Live-Action ‘Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs’

[LittleBuford]

I have purposefully not really bothered with this thread (and I see for good reason). But this is not the first time the 'grown adult' contingent has tried to tear down a female in the industry and it won't be the last.

This is playing out exactly like Halle Bailey, Brie Larson, Rose Tico, Daisy Ridley, Kathleen Kennedy, etc.

We still have folks who can't really accept that Halle for instance was actually excellent in the role, much to their disappointment.

Heck - Margot and Greta only escaped because the movie was so beloved that the detractors got drowned out.

It's not the tearing down that strikes me as new; as you say, there are plenty of precedents for that. It's the obsessive focus on some old interviews, together with the treatment of Zegler's words as somehow uniquely significant, that I find odd.

You may have missed it, but Halle Bailey is now considered faultless in this thread, the better to emphasise how terrible Zegler is. It's a shame Miss Bailey's sweetness and grace didn't serve her better over in the Mermaid thread.

 

[BrianLo]

And probably because she looks like the Barbie people grew up playing with.

What was the issue with Daisy? I never had an issue with her personally. Probably because she was a new character and it was 2015 so we hadn’t been beat over the head with the girl power themes yet.

I meant in terms of internet bullying. Though Daisy seems to face far less retribution than Rose, you are right that it seems to be a more recent phenomenon. Male actors were certainly once targeted during the prequel phase.

It seems to be the worst for 'fan franchises' and now it has spilled over to things as innocuous as Disney remakes.

 

[mickEblu]

That does make sense though. Renaissance films are the strong purview of mid-late millennials. Late Gen X really lived through the dark ages of animation and only had the strong Walt films to largely grow attached to.

We're in the third wave of nostalgia generation now for Gen Alpha. They'll come to grow to be most nostalgic for Frozen, Moana, Encanto, while millennials were renaissance and everyone older was about Walt's films. It doesn't degrade the originals of course, we just have way more relevant layers to peel back to get kids to see them.

Moana is really the modern gateway drug to Snow White now. The 'Princess brand' really was a power move by Eisner to keep those older films discoverable to kids.

Why I love the Golden Era movies makes sense but you’d think I have more of an affinity for Mermaid, BatB, Aladdin and Lion King considering I was just the right age to appreciate them (7-12 years old) when those movies came out and old enough to remember all the pandemonium that came with them. They were still events back then. That yearly Disney movie that came out in June or November.

Being born in 82 I don’t think I really lived through a dark age of animation as by time I was 6/ 7 years old you had movies like Who Framed Roger Rabbit and Little Mermaid being released. I feel like I’m more of an old Milennial than a young Gen X. There’s actually a term- Xennial for people born between 1977 and 1983 as we don’t fit neatly into either group.

My sister is a young-ish Milennial and her favorite Disney movie is Hercules. Hercules seems to be big with that demo.

 

[BrianLo]

It makes sense but you’d think I have more of an affinity for Mermaid, BatB, Aladdin and Lion King considering I was just the right age to appreciate them (7-12 years old) when those movies came out and old enough to remember all the pandemonium that came with them. They were still events back then. That yearly Disney movie that came out in June or November.

Being born in 82 I don’t think I really lived through a dark age of animation as by time I was 6/ 7 years old you had movies like Who Framed Roger Rabbit and Little Mermaid being released. I feel like I’m more of an old Milennial than a young Gen X. My sister is a young-ish Milennial and her favorite Disney movie is Hercules. Hercules seems to be big with that demo.

Ah yes, sorry I was just going with early 1980 in my brain. Though Mermaid fever didn't really kick off until 90/91 generationally with some time on VHS.

The real formative 'nostalgia' years for a Disney addiction are 4-8-ish in my brain and I think you were just a bit too old for it. I'm an 87 and I do think that 5 year gap made a difference. We were singing Under the Sea in choir in Grade 1.

Likewise, I bet you aren't much for Harry Potter? I have a lot of 84 friends and there is like this weird divide where you either were in public school for Harry Potter (and Pokemon fever) or you missed it by being high school aged.

