New DAS System at Walt Disney World 2024

[Tha Realest]

Ok let me break this down real simple.

Before this change my Grandpa would be able to use the parks. ( at least for half a day )

After this change my Grandpa will not be able to use the parks.

Please explain to me how that is “accommodating”.

Yeah, I think you’re over exaggerating.

Because here’s you, just a few hours ago:

Grandpa as of 1:03pm absolutely could get by under a combination of whatever return to line / mobility accommodation was provided.

Unless of course his health has taken a drastic turn in the last few hours, which, if that is the case, why are you posting here?

 

[Tha Realest]

Ok, he will not be able to partake in attractions at the park the he previously was able to.

Not accommodating

Not Disney’s fault. You and your family are likely staking out an unreasonable position in light of what Disney is required to do.

 

[pigglewiggle]

Ok, he will not be able to partake in attractions at the park the he previously was able to.

Not accommodating.

Is he not able to use a wheelchair?

And if not, have you already spoken to the healthcare professional, explained exactly the issue which really does not allow him to stand in line and they just said no?

Or are you just yelling for no reason?

 

[Happyday]

I feel like Disney should just get rid of DAS all together. Skipping a line seems like over the top, no?

I feel like reasonable accommodations would be to provide headphones for loud environments. Crayons and coloring books, and some quiet places to decompress throughout the parks. For guests having difficulty standing for long periods of time, they could offer free or discounted wheelchairs. I feel like those ideas are reasonable, but I could be wrong.

Unfortunately that doesn't work for everyone. Believe me I wish it did.

 

[Fido Chuckwagon]

You are calling me a liar. You think that there is NEVER a time where that line is longer than 15 minutes and you are wrong. You are basically saying that I am faking my medical issues and abusing DAS. So no, YOU are the rude one.

I am not calling you a liar. I have never said that there is NEVER a time when the line is longer than 15 minutes. I specifically mentioned high crowd times such as Christmas, Thanksgiving and Easter. The touring plans data pretty firmly establishes that a 20+ minute actual wait on peoplemover is the exception and not the rule though. You stated that you have ridden peoplemover using DAS “many many times.” I don’t think you’re lying about that, I think you’re telling the truth. Unfortunately that necessarily means you’re using it at times when the wait is less than 20 minutes, unless, again, you were being hyperbolic with your “many many” statement. I also firmly believe your medical issues, I merely pointed out that those issues will now appear to be accommodated with a return to line pass, that will let you exit the Peoplemover line whenever you need to, and then return to the line when you are able to. This seems like the perfect solution to me. The only one being rude here is you.

Candidly, it sounds to me like the new “return to line pass” will actually be better for the issues that you have stated you experience. There are many times when Lightning Lanes become extremely backed up (partially because of DAS abuse) such that you could experience a wait in a LL that is too long for you to handle. If you struggle with 20 minute peoplemover lines I can’t imagine how difficult things get for you on a backed up lightning lane, or on a ride where there is still a significant post-LL wait (rides like Soarin, Guardians, Tower of Terror, etc.). Now you don’t have to worry about that anymore! You can use the return to line pass and not have to worry about needing to exit a line and losing your place. This new system should actually be much better for your needs. Everyone really needs to give Disney a chance here, the return to line system in general sounds like a great idea to me, and we should be giving Disney a chance before jumping down their throats.

 

[DisneyCane]

Honestly, while I'd prefer not to do so, I will when I have to for DD. That said, what bothers me most about it is her diagnosis means nothing to most doctors as they haven't heard of it. It's incredibly rare. I've been gaslit multiple times by medical professionals because they didn't know what it was and assumed I was spouting something from webmd/google. With medical records in their hands. So I don't have much faith in anyone having her diagnosis and it somehow making our lives easier to do that, when it's often made things more difficult. A conversation about her needs is for more effective than one about her diagnosis.

Her diagnosis shouldn't really matter. I would think a description of her needs from a doctor should more than suffice. I hope that the (seemingly not insignificant number of) people abusing the DAS system don't cause significant difficulty for you to get the accommodations for your daughter that she requires.

