Lightning Lane at Walt Disney World

[Splash4eva]

What would physically prevent a non-disabled guest from waiting in a two hour line three times in a single day?

Nothing!!! People cant provide any hard facts DAS users are not eligible so now we move the goal posts & redefine “abuse”

 

[Brian]

Because life and ability is a spectrum and the average person is not going to be able to wait in a 2 hour line three times in one day? I mean is this really controversial?

They could if they really wanted to, though. A DAS-eligible guest cannot, so they use DAS.

Again, this all comes down to physical abilities, not convenience.

 

[UNCgolf]

Because life and ability is a spectrum and the average person is not going to be able to wait in a 2 hour line three times in one day? I mean is this really controversial?

There are numerous attractions with long lines, though. Waiting more than once for the same attraction isn't significantly different than doing it multiple times for separate attractions -- Slinky Dog, e.g., sometimes has waits longer than Rise.

Regardless, preventing DAS users from riding an attraction more than once would almost certainly violate the ADA, considering regular guests have no such restriction.

 

[Splash4eva]

Well, specific figures are considered proprietary and it's not cool to share that information publicly.

If Disney had any hard evidence anyone has lied about DAS they would be easily able to stop them.

 

[Fido Chuckwagon]

They could if they really wanted to

I mean, if you think the “average” person, the “average” child, the “average” toddler, the “average” family is capable of standing in a 2+ hour line three times a day without issue I don’t know what to tell you.

 

[Fido Chuckwagon]

If Disney had any hard evidence anyone has lied about DAS they would be easily able to stop them.

Gathering such evidence is necessarily nearly impossible because of the way the ADA is structured. All you will ever get is circumstantial evidence, such as the statistics provided in this thread.

 

[Splash4eva]

Ive used DAS since i can remember… im sure they know every ride ive chosen times etc along with my Genie rides & ILL ive purchased. If at any point they felt ive abused ir should not qualify im confident my next trip i would be denied. Especially that unlike many i dont hide my concerns. I literally tell them my conditions issues & concerns & why i request for my needs. Every time ive been approved in seconds… no questions asked.

 

[Brian]

I mean, if you think the “average” person, the “average” child, the “average” toddler, the “average” family is capable of standing in a 2+ hour line three times a day without issue I don’t know what to tell you.

They are physically capable of doing so. They may not want to, which would be perfectly understandable, but they are physically capable.

DAS-eligible guests are not, hence why they have DAS. So long as the non-disabled guest can enter the standby queue as many times as they please, so too should a disabled guest with DAS be able to make the selection more than once per day.

 

[Fido Chuckwagon]

They are physically capable of doing so

We will just have to agree to disagree here. Again, if you think the “average” toddler, child, or even family is physically capable of waiting in a 2+ hour line three times in a day, then we are just living in different realities and there is no point in continuing this. Necessity for bathroom use alone belies this, but whatever, I will show myself out. My children sure as heck are not capable of this.

 

[Splash4eva]

Gathering such evidence is necessarily nearly impossible because of the way the ADA is structured. All you will ever get is circumstantial evidence, such as the statistics provided in this thread.

As i just said. Disney im sure has a log of every ride & time ive used. I admit i do rides multiple times a day. Why wouldnt i? If they felt that was abuse or was being done abundantly imo they would do something. They havent nor stopped anyone from doing it. Its been a hot topic now bc Disney feels this may be impeding on a profit stream. Anyone who think Disney is doing this to mKe a better guest experience is drinking the kool aid & kidding themselves

 

[UNCgolf]

We will just have to agree to disagree here. Again, if you think the “average” toddler, child, or even family is physically capable of waiting in a 2+ hour line three times in a day, then we are just living in different realities and there is no point in continuing this. Necessity for bathroom use alone belies this, but whatever, I will show myself out.

As I said above, this argument would only make sense if Rise (or any other attraction) was the only one in the park with long lines. That's obviously not the case, so it doesn't really make any difference if someone is riding Rise three times vs. riding Rise once, Slinky Dog once (which sometimes has longer waits than Rise), and Tower of Terror/TSM/MMRR once (they are generally shorter waits than Rise, but can all hit 90+ minutes too).

And again, even then it's moot, because it's incredibly unlikely that the ADA would allow Disney to prevent someone from riding the same attraction more than once -- unless they extended this restriction to all guests.

