DisneyJayL
Well-Known Member
- In the Parks
- No
I'm just not seeing what more the families want. I am just not understanding. I don't have autistic children but I have very young ones. I am just now sure what more that they want.
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More families of autistic kids sue Disney parks
- Thread starter PhotoDave219
- Start date
ToTBellHop
Well-Known Member
Read my previous message. They want a return to the old system where they could effectively skip to the front of the line at any ride.
I hope you are being sarcastic.
In case you are not, I want to educate you on something that you do not seem to understand (which I do not blame you for, as misunderstanding and stigma abound). Whether or not an impairment (something that causes a disability) is observable to the untrained eye has nothing to do with the severity of the impairment or what type of accommodations are needed.
For starters, let’s look at the definition of a disability. According to the ADA (Americans with Disabilities Act): “An individual with a disability is defined by the ADA as a person who has a physical or mental impairment that substantially limits one or more major life activities, a person who has a history or record of such an impairment, or a person who is perceived by others as having such an impairment.”
By a “visual disability,” I assume (excuse me if I am wrong) you are thinking of something like a physical impairment that involves the external body (such as an amputation) or a mental impairment that can often be seen in physical features such as Down syndrome. In instances like these, it is often clearer to the observer that the individual has an impairment and it is sometimes easier to see what disability and accommodations go along with it. What you describe as “invisible disabilities” I assume are impairments that are not easily seen, such as most psychological disorders, or perhaps a physical disorder in which the issue is internal. In some of these cases, the disability (such as a sensory overload, intense fear, inability to walk long lines) may not show up until the specific event that there is a disability in happens (such as waiting in line or heat). In the end, the severity of the impairment and the disability that occurs is not correlated to whether or not you can see it on the outside. Not only is it illegal to discriminate against the type of disability, but it is a mishap in understanding that I hope you correct.
In terms of those who abuse the system, it certainly has nothing to do with the type of disability. If someone abuses the system, whether they have a disability or not, it is not due to one type of an impairment over another. It is because they are being selfish.
Sorry for the long post, but I look at the boards every once in a while and had to create an account as to comment on something that a lot of people do not seem to understand unless they have experience with it. I in no way mean to embarrass you or proclaim that I am better, but I do want to share an accurate depiction of disability.
Nicely put.
DisneyJayL
Well-Known Member
- In the Parks
- No
I know, I saw it. It just seems as though they want more and they want it now.
Andsome
Well-Known Member
Confession time, get your popcorn ready: As someone who has Asperger's/Mild Autism, I've been frustrated with the disorder ever since I was physically harassed by another ASD student, but rather than calling him out, they defended him because "Aw, he has Autism!"
These parents have taken my frustration a step further by thinking that their child is above everyone else (because of their ASD) to the point where they are taking legal action if their child is unable to get Special Front-of-the-Line privileges. They should count every single blessing they have that Disney is still making an effort to accommodate their child, even if it means coming back to the desired ride later.
It's this kind of Superiority Complex that some ASD parents/groups have that have alienated me to the point where I no longer even want to be associated with the disorder.
Sorry if this seemed long, but I'm done.
These parents have taken my frustration a step further by thinking that their child is above everyone else (because of their ASD) to the point where they are taking legal action if their child is unable to get Special Front-of-the-Line privileges. They should count every single blessing they have that Disney is still making an effort to accommodate their child, even if it means coming back to the desired ride later.
It's this kind of Superiority Complex that some ASD parents/groups have that have alienated me to the point where I no longer even want to be associated with the disorder.
Sorry if this seemed long, but I'm done.
Gomer
Well-Known Member
I understand what you are saying, and I have seen too many parents who seek to battle every where they turn. But I don't think its a superiority complex. I think its just some of these parents don't know how to turn off their "battle mode".
For many of us, we are constantly fighting something. Schools and facilities have a limited budget, so we must constantly battle for the necessary services and programs. We battle when we take our kids to the store and everyone turns to look when my son accidentally drops his juice and starts loudly and inconsolably sobbing at the top of his lungs. We battle to have the proper conditions in difficult situations to prevent issues that could disrupt our lives in many ways ( http://fox13now.com/2015/05/11/girl...standing-expert-says-incident-is-frustrating/ ).
