New DAS System at Walt Disney World 2024

lazyboy97o

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
flynnibus said:
Exactly - you won't find me haven't said reporting was a problem. I said 'how effective have you found it?' in addressing an individual concern. Other people (like yourself) were the ones saying it was a problem.

I just think it's a waste of time. If you really are personally impacted in a way that is significant and meaningful to you, consult a lawyer.
Click to expand...
I didn’t call it a problem. I was calling out more gross exaggeration of what people have said about the situation. Reporting is an appropriate response. It may not be the most personally effective but it is appropriate.
 
Disstevefan1

Disstevefan1

Well-Known Member
Figgy1 said:
Genie has limitation that won't work for many that have DAS. Some with DAS get to the LL and must return later due to the length of the line among other things and that was before Genie plus, not to mention the time constraints. Count yourself lucky you've never had to deal with such things
Click to expand...
Well that's true, the Genie+ system is so broken the "Lighting Lane" can be longer than standby, LOL

Yes, DAS is far superior to anything else.

For the record, DAS does not give equal access, it gives superior access.
 
Chi84

Chi84

Premium Member
flynnibus said:
Exactly - you won't find me haven't said reporting was a problem. I said 'how effective have you found it?' in addressing an individual concern. Other people (like yourself) were the ones saying it was a problem.

I just think it's a waste of time. If you really are personally impacted in a way that is significant and meaningful to you, consult a lawyer.
Click to expand...
And if you do consult a lawyer, be prepared for some unwelcome news.
 
Jrb1979

Jrb1979

Well-Known Member
Disstevefan1 said:
Well that's true, the Genie+ system is so broken the "Lighting Lane" can be longer than standby, LOL

Yes, DAS is far superior to anything else.

For the record, DAS does not give equal access, it gives superior access.
Click to expand...
Genie+ is not that broken. A lot of the problem stems from DAS. Mainly cause they couldn't account for DAS each hour as they can join the LL queue at any time.
 
Figgy1

Figgy1

Well-Known Member
Disstevefan1 said:
Well that's true, the Genie+ system is so broken the "Lighting Lane" can be longer than standby, LOL

Yes, DAS is far superior to anything else.

For the record, DAS does not give equal access, it gives superior access.
Click to expand...
It gives somebody who needs it a way to wait on lines. Those who can use Genie can and do wait on regular lines in addition to using genie
 
Last edited:
ConfettiCupcake

ConfettiCupcake

Well-Known Member
Disstevefan1 said:
Well that's true, the Genie+ system is so broken the "Lighting Lane" can be longer than standby, LOL

Yes, DAS is far superior to anything else.

For the record, DAS does not give equal access, it gives superior access.
Click to expand...

It gives superior access for those who can get by without it. Not those who unquestionably need it. For those people it’s giving access they otherwise wouldn’t have.

And there IMO is the reasoning behind Disneys changes. They appear to be attempting to limit the people who qualify to those who unquestionably need it the majority of the time or else cannot access the attractions. For those who can get by and receive equal access with another accommodation (like AQR) that’s what they’re getting. Because when you don’t always need that accommodation, it does tip the scales to superior access and at the end of the day Disney can’t afford to give that away (for free).
 
Disstevefan1

Disstevefan1

Well-Known Member
Figgy1 said:
Genie has limitation that won't work for many that have DAS. Some with DAS get to the LL and must return later due to the length of the line among other things and that was before Genie plus, not to mention the time constraints. Count yourself lucky you've never had to deal with such things
Click to expand...
Sincere question. A DAS users goes to their attraction at their specified return time to find the Lighting Lane is too long to wait in. What do they do?
 
Chi84

Chi84

Premium Member
TrainsOfDisney said:
Like what?
Click to expand...
Chi84 said:
This may be an unpopular opinion, but I think Disney just may actually know what it's doing with these changes.

The varied and particularized needs by disabled persons visiting a large theme park are difficult to accommodate within the bounds of the ADA unless a program gives out an accommodation that fits everyone, like DAS. But DAS is unworkable because it's too close to Genie+, which is in itself a valuable service, leading to abuse at worst and overuse at best. And the DOJ advises businesses not to inquire into the nature and extent of a disability (in some cases, like service dogs, DOJ regulations actually prohibit all but two questions).

The DOJ regulations do not cover line-skip accommodations (skipping the physical line, not the wait), leaving Disney open to the broader "spirit" of the ADA, which is inclusivity as much as possible. So - unlike accessible seating or parking - no impact studies have been done and no guidance is given to the business as to how much negative impact is considered reasonable.