 

[mickEblu]

It's not the tearing down that strikes me as new; as you say, there are plenty of precedents for that. It's the obsessive focus on some old interviews, together with the treatment of Zegler's words as somehow uniquely significant, that I find odd.

You may have missed it, but Halle Bailey is now considered faultless in this thread, the better to emphasise how terrible Zegler is. It's a shame Miss Bailey's sweetness and grace didn't serve her better over in the Mermaid thread.

These things don’t exist in a vaccum. It’s the compounding frustration with Disneys decisions over the last 4 years I’d say.

 

[LittleBuford]

These things don’t exist in a vaccum. It’s the compounding frustration with Disneys decisions over the last 4 years I’d say.

Then I wish people would direct their frustrations accordingly rather than turn Zegler into an easy scapegoat.

 

[mickEblu]

Ah yes, sorry I was just going with early 1980 in my brain. Though Mermaid fever didn't really kick off until 90/91 generationally with some time on VHS.

The real formative 'nostalgia' years for a Disney addiction are 4-8-ish in my brain and I think you were just a bit too old for it. I'm an 87 and I do think that 5 year gap made a difference. We were singing Under the Sea in choir in Grade 1.

Likewise, I bet you aren't much for Harry Potter? I have a lot of 84 friends and there is like this weird divide where you either were in public school for Harry Potter (and Pokemon fever) or you missed it by being high school aged.

Lol you’d be right. I was too old for Potter and Pokémon. Potter I do appreciate but just too old when it was released. Pokémon I couldn’t care less about.

But yeah I feel like I’m right on the cusp. Although it’s worth mentioning that all of the movies I’m super nostalgic about do fall into that 4-8 years old range. Roger Rabbit, Return to Oz, Willow, Coming to America and the Disney movies I owned on VHS. 1988 really seems to be that sweet spot for me. Early 90s stuff falls into the secondary tier of nostalgia. Stuff like the Home Alone movies, Disney Renaissance stuff, Jurassic Park and many of the classic 90s movies. That reminds me, I’m no movie buff but the 90s will probably go down as the greatest decade for Cinema right?

 

[BrianLo]

That reminds me, I’m no movie buff but the 90s will probably go down as the greatest decade for Cinema right?

Yes, the 90's is an absolute banger decade for movies!

 

[mickEblu]

Yes, the 90's is an absolute banger decade for movies!

For sure! I grew up in the 90s taking it for granted just thinking it was normal. Nope. The 90s for Cinema was like the 60s for Disneyland and Imagineering/ WED.

 

[LittleBuford]

If somebody can’t comprehend why Margot Robbie as Barbie is celebrated and beloved and Rose Tico is openly mocked, I can’t help them.

I can understand disliking her character, but what sense is there in openly mocking Tico herself?

 

[Chi84]

If somebody can’t comprehend why Margot Robbie as Barbie is celebrated and beloved and Rose Tico is openly mocked, I can’t help them.

Why is Margo Robbie celebrated and Rose Tico openly mocked?

Is it one of those things you can’t say because it will get deleted?

 

[MisterPenguin]

What was the issue with Daisy?

Being female and the lead in a Star Wars movie.

Because, for some, apparently, Star Wars is for boys.

And I guess girls are girls and boys are boys which somehow translates into staying in their own, separate lanes.

It's biology!!!

The hate was mostly on the character, but, you know the Internet, can't separate the actor from the character.

 

[erasure fan1]

Being female and the lead in a Star Wars movie.

No, that's not it at all. The complaints about Rey were with her being a "Mary Sue". It was she was just naturally the best Jedi ever with very little effort. The, men no like girl characters, needs to stop. If that were true, Ashoka or Leia wouldn't be some of the most popular characters in star wars.

Because, for some, apparently, Star Wars is for boys.

Again, no. Poorly written characters get scrutinized. It has nothing to do with boys or girls. You don't think that Finn or Jar Jar took less flack as characters then Rose or Rey? Boys didn't like Rose or Holdo because they were terrible characters. And guess what, a whole lotta girls didn't like them either.

And I guess girls are girls and boys are boys which somehow translates into staying in their own, separate lanes.