I'm not saying this to garner sympathy, but just to provide an illustration that for parents of moderate to severe cases, if you let it life can seem to be a war against everyone. And sometimes during war you don't recognize friend from foe. You begin to see anyone who looks at your kid for more than 2 seconds as judgmental. You begin to see every teacher as someone who has given up on your child. Every clerk, flight attendant, or security officer is an incident waiting to happen. This is not right, but it happens. I admit, its happened to me on occasion. Even on past threads on this topic I've caught myself jumping on people unnecessarily. Reading too much into perceived bigotry that isn't there and jumping in to "protect my child" as if someone here was actually trying to do them harm.
I don't want to say its an instinct, but more of a habit. And that is not to forgive any behavior. But it is just something to take in consideration when passing judgment on those parents or the people suing disney. Its not that they are necessarily trying to get away with something, or trying to squeeze the system unfairly (some probably are, but not all). I think they just see another battle. Another piece being taken away from their child and don't know how to step back and get the proper perspective to see the difference between what you truly need to fight for and what may be an acceptable and justifiable loss. And it is a loss to their children, even if it is a reasonable one. But sometimes when you are fighting everyone around you all the time, reason doesn't always rule your actions.
copcarguyp71
Well-Known Member
I guess my big question is...are they seeking money or free vacations after having enjoyed the parks anyway or are they truly concerned and want Disney to change their policy?
Not having anyone afflicted in any way I guess I really don't have a pertinent point of view but my two cents is that the current system seems very fair and stopped (or seriously limited) the despicable profiteers who used to abuse the old system.
Privacy legalities make all of this just so sticky and if something could be done about the fact that someone does not have to show actual proof of said disability then that opens up the system for abuse. I understand why the legalities exist the way that they do for privacy sake but by the same token they were not really written with a day at the theme park in mind either.
Tough call no matter what angle you look at it from but it is ashame that this discussion even needs to happen because of mouth breathing bottom feeders who abused the system because of a sense of entitlement.
Not having anyone afflicted in any way I guess I really don't have a pertinent point of view but my two cents is that the current system seems very fair and stopped (or seriously limited) the despicable profiteers who used to abuse the old system.
Privacy legalities make all of this just so sticky and if something could be done about the fact that someone does not have to show actual proof of said disability then that opens up the system for abuse. I understand why the legalities exist the way that they do for privacy sake but by the same token they were not really written with a day at the theme park in mind either.
Tough call no matter what angle you look at it from but it is ashame that this discussion even needs to happen because of mouth breathing bottom feeders who abused the system because of a sense of entitlement.
networkpro
Well-Known Member
- In the Parks
- Yes
First of all my heart goes out to those who live with this every day, no matter how much they wish, their children or themselves will never be or experience what an average person with functioning senses and/or ability to process their input how most people would...to them the world doesn't "make sense".
They are just trying by any means to make their lives more "normal", unfortunately that comes at the expense of the rest of the public. Cinderella's song "Dreams are wishes your heart makes" describes hope, but unfortunately Flora, Fauna, Merryweather or the Blue Fairy are no where around to grant those wishes. You can pass a law to repeal gravity but it will not negate its existence.
They are just trying by any means to make their lives more "normal", unfortunately that comes at the expense of the rest of the public. Cinderella's song "Dreams are wishes your heart makes" describes hope, but unfortunately Flora, Fauna, Merryweather or the Blue Fairy are no where around to grant those wishes. You can pass a law to repeal gravity but it will not negate its existence.
copcarguyp71
Well-Known Member
Thanks for sharing an insiders point of view... it is nice to have commentary from someone who feels the real struggle at some level. Some fresh perspective if you will...
rnese
Well-Known Member
As someone who has for years worked with children with autism and their families, I do have a place in my heart for the daily struggles they endure. Many of the accommodations and modifications they request and require are legitimate and necessary. Having said that, there is, at times, a sense of entitlement and victimization that sets in with SOME parents and expect the world to bend over backwards for THEM, because of their child's condition. Surely suing Disney because Disney isn't doing enough for them is a classic example.