I am truly saddened that so many people were abusing the system to get a "freebie" perk that any of this has become necessary. I know that there will be attractions with long standby lines. My choices are:

1) Use the standby line and wait the required time
2) Purchase Genie+ and/or ILL and cut down on the wait time for a fee
3) Stop going to WDW

I choose #1. If nobody in your party has a real disability and you feel too entitled to choose #1 or #2 then choose #3.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

If Disney could sell more G+, they would. As it is it’s only sold out around two dozen times over the last few years.

Mostly because it doesn’t work and the prices are too high across the board anyway

 

[Fido Chuckwagon]

Unfortunately that doesn't work for everyone. Believe me I wish it did.

The more I think about it, the more I think that Disney’s return to line idea, if implemented properly, can really be a great solution for most users. Yes, it won’t work for those with neurodivergent disabilities such as autism, so it makes sense that those will still be accommodated with DAS classic, but the ability to hold your place in line while taking a rest / bathroom break / breather / sit down /etc. sounds like a great solution for everyone else. Everyone really needs to give Disney a chance here.

 

[DryerLintFan]

The only one being rude here is you with the insinuations you are making about me. Touringplans data supports what I am saying about the average actual wait time for people mover. And if you really are unable to wait in that 5-15 minute line, it sounds like Disney will be able to accommodate you with a return to line pass so I really don’t understand the vitriol you are currently directing at me or Disney.

You are calling me a liar. You think that there is NEVER a time where that line is longer than 15 minutes and you are wrong. You are basically saying that I am faking my medical issues and abusing DAS. So no, YOU are the rude one.

There’s an information point Fido doesn’t have here,…. If the wait time is 15 minutes or less and you have DAS, they let you just walk on to the ride. You get waived through the LL and When you hit the front you just go on it.

Granted you don’t bypass many people, but DAS makes it a walk on for you.

 

[Fido Chuckwagon]

There’s an information point Fido doesn’t have here,…. If the wait time is 15 minutes or less and you have DAS, they let you just walk on to the ride. You get waived through the LL and When you hit the front you just go on it.

Granted you don’t bypass many people, but DAS makes it a walk on for you.

Oh no, I have that information point. There’s no lightning lane for peoplemover, and I’ve seen the DAS users who get scanned right into the escalator. The original point was that people who require DAS to bypass a 15 minute (usually less unless the ride has stopped) line probably shouldn’t be riding a whole lot of rides even with a lightning lane, since those lightning lanes get quite backed up and are longer than the standard peoplemover line.

 

[DryerLintFan]

Oh no, I have that information point. There’s no lightning lane for peoplemover, and I’ve seen the DAS users who get scanned right into the escalator. The original point was that people who require DAS to bypass a 15 minute (usually less unless the ride has stopped) line probably shouldn’t be riding a whole lot of rides even with a lightning lane, since those lightning lanes get quite backed up and are longer than the standard peoplemover line.

Ooooh we used a fast pass one time for that flying carpets ride and it was the silliest thing. We were let into the ride just a smidge up the line but it sure didn’t get us anywhere. It was the biggest waste of a fast pass we ever had.

 

[seabreezept813]

Exactly. Ive said this before the 2 pre selects were not needed but hey want to give me them so be it. Granted at times the attractions you want are not available or time slots but again. Its 2 free rides extra. Limiting it to only your immediate family seems too obvious to me & again its simple to see who is abusing it when the same DAS users show up with different people constantly. They botched this completely imo

Totally agree. They could also limit rerides. At the very least a max of 1 das use per ILL attraction.

 

[Trauma]

Totally agree. They could also limit rerides. At the very least a max of 1 das use per ILL attraction.

Yes but certain autistic kids only ride the same ride.

Sure it’s a super small segment of DAS users but it would suck for them.

 

[lentesta]

@lentesta do you wish to respond?

Happy to help. Here's the thread with the numbers we counted back in September. I was told on Tuesday afternoon by someone who actually knows, "You're in the ballpark. I wouldn't have done it that way." (I may have said something about their coffee budget being larger than my company in response.)

