RunningKoen
Well-Known Member
Several airline companies are changing their standards for cabin crew.
Times are changing.
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News New Changes Coming to the Disney Look 2021
- Thread starter castlecake2.0
- Start date
Times are changing.
TrainsOfDisney
Well-Known Member
Which ones?
flynnibus
Premium Member
Missing from your logic is "observer is offended.... proceed directly to jail"
It really doesn't matter what the source intended... all it takes is for the observer to be upset about it. This is what is taught now... offensive is in the eye of the beholder.
I've heard Delta crews were complaining about their uniforms and change would happen in late 2021.
RunningKoen
Well-Known Member
Have to check it out. A British one made make up optional, a Japanse one no longer demands heels & female cabin crew can wear jeans. Were some news articles about it back then.
Any form of restrictions on appareance for a job is subject to the general opinion and spirt of the time. And that changes. Shocking.
Edi: I'm not from the USA, so I have no clue about what airlines are big or small of there
GrumpyFan
Well-Known Member
Putting managers in a position to check and judge each person's tattoos is a discrimination law suit waiting to happen.
I know it's just day 1, but Disney will need to clarify this in very specific terms in order to avoid such suits.
As-is, it seems that it was written in very vague terms. I find it hard to believe with all the lawyers they have, that it's not better stated and more specific.
RunningKoen
Well-Known Member
So, if needed, the tattoo's goes back undercover. Problem solved.
Isnt that part of the entire moderation proces?
TrainsOfDisney
Well-Known Member
Oh I see. Here in the USA I don't think any of the major carriers allow visble tatoos.Have to check it out. A British one made make up optional, a Japanse one no longer demands heels & female cabin crew can wear jeans. Were some news articles about it back then.
Any form of restrictions on appareance for a job is subject to the general opinion and spirt of the time. And that changes. Shocking.
Edi: I'm not from the USA, so I have no clue about what airlines are big or small of there
RunningKoen
Well-Known Member
You're partly right. I edited my post to nuance it a bit. I didnt mean it like that. English isnt my first language.
I think that Disney, with all their legal experience and lawyers, made it vague on purpose.
Allow tattoo's, keep it decent.
Not that difficult. We're probably already discussing it way more than it needs to be.
RunningKoen
Well-Known Member
My remark wasn't about tattoo's.
Someone mentioned a thing about suits. I jumped in on that with changes for cabin crew.
My point still being: restrictions on appearance, in whatever form, are always up for debate. The current debate leans more towards relaxing things. Bit by bit.
It isnt just Disney. It isnt just tattoo's. Or a suit.
We're less inclined to keep mainting so many restrictions for so many jobs.
TrainsOfDisney
Well-Known Member
Ok? I’m still not aware of any major carriers that have relaxed “restrictions on appearance” other than southwest ( they still don’t allow visible tatoos but they have the more relaxed dress codes but they also appeal to a different clientele, no 1st class for example.)
RunningKoen
Well-Known Member
There's more than the USA. I know that can be a shocking thing for some Americans.
British carrier relaxes the make up policy, Japanse policy relaxes the skirt and high heels policy. Those might not be a major carrier in your eyes.
It doesnt need to be a big carrier. It doesnt need to be a big change. It shows nothing is set in stone and current social developments have an influence on such rules.
Those changes made the news in the Netherlands, because the once so steadfast look of a stewardess was open for debate. And such things will continue to happen.
TrainsOfDisney
Well-Known Member
Not shocking at all. But this is a discussion about USA standards so they seem a bit more relevant to me.
RunningKoen
Well-Known Member
It isn't. Thinking it is, is part of the discussion though.
There are some social trends that are (a part of) the reason for these changes. And we're discussing that, or at least that's what I'm trying to do.
And my point still remains: it's a global thing. The society is changing. Employers asking their employees to have a certain look conflits with the spirit of the time. Inside the USA and out.
With the pandemic as main example: how and where we work is subject to change. Everywhere.
And question for the future: what we do as jobs, how we dress for that, how we work together, how we deal with things like gender, racism, sexuality (#metoo) changes. Standards and views change. And with that, demands for employees. Including tattoo's.
When, like for the different views on gender, tattoo's become more acceptable, policies that demand that tattoo's must be covered, become subject of debate.
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Salted Nut Roll
Active Member
I think many people are confused as to what the policy change actually entails. What I'm hearing from people against this change are things like, "Disney is allowing people to come to work looking unkempt and as if they just woke up," and "I don't want someone with a face full or piercings and neon hair helping me." As far as I can tell, neither of these things is happening. Nothing that I've read about the policy change has said they are going to start allowing wild-colored hair or facial piercings. (Thought please correct me if I'm wrong about that. I don't claim to be an expert on this subject). Cast members are still required to wear their respective uniforms. They just now have more options to choose from. And I definitely haven't read anything about Disney allowing employees to show up looking rumpled or unkempt. I honestly don't know why some people are equating having less a less traditionally conservative style with a lack of care for personal hygiene. Can anyone explain where that comes from?
Also, on the concern over "What if a CM has a (potentially offensive) tattoo? What then?!" : According to the Disney Parks blog: " Our new approach provides greater flexibility with respect to forms of personal expression surrounding gender-inclusive hairstyles, jewelry, nail styles, and costume choices; and allowing appropriate visible tattoos." This tells me there will still be standards. I'm reasonably sure that CMs won't be allowed to wear tattoos of swastikas or tats that are profane.