BuzzKillington
Active Member
The exploitation of this system proves the exact opposite and the ability to observe the severity of the impairment has everything to do with whether or not one should be accommodated. Since the issue at hand is about invisible disabilities, in particular sensory processing disorders, how do you think someone is diagnosed to have a SPD like Autism, Asperger, ADHD, etc…? There is no medical or blood test for these maladies so physicians and psychologist use behavioral observations to evaluate the degree and type of aid that will be required.
Again, it was the incorporation of invisible afflictions into Disney’s disability access policy that led to the abuse and eventual demise of a program that accommodated the truly disabled so well. Unfortunately, this ADA lawsuit will require that Disney either shut down the program in its entirety or resort back to the beginning when determination of these accommodations was conducted by visual means.
You have no idea why exactly TWDC changed its policies. But keep on spreading your usual prattle, Preston....
Nubs70
Well-Known Member
By filing in California, appeals will ultimately end up in the 9th Circuit Court which tends to be a tad more sympathetic than the Circuit that covers Florida.
If the circuit that covers Florida and the 9th Circuit results in differing opinions, this could result in an audience before the Supreme Court.
While a Supreme Court challenge to DAS may seem silly, I could very well see the opponents of DAS framing their argument as "DAS is an assault against the ADA"
If the circuit that covers Florida and the 9th Circuit results in differing opinions, this could result in an audience before the Supreme Court.
While a Supreme Court challenge to DAS may seem silly, I could very well see the opponents of DAS framing their argument as "DAS is an assault against the ADA"
ToInfinityAndBeyond
Well-Known Member
I just want to make sure I understand DAS. Doesn't it let you go to the front of the line once the time is up, like an old paper FastPass (but for a shorter wait)?
englanddg
One Little Spark...
It allows them access to the FP line.
Even the old DAS (nee GAC) cards specifically stated there was no "Front of the Line" benefits. The issue is, that's how Park Operations started to treat it (using alternative entrances and allowing rerides without reboarding, etc) and that led to an unrealistic (and policy wise incorrect) perception of how the older system worked.
JeffH
Active Member
One thing in Disney having all the suits brought up separately is now they can level a life-time ban on everyone of those who sues them frivolously...I hope these dopes all realize that...and I hope they and their families are banned for life. As a class action suit if Disney banned them all (after losing the suit) then THAT would be discriminatory, however as an individual Disney (as can any other business) can ban them (for suing them, not for being disabled). Disney needs to do that and publish it to reduce these frivolous law suits which increase all our costs.
ToInfinityAndBeyond
Well-Known Member
You can't punish someone just because they are suing you. This would be especially wrong, since Disney is being sued for allegedly being in violation of the ADA. There's nothing wrong with a lawsuit. Litigation is extremely expensive for both sides. If Disney comes out on top, it will deter future would-be claimants from filing suit (however, it won't stop everyone).
Disney has money. They've been the target of lawsuits since forever. That is not likely to change.
bethymouse
Well-Known Member
I remember the days where anyone in a wheelchair was admitted to a separate handicapped entrance.
TRONorail12
Active Member
I for one think the lawsuit is ridiculous. I have a cousin with autism and my aunt and uncle don't go around suing every place of business because my cousin can't wait in line. Lines are a necessity to keep order and efficiency in society. I feel Disney is complying with ADA and going above and beyond for that matter. The complaint is autistic kids can't wait in line - therefore, YOU WAIT THE SAME EXACT TIME THAT EVERY OTHER GUEST WHO PAID FOR A TICKET DOES, but you are free to wait on your own terms, wherever you want and then return to enter the ride when everyone else is stuck in a line with no freedom to come and go. The system meets the ADA requirements by providing FAIR AND EQUAL TREATMENT. If anyone thinks otherwise, then that means every single other guest in the park is being DISCRIMINATED against for being forced to wait in line for an attraction, while disabled people get a free pass to the front.