 

[Splash4eva]

IIRC Uni’s system is the same that i used for GA… basically its the same as now only thing that is needed is supporting documentation from your Dr to upload…

 

[DryerLintFan]

There was a very detailed post just four pages ago that demonstrated how an apparently small percentage of guests are utilizing an inexplicably disproportionate percentage of capacity on popular rides.

Just a point of clarification, that data and that lawsuit were related to abuse of a different system a decade ago. It’s an interesting data set, but it is not directly related to either DAS or current usage of disability services. You can draw correlations, though

 

[Jrb1979]

We will just have to agree to disagree here. Again, if you think the “average” toddler, child, or even family is physically capable of waiting in a 2+ hour line three times in a day, then we are just living in different realities and there is no point in continuing this. Necessity for bathroom use alone belies this, but whatever, I will show myself out. My children sure as heck are not capable of this.

How do people manage at regional parks when the option for short waits is too expensive for most?

 

[Dranth]

As i just said. Disney im sure has a log of every ride & time ive used. I admit i do rides multiple times a day. Why wouldnt i? If they felt that was abuse or was being done abundantly imo they would do something. They havent nor stopped anyone from doing it. Its been a hot topic now bc Disney feels this may be impeding on a profit stream. Anyone who think Disney is doing this to mKe a better guest experience is drinking the kool aid & kidding themselves

You assume it is a money grab but how does that make sense? The people who need it will still get it under the new system so the only ones who will have to pay not to wait in a physical line are the ones who are taking advantage. If the abuse is as small as you seem to think it will not amount to any real money for Disney.

With that in mind, why would they risk all the negative press, all the pushback, the potential lawsuits and monetary damages, all the angry guests to change something that does not generate any real additional revenue?

Here is what we do know.
- The previous system was being abused so Disney changed it.
- They were challenged in court and proved that it was being abused.
- In the ten years since, Disney has become more expensive and more crowded.
- G+ was introduced removing the free, FP+.
- Little to no additional capacity was added to handle the increased crowds.

Which one of those factors makes you think there is LESS incentive to cheat now vs. the last time they changed it?

Even if we throw all that aside, you keep saying they would stop it if it was happening. Well, by changing the system, they are doing exactly that.

Bottom line, what we all want is for the abuse to stop, not ruin the system for those that need it.

 

[John park hopper]

Riding the same high demand attraction multiple times in a day using DAS probably is abuse in the eyes of many.

Absolutely abuse

 

[Disneydad1012]

If Disney had any hard evidence anyone has lied about DAS they would be easily able to stop them.

Thats the problem...Disney has no idea they don't really "need". At my work I have 5 co-workers that I know go to Disney regularly. 2 of them lie about a disability to get "free genie+" and are amazed that we don't do it to. So by my hard evidence...lol 40% are abusing it.

 

[mikejs78]

Absolutely abuse

Absolutely not abuse. Unless you start limiting people from getting in the standby line for major attractions, you cannot under the ADA limit the use of DAS to only once per day. Keep in mind, that you can only have one DAS at a time, so if RotR is a 2 hour wait, then you can't get another DAS for another 2 hours.

 

[Splash4eva]

You assume it is a money grab but how does that make sense? The people who need it will still get it under the new system so the only ones who will have to pay not to wait in a physical line are the ones who are taking advantage. If the abuse is as small as you seem to think it will not amount to any real money for Disney.

With that in mind, why would they risk all the negative press, all the pushback, the potential lawsuits and monetary damages, all the angry guests to change something that does not generate any real additional revenue?

Here is what we do know.
- The previous system was being abused so Disney changed it.
- They were challenged in court and proved that it was being abused.
- In the ten years since, Disney has become more expensive and more crowded.
- G+ was introduced removing the free, FP+.
- Little to no additional capacity was added to handle the increased crowds.

Which one of those factors makes you think there is LESS incentive to cheat now vs. the last time they changed it?

Even if we throw all that aside, you keep saying they would stop it if it was happening. Well, by changing the system, they are doing exactly that.

Bottom line, what we all want is for the abuse to stop, not ruin the system for those that need it.

I guess time will tell when they change the system yet again and how they move forward… personally anyone who thinks anything Disney does regarding this is gonna make lines any better imo are in for another shock

 

[Splash4eva]

Thats the problem...Disney has no idea they don't really "need". At my work I have 5 co-workers that I know go to Disney regularly. 2 of them lie about a disability to get "free genie+" and are amazed that we don't do it to. So by my hard evidence...lol 40% are abusing it.

And thats fine as ive already said i know about 20 and all need it legit… so im at 0%