Lightning Lane at Walt Disney World

[Jrb1979]

The problem is, as I mentioned above, is that the products are typically a mash up of the original idea and whatever nonsense executive leadership jammed into it or took out of it. Thus a compromised/inferior product is born.

That right there is why I find it hard to believe they care so much about guest satisfaction.

 

[Disney Glimpses]

That right there is why I find it hard to believe they care so much about guest satisfaction.

Well, this inferior product wasn't known to be inferior until it was too late haha. They care. If they didn't, they'd leave things as is (they aren't).

 

[Purduevian]

One tweak that would help is up the ratio of LL to Standby and add more people into LL. From things I have heard right now LL is a minimal wait.

The actual wait time of LL is not really dependent on the ratio... Everyone that gets in the LL has to get on the ride in a set amount of time or the LL will build linearly throughout the day.

Imagine a ride that can take 1000 guest per hour. Lets say you want to give 500 of those to LL each hour, or 25 every 5 minutes. So for every person you let in from standby, you also let in a person from LL.

At the start of the day you give 25 LL for the first 5 minutes of park time (9:00am). This leaves the LL with a 0 person line before the next group of 25 are let in (9:05am). This repeats every 5 minutes so that LL always has between a 0 and 24 person line when someone enters.


If instead we add 30 people every 5 minutes, but still let 1 standby for every LL. Now at 9:00am the first 30 people get in line, but at the end of 5 minutes, 5 people still haven't gotten on. Now the 9:05am group gets in line behind the 5 people. Now at 9:10am there are 10 people in line in front of the next group of 30. This keeps going and the LL gets longer and longer throughout the day as more people are let into LL then are getting put on the ride every hour.

If the goal is to have 30 people every 5 minutes, we have to change the ratio of standby to LL. So we let 30 people from LL and 20 from standby every 5 minutes. This way the LL does not grow throughout the day.

TLDR: changing the ratio should NOT change the LL wait times.

 

[Jrb1979]

Well, this inferior product wasn't known to be inferior until it was too late haha. They care. If they didn't, they'd leave things as is (they aren't).

I get that. It's the part of Burbank getting in the way of things. I do think there are some who work in the company that care about the guest. Where it seems to get lost in the shuffle is at Burbank

 

[crazy4disney]

From the business side of things it makes sense and I do understand it. I get why they aren't big on AP holders. From a personal view Disney once was a place for everyone to enjoy. It bothers me to see those at Burbank care more about those who pay the most over everyone else.

listen i totally agree with you on that the pay to play has gone too far with them & i stay value or moderate bc im never in the room and make my trips longer and refuse to pay the rates they want for deluxe. the missed emh at night esp going this summer will stink. i will say this tho renting dvc points is a pretty good option... i could have stayed at AK for around $200 more for a 10 night trip vs Value this summer issue was i need 2 rooms w my mom and they couldnt guarantee me even the same floor

 

[mikejs78]

Except...you are waiting close to an hour to ride.

But:
* An hour is better than 3 hours
* That hour wait is not during park time. So you effectively get more park time

 

[crazy4disney]

Well, this inferior product wasn't known to be inferior until it was too late haha. They care. If they didn't, they'd leave things as is (they aren't).

fair im just afraid the next product or enhancement will be yet another upcharge that will not solve anything close to what we had with fp and then we can start w the conspiracy this was rolled out intentionally to fail to charge even more money for something that was free lol

 

[Disstevefan1]

For one, they are textbook over thinkers and planners when it comes to logistics. But mainly, it is because they are juggling 3 classes of people (resort guests, off site day ticket guests, local APs) and create rules to navigate that dynamic in ways that they feel would efficiently distribute supply/demand. And in light of that, they are increasingly willing to place the burden of their logistics onto the guest (Park Pass, Genie+ rules) rather than absorb it internally. This is the biggest mistake.

I wonder how would have gone keeping the previous FastPass + system with the park pass reservation system?

 

[pdude81]

I wonder how would have gone keeping the previous FastPass + system with the park pass reservation system?

They cheaped out and used FP+ for the park reservations, right? At least that's what I thought they did, while building out the new framework. So in that case, they'd have a lot of trouble making them work together.

Not that a park reservation system would have been super hard to do, but perhaps they liked the display code and the links already being available in MDE.

 

[Jrb1979]

fair im just afraid the next product or enhancement will be yet another upcharge that will not solve anything close to what we had with fp and then we can start w the conspiracy this was rolled out intentionally to fail to charge even more money for something that was free lol

That last point is why I think most are upset. It used to be free and now you are paying for it.

I do believe @disneyglimpses in that the biggest issue is that too many people buy it. Then if comes back to what I have been saying. There isn't enough capacity for everyone to have access to Genie+ or FP+. That's IMO another problem Disney created. They built into people's heads that skip the line should be available to everyone.

 

[Disney Glimpses]

That last point is why I think most are upset. It used to be free and now you are paying for it.

I do believe @disneyglimpses in that the biggest issue is that too many people buy it. Then if comes back to what I have been saying. There isn't enough capacity for everyone to have access to Genie+ or FP+. That's IMO another problem Disney created. They built into people's heads that skip the line should be available to everyone.

The FP offering needs to do all of three things:

1. Continue to make $500,000 to $1,000,000 per day
2. Priced so just enough people use it that it's a good experience/value
3. Have no negative impacts to Private VIP Tour business

Good luck with that one!

 

[mikejs78]

That last point is why I think most are upset. It used to be free and now you are paying for it.

Honestly it doesn't bother me so much. Every other park charges for skip the line, and fast pass was becoming unsustainable for free. I'm not happy about paying $15, But it's not my biggest issue by far.