If you read that and think there's no possible way that 45% of guests at Space Mountain were using DAS and 40% of guests at Peter Pan, let me provide more data:

• In this 2020 lawsuit filed against Disney in the US District Court in Orlando, the court noted that these data collected by Disney about Guest Assistance Card (GAC) use were both unchallenged by the plantiffs and convincing to the court (emphasis mine):
  
  In a two-week study conducted by Disney's Industrial Engineering team in April 2013, the team found that GAC pass usage at five of the most popular attractions at Disney (the "GAC Study") was much higher than the percentage of guests in the park who held a GAC pass.
  
  At that time, approximately 3.3% of guests at Disney used a GAC pass, yet the percentage of guests on the most popular rides who had a GAC pass and entered through the FastPass line was significantly higher than 3.3%.
  
  The GAC Study showed that 11% of riders on Space Mountain, 13% of riders on Splash Mountain, and 30% on Toy Story Mania used a GAC pass to access the ride.
  
  Disney's industrial engineers concluded that the small portion of the guest population who held GAC pass was consuming a substantial portion of the ride capacity.
  
  For example, guests with a GAC pass were riding Toy Story Mania an average of ten times more than guests who did not have a GAC pass.
  
  Cite: A.L. v. Walt Disney Parks & Resorts US, Inc., 469 F. Supp. 3d 1280, 1294 (M.D. Fla. 2020). The quote above is on the right-hand side of page 9.
  
  
• So 3.3% of the people in the park were using 30% of Toy Story's ride capacity.
  
  
• Disney said on Tuesday that use of the system has tripled in the last 5 years. (Second cite here.)

Okay, so if back in 2013, 3.3% of guests were using 30% of ride capacity at a popular ride, and use has tripled since then, you'd think roughly 33% to 90% of riders on popular rides were using DAS to access the ride.

The numbers we estimated were in the lower end of that range.

The top end of that range is too high, but it's closer to right than wrong. If you said 50-75% of Lightning Lane use at popular attractions was DAS, I would absolutely believe that.

 

[Trauma]

Happy to help. Here's the thread with the numbers we counted back in September. I was told on Tuesday afternoon by someone who actually knows, "You're in the ballpark. I wouldn't have done it that way." (I may have said something about their coffee budget being larger than my company in response.)

If you read that and think there's no possible way that 45% of guests at Space Mountain were using DAS and 40% of guests at Peter Pan, let me provide more data:

• In this 2020 lawsuit filed against Disney in the US District Court in Orlando, the court noted that these data collected by Disney about Guest Assistance Card (GAC) use were both unchallenged by the plantiffs and convincing to the court (emphasis mine):
  
  In a two-week study conducted by Disney's Industrial Engineering team in April 2013, the team found that GAC pass usage at five of the most popular attractions at Disney (the "GAC Study") was much higher than the percentage of guests in the park who held a GAC pass.
  
  At that time, approximately 3.3% of guests at Disney used a GAC pass, yet the percentage of guests on the most popular rides who had a GAC pass and entered through the FastPass line was significantly higher than 3.3%.
  
  The GAC Study showed that 11% of riders on Space Mountain, 13% of riders on Splash Mountain, and 30% on Toy Story Mania used a GAC pass to access the ride.
  
  Disney's industrial engineers concluded that the small portion of the guest population who held GAC pass was consuming a substantial portion of the ride capacity.
  
  For example, guests with a GAC pass were riding Toy Story Mania an average of ten times more than guests who did not have a GAC pass.
  
  Cite: A.L. v. Walt Disney Parks & Resorts US, Inc., 469 F. Supp. 3d 1280, 1294 (M.D. Fla. 2020). The quote above is on the right-hand side of page 9.
  
  
• So 3.3% of the people in the park were using 30% of Toy Story's ride capacity.
  
  
• Disney said on Tuesday that use of the system has tripled in the last 5 years. (Second cite here.)

