Michael Jackson

[Tony Perkis]

In all seriousness, where’s the overwhelming evidence,. Or any credible evidence?

I have looked for it, for over 12 months now., everywhere I’ve been able to.
IF I found credible suspicion of his guilt, then I wouldn’t have attended Michael Jackson One.
I wouldn’t have bought MJ the Musical tickets, during the presale, for myself and my child.
I wouldn’t have (re)watched This is It and Moonwalker with my child during our 2 weeks of quarantine., his first time seeing them.

I knew about the previous allegations and followed them years ago.. which was enough for me.

I knew about Wade & James and their lawsuit, years before Leaving Neverland came out. I blew them off at the time, as did the rest of the world and the media, because it sounded so unbelievable.

Then, fast forward to 2019 during the #metoo era, Leaving Neverland comes out, and suddenly the media is back to their 180degree turned ways from before his death-“MJ is a child molester!!”

I admit that the film got to me.. got to me so badly that I questioned if I’ve been wrong this entire time.. So, I read, and I watched, and I listened to all of the people who were in his life and so vehemently defending him.. I listened to Tom Messerau talk about Wade, again.. to people who knew Wade, to a woman who dated Wade during the years he claims he was molested.., I saw the blatant proof that the train station that James spoke of, in LN, didn’t even exist at the time... and I realized that society is once again doing what they’re so good at- choosing someone to tear down and rage against..because the media directed them to do it.

If there is some kind evidence to show that I’m wrong and the fantastical sensationalist media is correct.. then I would appreciate said evidence, because I would not support someone who did such horrible things to children.

Feel free to comprehend/read differing comments and act in good faith, eventually.

 

[BuddyThomas]

Just consider this post a because I can’t otherwise do it.

Strange rules but I guess this is Fantasyland after all.

 

[21stamps]

Feel free to comprehend/read differing comments and act in good faith, eventually.

If someone could compile a list, and post it, that would be a little more helpful than just repeating “overwhelming evidence” with no evidence to back it up.

The settlement on it’s own is not evidence.. not when you look at the circumstances preceding the settlement, and the accounts of people who were there at the time.
As an aside, I do think it’s fascinating that California law was changed afterwards, you can no longer have a civil suit prior to a criminal trial. It’s almost unbelievable that it was allowed in the first place.

So my question is- Is there anything else?

 

[21stamps]

I’m reading this book now, ebook format.. “My Friend Michael by Frank Cascio - another boy who’s family he befriended, from the time Frank was 5 years old. The book was written after Jackson’s death.

here’s 2 excerpts about Jordan Chandler and the lawsuit-

2-
.

 

[21stamps]

This one is such a common and consistent theme in all accounts by people who were close to him at the time..

It’s the beginning of the end, really.

What I don’t understand, is if I can easily find all of this... then why can’t the media find it? More importantly, why haven’t they written about it when reporting on alleged “ child molester”. It’s so clearly negligent that I worry about how they report everything now. They count on people to believe what’s reported, not looking beyond the printed story, definitely not on people who do their own research.

 

[Tony Perkis]

If someone could compile a list, and post it, that would be a little more helpful than just repeating “overwhelming evidence” with no evidence to back it up.

The settlement on it’s own is not evidence.. not when you look at the circumstances preceding the settlement, and the accounts of people who were there at the time.
As an aside, I do think it’s fascinating that California law was changed afterwards, you can no longer have a civil suit prior to a criminal trial. It’s almost unbelievable that it was allowed in the first place.

So my question is- Is there anything else?

It’s been provided in this thread. You’ve chosen to flat out ignore them.

That appears to be running theme with you - when confronted with things you don’t have an answer for, you ignore.

We owe you nothing new until you begin to act in good faith.

 

[*Cinderelly*]

I think when it comes down to it people are going to have their evidence from one side of the fence and the others are going to have it from the other side. The debate is going to go on forever and to be honest the man is dead. The sad thing is if this happened the ones that continue to suffer are the kids and sadly if it did occur I highly doubt much will come of it now.

 

[21stamps]

It’s been provided in this thread. You’ve chosen to flat out ignore them.

That appears to be running theme with you - when confronted with things you don’t have an answer for, you ignore.

We owe you nothing new until you begin to act in good faith.

You don’t owe me anything. Just thought you and Buddy might want to expand on your “overwhelming evidence” claim, by providing examples..as I did. Guess not.

 

[networkpro]

Minimally he was a tortured soul thanks to his fathers incessant badgering during what most everyone else had as a childhood. He had a man with a whip driving him from one thing to another.

He's gone, let him be.

 

[Tony Perkis]

You don’t owe me anything. Just thought you and Buddy might want to expand on your “overwhelming evidence” claim, by providing examples..as I did. Guess not.

You don’t deserve the luxury of us entertaining your laundry list of requirements until you begin to directly answer things we’ve specifically asked you.

The onus is on you here, not us.

 

[21stamps]

You don’t deserve the luxury of us entertaining your laundry list of requirements until you begin to directly answer things we’ve specifically asked you.

The onus is on you here, not us.

Right. Good deflection, good talk... as always.

Minimally he was a tortured soul thanks to his fathers incessant badgering during what most everyone else had as a childhood. He had a man with a whip driving him from one thing to another.

He's gone, let him be.

I think this has become such an interest to me for multiple reasons..

First and foremost is the media. The way they can control a narrative rather than printing information to let people decide for themselves. Watching it unfold in real time is disconcerting in the worst way..if they can control a narrative about Michael Jackson, then what else are they controlling?