My biggest issue by far is the fact that the system is a steaming pile of horse , and is inferior in every way to the previous free version.

If you're going to charge me, at least make it as good or better. But Genie+ is a definite downgrade for a fee.

 

[mikejs78]

The FP offering needs to do all of three things:

1. Continue to make $500,000 to $1,000,000 per day
2. Priced so just enough people use it that it's a good experience/value
3. Have no negative impacts to Private VIP Tour business

Good luck with that one!

4. Not make guests curse and scream at it.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

why should Disney change a system and cater to people staying off property and spending their disposable money elsewhere and not with Disney to maybe satisfy a select few? it makes No business sense at all. They offer the VIP tours as a solution to that which obviously is expensive and cost more than say an Express pass but they do allow up to 10 people so you do have an option.

Huh?
Disney should want to create a product that everyone wants to buy.
Happy visitors =return customers = brand loyalty.
Casual customers will only increase spending when they think a product has value.

Think of free samples.

You see Glob cookies in the store, but you have no idea how they taste. Do you buy 0 cookies, 1 cookie, or 1,000 Glob cookies?

Most of us would not buy the 1,000 cookie mega-package unless we are certain we like Glob cookies.

Actually, most of us would not buy a 1,000 cookie package unless we are certain our whole household likes Glob cookies.

We buy one, try it. The next time we buy a slightly bigger package, so we have enough to share. If the cookies are well-received, only then do we buy the mega box.

 

[yensidtlaw1969]

The FP offering needs to do all of three things:

1. Continue to make $500,000 to $1,000,000 per day
2. Priced so just enough people use it that it's a good experience/value
3. Have no negative impacts to Private VIP Tour business

Good luck with that one!

Can the money lost from cannibalizing VIP Tours not handily be made up by the Fastpass offering? If they're making an extra million a day on Genie+ and could turn it into two million without lifting much of a finger, I wonder why they'd avoid that to protect Private Tours.

Do VIP Tours generate that much money for the company? Or is there some other X Factor there?

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

Really?

So, you head into the parks in the busy summer months and see FOP at 3 hours wait.....and you don't see rope dropping it 30 minutes before general admission and waiting just 10 minutes for the same ride...and you don't see that as a perk?......really?

Wha?

Ayla said she tried it, and in her view the perk was not much of a perk.

It is not much of a perk.

For one thing, only PART of the park is open early. So it only takes a few seconds for 7DMT to be...a long line. If you aren't physically able to be at the front of the pack, you lose.

Again, winners and losers. If you are one of the lucky folks, and you wait less than 10minutes-you get a short wait for 1 headliner. WIN!

MANY times, I have done EVERYTHING I was supposed to do, and STILL been stuck on a monorail, or waited on a bus/boat that did not arrive for more than 20minutes.

Most recently, I followed the rules and G+ jammed up on me.

Most recently, I followed all the rules, but my magicband did not work at the tap-style. For the entire visit. The CM's kept assuring me they had fixed the problem and it would work NEXT time, but it didn't. I was held up every time I entered a park.

Now the extra deluxe hotel PM hours are worthwhile. Those are long enough to be of some value.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

When I say 'rope drop' I don't mean getting to the rope the minute the park opens.....I mean getting to the gate about 45mins before the Disney Guests opening time...literally being on, or very close to the rope...and then heading straight to the main attraction...In the past rope dropping every huge ride at Disney, I've never waited more than 10 minutes by rope dropping.

Hence Why I think the 30 minutes early entry for every park for resort guests is a HUGE benefit...its like a free $15 ILL per person every day for FOP, ROTR, 7D etc

a rose is a rose is a rose is a rose is a rose.

45minutes of waiting is 45minutes of waiting is 45minutes of waiting....

So you didn't wait 10minutes, you waited 55minutes for that 1st ride.

 

[Ayla]

Wha?

Ayla said she tried it, and in her view the perk was not much of a perk.

It is not much of a perk.

For one thing, only PART of the park is open early. So it only takes a few seconds for 7DMT to be...a long line. If you aren't physically able to be at the front of the pack, you lose.

Again, winners and losers. If you are one of the lucky folks, and you wait less than 10minutes-you get a short wait for 1 headliner. WIN!

MANY times, I have done EVERYTHING I was supposed to do, and STILL been stuck on a monorail, or waited on a bus/boat that did not arrive for more than 20minutes.

Most recently, I followed the rules and G+ jammed up on me.

Most recently, I followed all the rules, but my magicband did not work at the tap-style. For the entire visit. The CM's kept assuring me they had fixed the problem and it would work NEXT time, but it didn't. I was held up every time I entered a park.

Now the extra deluxe hotel PM hours are worthwhile. Those are long enough to be of some value.

Yes, the evening hours are totally worth it. We walked on every single ride.

 

[Andrew25]

The FP offering needs to do all of three things:

1. Continue to make $500,000 to $1,000,000 per day
2. Priced so just enough people use it that it's a good experience/value
3. Have no negative impacts to Private VIP Tour business

Good luck with that one!

1) Sell an "Ultimate Fastpass+" for $200+ per person, per park (or multi-park version like Universal). You would only need 5,000 (~5-6%) guests split between the 4 parks to make $1,000,000 at a starting price of $200 - which is just a starting price.
2) Universal gets away with charging ~$200 on some peak days, and Disney can easily charge an additional 50% because magic.
3) Keep it under $400, and the VIP tours won't be affected.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

Well, this inferior product wasn't known to be inferior until it was too late haha. They care. If they didn't, they'd leave things as is (they aren't).

But they have left it in place for 6+ months.