The only real separation with boys and girls and star wars, comes in the form of merchandise. An 8yr old boy isn't running out to get a rose tico figure or those Barbie type Rey dolls they had.

 

[MisterPenguin]

Again, no.

Yes. I've seen the internet posts.

I stand by my witness.

Good day.

 

[erasure fan1]

Yes. I've seen the internet posts.

I stand by my witness.

Good day.

Yes, there are bad apples. But a vocal minority a fandom doesn't make. Isn't that what's been argued here by everyone supporting snow white? That the people who are complaining are a vocal minority causing trouble?

 

[Disstevefan1]

I have purposefully not really bothered with this thread (and I see for good reason). But this is not the first time the 'grown adult' contingent has tried to tear down a female in the industry and it won't be the last.

This is playing out exactly like Halle Bailey, Brie Larson, Rose Tico, Daisy Ridley, Kathleen Kennedy, etc.

We still have folks who can't really accept that Halle for instance was actually excellent in the role, much to their disappointment.

Heck - Margot and Greta only escaped because the movie was so beloved that the detractors got drowned Zegler

What is it they say? Any press is good press?

Zegler looks perfect for the part for SW, I can’t speak for story line, the rumors is that the plot differers so much from the original that they are only keeping the name Snow White.

I have to see it so see how bad, or maybe good? It could be. Will it be good or bad, it doesn’t matter to me, I must watch it to find out. We will for sure not go to the theatre for this, it’s up to the family if they want to watch it when it first comes out on streaming, then I will purchase it digitally, or wait for it to be “free” on D+

 

[TP2000]

If somebody can’t comprehend why Margot Robbie as Barbie is celebrated and beloved and Rose Tico is openly mocked, I can’t help them.

I had to Google the words Rose Tico, because I have never heard of this person.

The name sounds like a special ingredient you would use for expensive margaritas.

 

[celluloid]

I had to Google the words Rose Tico, because I have never heard of this person.

The name sounds like a special ingredient you would use for expensive margaritas.

Pretty much is, only replace Margaritas with Star Wars and replace special ingredient with inclusion without any character traits or quality writing allowed.

 

[Ghost93]

You re probably right.

Even though I was born in the early 80s I don’t have the same affinity for the renaissance movies. Loved them when I was a kid and still enjoy them but as an adult it’s really the Golden Era classics I’m fascinated with for the works of art they are, the history and those golden chorales/ music. The animation quality in the Renaissance films are closer to Disney Afternoon quality than the works of art from Snow White to Sleeping Beauty. It’s also worth mentioning that when I was a kid, Disney was still re releasing those Golden Era classics in theatres and had just began selling them on VHS so they were relevant for me. Not to mention the lack of pretty much any competition or thousands of commercial free options for kids via streaming. I grew up on Alice in Wonderland, Cinderella, Who Framed Roger Rabbit and Pinocchio because those were the VHS tapes I owned. Although I had my mom rent me Return to Oz from The Wherehouse so often I have no idea why she never bought it.

I think the Renaissance movies had great character animation, but the backgrounds tended to be less detailed and visually stunning than the best Walt-era movies. If we are judging just by the animation alone — not the quality of the storytelling — I think only Pocahontas compares to movies like Sleeping Beauty or Fantasia.

Beauty and the Beast, despite being an excellent movie overall, is actually the visual low point for the Renaissance, IMO.

 

[Ghost93]

That does make sense though. Renaissance films are the strong purview of mid-late millennials. Late Gen X really lived through the dark ages of animation and only had the strong Walt films to largely grow attached to.

We're in the third wave of nostalgia generation now for Gen Alpha. They'll come to grow to be most nostalgic for Frozen, Moana, Encanto, while millennials were renaissance and everyone older was about Walt's films. It doesn't degrade the originals of course, we just have way more relevant layers to peel back to get kids to see them.

Moana is really the modern gateway drug to Snow White now. The 'Princess brand' really was a power move by Eisner to keep those older films discoverable to kids.

I was born in the 90s, but I grew up on the Walt-era movies on VHS just as much as I did the more modern (at the time) Renaissance movies and have equal amounts of nostalgia for them.