Court cases deal with particular plaintiffs, and a plaintiff suing Disney on the basis that their particular physical disability cannot be accommodated with line accommodations will need evidence in the form of medical expert testimony as to why that is true. Disney will also present experts. Look at what was said by the court in A.L. when he advanced all the reasons DAS would not work for him. The court considered all of the other things he could do and the advance preparations he could have made to deal with his disability in navigating the parks. The court did not concede to his choice, nor did it place all the burden on the business.

RTQ is going to be difficult for Disney for the reasons stated in this thread. But having a medical expert at each attraction is too great a burden for any business and the ADA doesn't allow businesses to go into the disability anyway - so the choice under the ADA is to accept a person's representations and give them a return time or accommodate them the best way possible with accommodations in line. Disney will have statistics and actual evidence to show what is happening with RTQ if someone challenges it and, as stated above, the person saying it was necessary is going to have to prove it with hard evidence to a court. If plaintiffs establish RTQ is necessary, then the analysis shifts to whether providing it would cause a fundamental alteration in the services Disney provides to its guests - which now includes selling line-skips to both disabled and non disabled people.

So limiting DAS to conditions like autism and the like, which by their very nature make standing in line impossible, is the way Disney has chosen to go. If a person with autism or a developmental disability is denied DAS and sued (almost an inevitability), that particular plaintiff will have to introduce the type of evidence introduced by A.L.
Click to expand...
It’s my perception that people think the laws protect them much more than they actually do. Remember all the people who were going to sue Disney over room security checks? Or the people on this site claiming a mod deleting their posts violates their right to free speech?

For reasons I’ve stated before in this thread, I don’t believe a court will easily find an ADA violation. It will have to be an exceptional violation, which is unlikely.
 
Angel Ariel

Angel Ariel

Well-Known Member
Disstevefan1 said:
Sincere question. A DAS users goes to their attraction at their specified return time to find the Lighting Lane is too long to wait in. What do they do?
Click to expand...
They can either choose to get in it anyway, leave and come back later (since the DAS return window doesn't close, they just can't book another DAS until it's used), or they can cancel that DAS so they can book something else.
 
F

Fido Chuckwagon

Well-Known Member
Disstevefan1 said:
Well then if they simply give Genie+ for free to folks who qualify for DAS what's wrong with that???
Click to expand...
People will complain because that is not as good as DAS. Genie+ return times go away and push out much further than DAS return times. At 1:00 PM with DAS if Jungle Cruise has a 75 minute wait you get a return time in 75 minutes. At 1 PM with Genie+ Jungle Cruise is probably already sold out for the day.
 
Figgy1

Figgy1

Well-Known Member
Angel Ariel said:
They can either choose to get in it anyway, leave and come back later (since the DAS return window doesn't close, they just can't book another DAS until it's used), or they can cancel that DAS so they can book something else.
Click to expand...
Thereby missing out on an experience somebody who doesn't need das will have
 
R

rtmachine

Active Member
There may be a lawyer or 2 that would take on Disney if you are willing to pay their retainer and all the costs up front..but it will be a lot $$$$$ or more to fight Disney, especially since they "Disney" make you sign the no class action suit thing.
 
KrzyKtty

KrzyKtty

Well-Known Member
TrainsOfDisney said:
The complaint is valid regardless. If I make an honest complaint about accessibility the complaint is valid and not spam regardless.

It’s up to the DOJ to look into the complaint and decide if it’s valid or not.

It’s certainly not up to anyone on a Disney message board to say it’s not valid and = spam.
Click to expand...
Honestly, I doubt any real person ever sees most submissions. There would just be too many, And the government will not pay for that many people to review every submission by hand. Computers probably handle the initial flush out.

Prue conjecture on my part. Not saying that people shouldn't make submissions If they truly felt disney wasn't meeting ADA.
 
T

TrojanUSC

Well-Known Member
Figgy1 said:
Thereby missing out on an experience somebody who doesn't need das will have
Click to expand...

Disney has to juggle the needs of the disabled without impacting the operation of their business. This is why GAC went away as they won the lawsuit saying it was fundamentally impacting their business operation. They would easily argue they are proving an accommodation to access the attractions as quickly as possible but anything beyond that would significantly impact their business (eg having to staff/operate a third queue just for DAS which just isn’t feasible).
 
F

Fido Chuckwagon

Well-Known Member
KrzyKtty said:
Honestly, I doubt any real person ever sees most submissions. There would just be too many, And the government will not pay for that many people to review every submission by hand. Computers probably handle the initial flush out.

Prue conjecture on my part. Not saying that people shouldn't make submissions If they truly felt disney wasn't meeting ADA.
Click to expand...
The person in this thread tied up a human being on the phone for some time, and encouraged others to do the same.
 

Register on WDWMAGIC. This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.

Back
Top Bottom