Live-Action ‘Snow White and the Seven Dwarfs’

[erasure fan1]

If you do a remake, fans of the original want to see something similar to what was previously made.

Not this fan.

These both illustrate a big part of the problem, everyone wants something different. Obviously there's also a group who just doesn't want the remakes at all. But you aren't going to win them over anyway. So it really comes down to one choice. Do you change things or keep it basically the same? My choice would be just don't make them at all and eliminate the problem.

 

[Casper Gutman]

My question would be this, who cares? The story is there, at this point it doesn't matter who manufactured it. It's there and being talked about by major sites, not just the hate mongering echo chamber culture war instigators you keep talking about. Sites like usa today, newsweek, Forbes... Even the nbc today show site had a story, and they are left as can be. The real question is what is Disney doing about it? Because no matter where it came from, it's a real thing.

Of course it matters that there’s an incredibly widespread and well-funded network of media outlets without even the pretense of journalistic ethics fabricating stories to incite hate against perceived ideological opponents. It’s one of the biggest issues facing the country today, exponentially more significant then anything Zegler has ever said.

Newsweek is a zombie magazine publishing culture war garbage behind the facade of a once-respected name. The other mainstream sources are covering the furious backlash - what USA Today calls the “racist backlash” - not Zegler’s words. Should they be giving this nonsense exposure? Probably not, but the media loves controversy.

Over and over, posters ask, lips aquiver with innocence, what Disney should do about such organic backlash? The desired answer seems to be that they need to stop emphasizing minority representation and particularly stop casting minority actresses in adaptations of their classics. Oh, the posters are quick to interject, the representation doesn’t bother me PERSONALLY, but look at all THOSE offended people, and after all Disney’s a business and this is hurting the box office. Maybe they can just have minority characters in NEW IPs… which will be attacked by the same culture warriors. And then the posters will say, well, it didn’t offend ME, but look at the box office, another woke bomb, whatever should Disney do?

The fact is that Disney has no good options. They will be targeted by the culture war network no matter what they do. As a general rule, giving into threats is a terrible idea. In this case, it would mean openly spiting young, emerging markets in favor of catering to and being associated with old, diminishing ones. It’s bad business and bad ethics. Sadly, the only way forward is through. Given the myriad challenges plaguing Hollywood right now, I truly hope Disney as we know it makes it through.

 

[Dranth]

My question would be this, who cares? The story is there, at this point it doesn't matter who manufactured it. It's there and being talked about by major sites, not just the hate mongering echo chamber culture war instigators you keep talking about. Sites like usa today, newsweek, Forbes... Even the nbc today show site had a story, and they are left as can be. The real question is what is Disney doing about it? Because no matter where it came from, it's a real thing.

It is real but why it exists in the first-place matters. Even more so when it was obviously manufactured. The end result is you get otherwise intelligent people ready to set aside their ability to think or empathize over something that never should have been an issue to begin with. It is why this kind of viral anger farming is so insidious no matter the source or motivation.

If I was angry at public personality X over something they said and then found out later they never actually said that, or the quote/clip left out context because it was being misrepresented by someone who stood to profit (either monetarily, ideologically, or both) from me being angry about it, I would change my mind. I am not going to cling to negative feelings about something or someone that was made up.

In this case, she literally did nothing wrong but, depending on the poster in this thread, her sin seems to be having a personal opinion, saying something she didn’t actually say, speaking in a tone of voice the poster THINKS is smug, or being involved in a production that people think is unnecessary.

Not exactly burn at the stake level of offensives.

 

[Chi84]

Ah yes, an “anti-Woke” YouTuber with video titles like “Stop Being ‘Offended’” - unless an actress makes some incredibly mild comments about an 85 year-old film, I suppose.

You post this garbage and continue to pretend you don’t see the network of outlets manufacturing this story, continue to pretend it’s entirely “her own words/ attitude” driving this.

Where did Zegler say she “hated” Snow White? You posted the article that broadcast that lie. Any thoughts on why outlets would falsify her words?

It's only because others keep encouraging this by arguing with it. There's another way; most have found it.

 

[Andrew C]

There's another way; most have found it.

Ignoring those who disagree?

 

[Chi84]

Ignoring those who disagree?

Not at all. I fully engage with people who disagree all the time. You should know that.

But there's a difference between engaging in discussion with those who have different opinions and encouraging repetitious posting of nothing but the same argument. That's the type of arguing that doesn't add any facts to the discussion and leads to personal attacks, getting threads heavily moderated or shut down.

 

[MisterPenguin]

Well, if some rando with a YouTube channels says she's 'smug' then I guess that's that. Obviously, anything she's been in would betray that smugness.

Remember how everyone said that West Side Story failed because of her smugness?

TP, you're really grasping at straws now. Your posts are ridiculous in the literal sense: laughable.

 

[Andrew C]

Not at all. I fully engage with people who disagree all the time. You should know that.

I do know that. And it’s appreciated. Was only joking.