I get the concern over keeping the Cast Members looking professional. I understand that standards of appearance for Disneyland can and should be high. But I don't believe that the new policy is a slippery slope into a free-for-all, where cast members will soon be able to roll up to work in their pajamas or Madonna-style cone bras, hair styled in the shape of a phallus, while flipping off the guests as they come in. The standards are changing slightly, not going away.
Also, just to put it out there for those who find facial piercings, unnatural hair colors, and tattoo sleeves to be a sign of unfriendliness or unapproachability, I encourage you to talk to some people who are dressed differently than you. You might find that your perception is mistaken. My younger brother works in customer service. He has almost a full sleeve of tattoos, a nose ring, and hair past his shoulders. He is also one of the nicest, most courteous people you could meet, and people at his job love him. Tattoos, piercings, etc., aren't an indicator of a person's personality or level of professionalism.
Also, on the concern over "What if a CM has a (potentially offensive) tattoo? What then?!" : According to the Disney Parks blog: " Our new approach provides greater flexibility with respect to forms of personal expression surrounding gender-inclusive hairstyles, jewelry, nail styles, and costume choices; and allowing appropriate visible tattoos." This tells me there will still be standards. I'm reasonably sure that CMs won't be allowed to wear tattoos of swastikas or tats that are profane.
I get the concern over keeping the Cast Members looking professional. I understand that standards of appearance for Disneyland can and should be high. But I don't believe that the new policy is a slippery slope into a free-for-all, where cast members will soon be able to roll up to work in their pajamas or Madonna-style cone bras, hair styled in the shape of a phallus, while flipping off the guests as they come in. The standards are changing slightly, not going away.
Also, just to put it out there for those who find facial piercings, unnatural hair colors, and tattoo sleeves to be a sign of unfriendliness or unapproachability, I encourage you to talk to some people who are dressed differently than you. You might find that your perception is mistaken. My younger brother works in customer service. He has almost a full sleeve of tattoos, a nose ring, and hair past his shoulders. He is also one of the nicest, most courteous people you could meet, and people at his job love him. Tattoos, piercings, etc., aren't an indicator of a person's personality or level of professionalism.
TP2000
Well-Known Member
No, it's all pretty simple.
They have thrown out the rulebook on showmanship and front line "Cast Members" supporting the elaborate show that Imagineers built in the parks. There's no reason why a girl selling balloons on Main Street USA can't have a big, gaudy Homer Simpson tat on her leg. And if you object to that, you are not a nice person and don't want her to be happy.
Disney used to talk about "the show" in all its parks. These changes clearly stated that they were designed to let an employee "be who they are" instead of "supporting the show".
It's also a quick and easy way to widen the labor pool which will suppress wage growth now and in the forseeable future. I have to give credit to Disney though, they framed this in a way all about "Inclusion" and almost all CM's see this as some sort of big win when all it will do is lower their future wage growth and limit the amounts of benefits Disney has to offer to attract and keep good talent.
A few of these changes were indeed inclusionary, and needed to happen. But most of these changes are simply rooted in making it easier and cheaper to staff the parks and thus lowering wage growth.
what’s the point of enforcing “neutral and blended makeup” when you can also have a big ugly tattoo showing ?
KBARCLAY86
New Member
It is a slippery slope, when you start to relax your standards and allow wiggle room for interpretation. Disney had very set rules, about the Disney Look. It is know world wide and the Disney look should be timeless and help to improve the show of the parks and resorts.
Men for example were not aloud to have any facial hair at all, not even a mustache. Then they aloud mustaches. As long as they did not extend over the corners of your month. That was clear and other than that no facial hair, had to be clean shaven.
When they started to allow beards, there is/was a length guideline, I do believe of no longer than that of the easer on the end of a pencil. I am not sure how to well that is controlled. But again, once you allow for someone’s own interpretation you loose that set standard.
The role of the cast member is simply that a role, in which they play are part in the show. You are hired to play that part, which come with standards and guidelines, if you do not wish to follow those guidelines, then find someplace else to work.
Lowing the Disney look standards, will only eventually lead to lower standards in the parks. The Disney difference, the things that made/make Disney stand out and allow for the “extra” cost at the ticket booths worth it, are slowly slipping away.
Men for example were not aloud to have any facial hair at all, not even a mustache. Then they aloud mustaches. As long as they did not extend over the corners of your month. That was clear and other than that no facial hair, had to be clean shaven.
When they started to allow beards, there is/was a length guideline, I do believe of no longer than that of the easer on the end of a pencil. I am not sure how to well that is controlled. But again, once you allow for someone’s own interpretation you loose that set standard.
The role of the cast member is simply that a role, in which they play are part in the show. You are hired to play that part, which come with standards and guidelines, if you do not wish to follow those guidelines, then find someplace else to work.
Lowing the Disney look standards, will only eventually lead to lower standards in the parks. The Disney difference, the things that made/make Disney stand out and allow for the “extra” cost at the ticket booths worth it, are slowly slipping away.
Giss Neric
Well-Known Member
They made it to Fox News. Hooray!