Okay, so if back in 2013, 3.3% of guests were using 30% of ride capacity at a popular ride, and use has tripled since then, you'd think roughly 33% to 90% of riders on popular rides were using DAS to access the ride.

The numbers we estimated were in the lower end of that range.

The top end of that range is too high, but it's closer to right than wrong. If you said 50-75% of Lightning Lane use at popular attractions was DAS, I would absolutely believe that.

These facts are great, but I don’t think anyone is disputing DAS is being abused to an absurd degree.

The disagreement is about the proper way to resolve the issue.

 

[jaklgreen]

I am not calling you a liar. I have never said that there is NEVER a time when the line is longer than 15 minutes. I specifically mentioned high crowd times such as Christmas, Thanksgiving and Easter. The touring plans data pretty firmly establishes that a 20+ minute actual wait on peoplemover is the exception and not the rule though. You stated that you have ridden peoplemover using DAS “many many times.” I don’t think you’re lying about that, I think you’re telling the truth. Unfortunately that necessarily means you’re using it at times when the wait is less than 20 minutes, unless, again, you were being hyperbolic with your “many many” statement. I also firmly believe your medical issues, I merely pointed out that those issues will now appear to be accommodated with a return to line pass, that will let you exit the Peoplemover line whenever you need to, and then return to the line when you are able to. This seems like the perfect solution to me. The only one being rude here is you.

Candidly, it sounds to me like the new “return to line pass” will actually be better for the issues that you have stated you experience. There are many times when Lightning Lanes become extremely backed up (partially because of DAS abuse) such that you could experience a wait in a LL that is too long for you to handle. If you struggle with 20 minute peoplemover lines I can’t imagine how difficult things get for you on a backed up lightning lane, or on a ride where there is still a significant post-LL wait (rides like Soarin, Guardians, Tower of Terror, etc.). Now you don’t have to worry about that anymore! You can use the return to line pass and not have to worry about needing to exit a line and losing your place. This new system should actually be much better for your needs. Everyone really needs to give Disney a chance here, the return to line system in general sounds like a great idea to me, and we should be giving Disney a chance before jumping down their throats.

Well I don't know what to tell you. Many times that I have been to MK, the line for people mover was over 20 minutes long. I know this to be fact because I have seen it with my own eyes. So yes, you are calling me a liar and I don't appreciate that. I think that you need to get over yourself and your need to be right. Stop responding to me.
And I don't know how any return to the line system would work for someone that travels solo. Who would I be returning to? And we all know that many of the lines get pretty darn long and narrow. How does a person just find their way quickly out of the line to go and use the restroom? I don't think that you are thinking this through.

 

[lentesta]

ROFL

Your that gullible ?

Disney is going to wait a month to measure what type of impact this is making and then start selling more Genie and LL.

The line will be just as full as ever, except with more people paying $$$.

That’s what this is about, and nothing more.

I note that if Disney's numbers about DAS abuse are to be believed, 3 out of 4 guests in the Lightning Lane are not paying for it. Which means all the revenue Disney's got over these last few years is coming from 1 in 4 guests.

So if Disney can nudge 1 of those 3 into paying for Genie+, they will double their revenue.

 

[lentesta]

These facts are great, but I don’t think anyone is disputing DAS is being abused to an absurd degree.

The disagreement is about the proper way to resolve the issue.

Oh. I thought I was asked for the numbers. My bad.

 

[jaklgreen]

There’s an information point Fido doesn’t have here,…. If the wait time is 15 minutes or less and you have DAS, they let you just walk on to the ride. You get waived through the LL and When you hit the front you just go on it.

Granted you don’t bypass many people, but DAS makes it a walk on for you.

I wouldn't know because I don't use DAS if the line is short. I have never had them "waive me through" when using DAS. I always set up a return time well in advance and then come back to the ride.

 

[Trauma]

Oh. I thought I was asked for the numbers. My bad.

No you have been lol.

But you have very succinctly articulated these facts in the past and I don’t think anyone is disputing them.

DAS needs to change.

The question is how.