciate the time and effort you've taken, I think I'm questioning two of your three "P" labels. Let me study further and get back to you with questions. (I might just be really thrown off by the angle, etc.)
 
peter11435

peter11435

Well-Known Member
Goofyernmost said:
No, I got that point, you don't get mine. I don't care if it were below the river or above that castle, they still would have been able to hid the show building just like they did Small World and all the rest of the show buildings. Why do you want to insist that it is not possible anywhere on sight if they want too? Don't bother answering I know you are just going to find some other reason why it was a piece of cake to hide that whole building like they put a sign in the way or something. So even though I don't see the evidence that it is the same exact level you do and you will continue to find reasons to take the conversation in a direction that is just profoundly irrelevant and just for the sake of argument. Carry on on your own that is not what my post was about, it was about people that see an object during construction and automatically get all upset because they are sure it will show when it is all complete. My point was that they can hide whatever they think is necessary or possible to hide and we pretty much have to get over it.
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Funny you use small world as an example since that is another case where a significant portion of the height of the show building is below park level. Nobody is arguing that they can’t or won’t hide the show building. But they won’t have the benefit of a portion of the building being below park level like they have with most show buildings in the Magic Kingdom.
 
NobodyElse

NobodyElse

Well-Known Member
MisterPenguin said:
Here's a head-on look into the the back door utilidor entrance, if that helps.

View attachment 282362
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(First off, please excuse my ignorance. I've only been to WDW a few times, and it has been a while at that.)

1525631326964.png


So, let's say I'm a guest walking from point A to point B (along the dotted pathway). Would I be physically walking downhill, reducing my absolute elevation by 3 meters or so, or is it a level grade? Thanks.
 
MisterPenguin

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
NobodyElse said:
(First off, please excuse my ignorance. I've only been to WDW a few times, and it has been a while at that.)

View attachment 282377

So, let's say I'm a guest walking from point A to point B (along the dotted pathway). Would I be physically walking downhill, reducing my absolute elevation by 3 meters or so, or is it a level grade? Thanks.
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A and B are the same level, which is the floor level of the Park. My mistake for saying P is the same level, it is the same story, but the roof of A/B.

Imagine the flat marsh land. Now imagine a super-giant warehouse built on that natural ground level. That is the utilidors. The park was built on top of that with a lot of sloping in the front of the park from the natural ground level up to the park level on the second story. That back part pictured doesn't have a slope down because it's all back lot. From the back you can see it's two stories.
 
NobodyElse

NobodyElse

Well-Known Member
MisterPenguin said:
A and B are the same level, which is the floor level of the Park. My mistake for saying P is the same level, it is the same story, but the roof of A/B.

Imagine the flat marsh land. Now imagine a super-giant warehouse built on that natural ground level. That is the utilidors. The park was built on top of that with a lot of sloping in the front of the park from the natural ground level up to the park level on the second story. That back part pictured doesn't have a slope down because it's all back lot. From the back you can see it's two stories.
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That's what I thought, and the reason I asked for clarification (for myself and others that might come across this and be confused).

1525635437719.png


So, in this picture, my crudely-drawn thick black lines would roughly represent shoe-to-knee-level for guests on the outside, public paths. (I realize I dipped down a bit too low on the back of those show buildings.) It would (here in the USA) represent the bottom of the second floor (and "middle P" is its ceiling or roof). "Far right P" would actually represent something even taller than that.

Correct?
 
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DisAl

DisAl

Well-Known Member
FYI the "canal" in small world is at the same level as the utilidors, ground level, one floor down from the entrance of small world, which in this thread has been called park level. You go downhill from the small world entrance to the Haunted Mansion, and I think the Haunted Mansion entrance is approximately the same elevation as the original ground level. The river level is several feet below that. Remember that you board the steamboat directly from street level onto the second deck.
Gee golly great thread derailment!!! How did we get here from the gondolas Batman??? Have they added to the route?o_O
 
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lazyboy97o

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
peter11435 said:
Funny you use small world as an example since that is another case where a significant portion of the height of the show building is below park level. Nobody is arguing that they can’t or won’t hide the show building. But they won’t have the benefit of a portion of the building being below park level like they have with most show buildings in the Magic Kingdom.
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This whole tangent of “explaining reality” is pointless because the towers are installed prefabricated. They are not going to change height, so what we see now is very close to the finished product. There is not a whole lot of room between this tower and the Ratatouille walkway/courtyard so you'd be trying to plant a few isolated, very tall trees that themselves would only mess with the view even more.
 

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