 

[LittleBuford]

Not at all. I fully engage with people who disagree all the time. You should know that.

But there's a difference between engaging in discussion with those who have different opinions and encouraging repetitious posting of nothing but the same argument. That's the type of arguing that doesn't add any facts to the discussion and leads to personal attacks, getting threads heavily moderated or shut down.

You’re right, of course, and I fully admit to being one of the people who should know better.

 

[Disstevefan1]

This movie will be a beautiful, wonderful, train wreck! I cant wait to see it.

 

[Andrew C]

Challenging someone on why he/she feels a certain way about Zegler seems reasonable. But denying that those feelings about her exist, that it just must be something else, seems weird to me.

 

[LittleBuford]

Well, if some rando with a YouTube channels says she's 'smug' then I guess that's that. Obviously, anything she's been in would betray that smugness.

Remember how everyone said that West Side Story failed because of her smugness?

TP, you're really grasping at straws now. Your posts are ridiculous in the literal sense: laughable.

Perhaps she is smug.

Perhaps she does hate classic Disney.

Perhaps she does mean to attack me.

All of that is irrelevant to whether she can act or sing. I’m interested in her professional skills, not in becoming friends with her.

 

[Dranth]

If you think that is all there is and that is all people are complaining about, does that make you intellectually lazy? Based on your posts, I don’t believe that to be the case about you. So saying that about others who have a different opinion on the matter, eh..

It isn’t that someone has a different opinion or that there isn’t more than one issue at play. It is the shoddy nature of the arguments and evidence to back up some of those claims that I have an issue with.

Take the group that thinks she was trashing a Disney classic and/or the fans of the original. No, she didn’t. People are having to twist and misrepresent her words and/or take them completely out of context to get there. They may well have additional reasons to dislike her or be predisposed to dislike the new film but this isn’t a valid one because it is based on misleading or false information.

How about the narrative that she is snotty or smug?

Fine, that is certainly an opinion someone can have but even if true, it is still an opinion that appears to drop all nuance. It also happens to be one that often forms due to our own personal issues, not the speaker, so should be viewed skeptically to begin with.

For example, if you (general you, not you specifically) look at all 20-year-olds and assume they are mostly snotty punks, you are likely to hear a snotty punk when one talks. If you look at all actors and actresses as entitled whiners, you are likely to see an entitled whiner when one is presented to you.

Reality is nearly always less black and white then this type of argument likes to present which is why I tend to callout posts that take this path in general.

 

[Andrew C]

Take the group that thinks she was trashing a Disney classic and/or the fans of the original. No, she didn’t

But that’s your opinion. It comes across as completely different to others. I don’t get why that is so difficult to understand. Different perceptions can and do exist. That’s just a part of life.

It is the shoddy nature of the arguments and evidence to back up some of those claims that I have an issue with.

How does one prove how they feel?

 

[Chi84]

I do not feel attacked at all.

You should because she's attacking you.

How does one prove how they feel?

This entire thread is giving me PTSD from my wedding, where we forgot to specify our first song and the band decided to play “Feelings.”

 

[Disstevefan1]

Hate is such a strong word and if people keep using it for everything, it will lose its meaning for sure.

I truly believe no one hates Zegler.

If there are folks who hate Zegler, I would be worried about them and Zegler.

 

[Californian Elitist]

This entire thread is giving me PTSD from my wedding, where we forgot to specify our first song and the band decided to play “Feelings.”

Band would have been fired on the spot.

 

[LittleBuford]

People intentionally misrepresent “mocking” for “hate”.

I guess that helps their insincere victim slogans.

“Stop Zegler hate!!!” apparently sounds better than “Come on, guys, stop mocking Rachel!!!!”

Most of the posts are neither hateful nor mocking, but scathing. The level of criticism is such that one would think she really had committed some grave, unforgivable sin or injustice.

 

[Dranth]

But that’s your opinion. It comes across as completely different to others. I don’t get why that is so difficult to understand. Different perceptions can and do exist. That’s just a part of life.

I am not challenging that someone feels a certain way, I am challenging the reason.

If someone dislikes another person because of something they said then that is a legit feeling. No one can say that person doesn't feel that way. However, if this person is then presented evidence that changes the narrative, I would expect any reasonable individual to examine and adjust their feelings going forward. In the end, if they still feel a certain way despite evidence that contradicts their claimed reasoning then would you not agree that the stated reason likely wasn't the driving force behind their feelings to begin with?

Now if someone dislikes someone because of how they said something that is also a legit feeling but deserves even more scrutiny because in most cases, it turns out there is more to it when people dig into the why.

Bottom line, I don't doubt that people dislike her, I just think that the reasons for doing so being offered up in this thread are suspect.

 

[Tony the Tigger]

But that’s your opinion. It comes across as completely different to others. I don’t get why that is so difficult to understand. Different perceptions can and do exist. That’s just a part of life.

I disagree. There’s a knowable truth at the heart of all this. She meant one thing or the other.

People either understand what she said or misunderstand what she said.