Secondly, and related to the first., is that it has shown how most people are not interested in learning beyond a media narrative. I feel like it’s our responsibility to do so.. as much as possible.

Third, Michael Jackson represents more than great music... I have studied his life, passing that studying onto my own child.. the same way that I studied Beethoven, or any other revolutionary. There is something inside of them that is far beyond talent.. a drive, a mindset, an unbelievable passion... anyone can and should apply that to themselves.. They prove that we are all capable of it within our own interests or goals, we just have to have the drive and discipline. With MJ, it also extends to his humanitarianism.. Those things are more of a legacy than his music, imo. I want my child to be proud to study and try to reflect those rare human qualities in himself.

Lastly, the story of his life is one of the most interesting that I’ve ever heard. Success and torture of unimaginable proportions.. talent of unimaginable proportions in so many aspects, a constant strive for perfection and newness to bring to the world, eccentricities and love... the same world that built him up is the same one that destroyed him. It’s a lesson in human psychology that isn’t soon to be figured out.. There aren’t really any examples other than him.

Some people just like to bop along with Thriller or any other song.. and that’s ok too.

 

[BuddyThomas]

You don’t owe me anything. Just thought you and Buddy might want to expand on your “overwhelming evidence” claim, by providing examples..as I did. Guess not.

Uhhhhhh, excuse you. This thread is 21 pages long already, mostly because of you. Nothing anyone could post here would change your mind. If I had DNA and photographic evidence, you would dismiss it as fake. You and I are living in different realities. I live in the one where if it looks like a duck and acts like a duck, it’s a duck. You live in the one where he can’t possibly be a child molester even though he slept with little boys because you like Thriller. That’s all. Bye!

 

[Santa Raccoon 77]

Uhhhhhh, excuse you. This thread is 21 pages long already, mostly because of you. Nothing anyone could post here would change your mind. If I had DNA and photographic evidence, you would dismiss it as fake. You and I are living in different realities. I live in the one where if it looks like a duck and acts like a duck, it’s a duck. You live in the one where he can’t possibly be a child molester even though he slept with little boys because you like Thriller. That’s all. Bye!

That first example may be a platypus . Just sayin

 

[21stamps]

Uhhhhhh, excuse you. This thread is 21 pages long already, mostly because of you. Nothing anyone could post here would change your mind. If I had DNA and photographic evidence, you would dismiss it as fake. You and I are living in different realities. I live in the one where if it looks like a duck and acts like a duck, it’s a duck. You live in the one where he can’t possibly be a child molester even though he slept with little boys because you like Thriller. That’s all. Bye!

If I wasn’t searching for truth then I wouldn’t have done so much research over the past year.. if there is something that you know of, that I don’t, then I would honestly like to hear it. Why is it so hard to give examples of the overwhelming evidence you speak of?

I do think your last sentence may be where the disconnect is.. Reading.... If you’ve read any of my comments, then your last line wouldn’t have been able to be written... maybe there’s a similar issue with the the source of your “overwhelming evidence” statement..and that’s why it can’t be provided.

 

[Tony Perkis]

If I wasn’t searching for truth then I wouldn’t have done so much research over the past year.. if there is something that you know of, that I don’t, then I would honestly like to hear it. Why is it so hard to give examples of the overwhelming evidence you speak of?

I do think your last sentence may be where the disconnect is.. Reading.... If you’ve read any of my comments, then your last line wouldn’t have been able to be written... maybe there’s a similar issue with the the source of your “overwhelming evidence” statement..and that’s why it can’t be provided.

Look at you, ignoring things we’ve posted in the thread again.

To use your own condescension against you, try reading.

 

[21stamps]

It’s an appropriate time for these videos...
A little back story- MJ wasn’t happy enough with the first, said it didn’t fit his vision perfectly.. so took Spike Lee to film an entirely new version, in a real prison. Both were released.
I should note, the second one was rarely shown.. imagine if it came out today, it would be everywhere.

 

[Tony Perkis]

It’s an appropriate time for these videos...
A little back story- MJ wasn’t happy enough with the first, said it didn’t fit his vision perfectly.. so took Spike Lee to film an entirely new version, in a real prison. Both were released.
I should note, the second one was rarely shown.. imagine if it came out today, it would be everywhere.

Now is a more appropriate time for child molestation defense? Interesting take.

 

[21stamps]

I just listened to this interview. Yet another account, in a long line of personal accounts, from someone who was close to Michael, denying the allegations.

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But.. some people watched a film called Leaving Neverland, so those people must know the real story.. because, that’s easier than digging deeper.

 

[Tony Perkis]

But.. some people watched a film called Leaving Neverland, so those people must know the real story.. because, that’s easier than digging deeper.

I don’t think you know what a film is. You keep calling Leaving Neverland a film, but it is not classified that at all. It’s a two part documentary series.

The classification is important, and by actively choosing to describe it incorrectly, you’re being patently dishonest.

It’s these minute details that you continually employ to undermine opposing points. Film implies fictional retelling.

This is why nobody chooses to discuss things with you in good faith.

 

[21stamps]

I don’t think you know what a film is. You keep calling Leaving Neverland a film, but it is not classified that at all. It’s a two part documentary series.

The classification is important, and by actively choosing to describe it incorrectly, you’re being patently dishonest.

It’s these minute details that you continually employ to undermine opposing points. Film implies fictional retelling.

This is why nobody chooses to discuss things with you in good faith.

Actually, I think it’s you who doesn’t understand what a film is.

Try Google, or Siri, or Alexa. One of them will assist you.