Layoffs underway at Walt Disney World

[peter11435]

lThere were many other areas where a return on that investment would have been better utilized than the billions spent on Star Wars-it was not a great business decision and their return will not pay off as anticipated.

Oh really? What would have been a better investment?

You realize it's already made them billions? And will continue to do so. And the billions they spent were for much more than just Star Wars.

 

[GoofGoof]

Disney has a disaster at ESPN-over paid for Star Wars thinking it would be the same phenomenon it was in the earlier years and it is not nor will it

ESPN has well documented issues. Your completely wrong on Star Wars. Even if you don’t like the new films or refuse to watch them because Disney owns the brand now, the Lucas Film acquisition may turn out to be one of the best deals of all time for TWDC. Many analysts initially felt the price may have been too high and was a risk for Disney but once Force Awakens topped $2B worldwide and Rogue One was over $1B any doubt went away. It would not be surprising if episodes 8 and 9 combined grossed another $3B. They will probably make their initial money back on the Lucasfilm purchase with just the boxoffice profit from the first 5 films already being made. That doesn’t include any future films (which they are planning), TV series or most importantly ancillary sales.

Historically the Star Wars brand has made something like $4 in Toy/merchandise and ancillary sales for every dollar earned at the box office. Even assuming that number drops to $2 (which there’s no reason to think it would given strong merchandise and video game licensing revenues so far) the value of Lucasfilms is now still probably worth well north of $10B which is significantly more than the $4B Disney paid. Those numbers also don’t include potential synergies like theme park lands and hotels and TV series on the new Disney streaming service they plan to roll out which makes those businesses more successful.

They also have the Indy franchise with Lucasfilm which has the potential to make some money for Disney as well.

 

[Rumrunner]

The percentage Disney is requesting from theaters for Star Wars in NOT unprecedented. Unusual, yes, but Star Wars is a huge moneymaker, and they have the right to ask whatever percentage they deem that it is worth.

Force Awakens 2 billion Rogue One 1 billion. That is a big drop and that is why Disney is playing hard ball. Frozen generated as much as Star Wars in merchandise and they didn't spend 4 billion to purchase Frozen. If it was such a great deal Disney stock would not be down 10% while other stocks are running up nicely.

 

[GoofGoof]

Force Awakens 2 billion Rogue One 1 billion. That is a big drop and that is why Disney is playing hard ball.

You want to make a bet that Last Jedi exceeds Rogue One? It won’t even be close. The stand alone movies were never expected to be as big as the Skywalker trilogy. Rogue One was generally much more successful than internal and critical expectations. It was a smash success.

 

[AEfx]

over paid for Star Wars thinking it would be the same phenomenon it was in the earlier years and it is not nor will it be

And exactly what planet do you live upon where Star Wars isn't making more money than ever? It's bigger than it ever was, because now instead of the merchandise and ancillary product being primarily focused on male children, it's still appealing to them, the girls now, too - and two generations of adults who grew up on it and have shared the interest with their own families.

I'm not sure how one could be considered to have overpaid for an investment that has easily already paid for itself when you combine the films, books, toys, "adult collectables", games, etc. Not to mention the massive profits it's going to bring to WDW in two short years.

 

[peter11435]

Force Awakens 2 billion Rogue One 1 billion. That is a big drop and that is why Disney is playing hard ball. Frozen generated as much as Star Wars in merchandise and they didn't spend 4 billion to purchase Frozen. If it was such a great deal Disney stock would not be down 10% while other stocks are running up nicely.

That has nothing nothing with why Disney is playing hardball. That drop was expected and forecasted.

You really don't understand how the leverage in this industry works. You don't/can't demand more from movies you don't expect to perform.

 

[AEfx]

You want to make a bet that Last Jedi exceeds Rogue One? It won’t even be close. The stand alone movies were never expected to be as big as the Skywalker trilogy. Rogue One was generally much more successful than internal and critical expectations. It was a smash success.

He clearly hasn't a single clue about Star Wars. It's kind of funny. I bet he is one of the types that think Rogue One was a movie full of girls, too, haha.

Rogue One is actually the proof of how strong the Star Wars brand is, especially since the real fan-service connections to the franchise were kept secret because they largely occur in the last ten minutes of the film. As much as I love the classic trilogy, it entirely proved that the Star Wars concepts can be put into what is largely an original film with almost all brand-new characters, they didn't even promote the most promotable features of the film, and it STILL made a billion bucks.

Star Wars is going to continue to make money for decades to come. It's survived 40 years, it's as evergreen as evergreen gets - and you bet your behind that every other studio is crying in their C-3PO's cereal that they didn't get to buy it themselves.

 

[NearTheEars]

Disney has a disaster at ESPN-over paid for Star Wars thinking it would be the same phenomenon it was in the earlier years and it is not nor will it be, cancelling simple things like the night parade, rolling up the sidewalks at MK earlier and earlier. I also am a big Disney fan but feel they just don't listen to the consumers with a understanding or caring ear. Constructive criticism is a good thing. And Ford is right about Iger-he seems to be using Disney as his liberal platform for a presidential run. That is wrong on so many fronts.

Wait did you just say Star Wars isn’t as popular as it used to be? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

Edit: And Rogue 1 was a standalone film with one-off characters, not trilogy. Of course it was going to make less. Last Jedi will be the only comparison.

 

[AEfx]

It was always a mall inasmuch as it was a collection of stores, but it used to have varied entertainment options and a unique aesthetic. Now it resembles a great number of other "lifestyle centers" in trendy neighborhoods around the country and lacks... well... really any entertainment outside the cinema. There really ain't much reason to go there if you don't want to shop. Plus, all the new construction is working hard to remove any trace of "Disney" from the complex, confining that branding to the Marketplace, a remnant of an earlier version of the place. It is, in my opinion, a rather colossal placemaking failure.

I think you've hit the nail on the head why many don't find it to be the bee's knees - it's the lack of the Mouse (figuratively and literally).

A friend of mine (who has been all of twice before, so not terribly knowledgeable about WDW), offhandedly mentioned not long ago that they were really surprised by it on their recent visit. With the name Disney Springs, they really expected "Disney" somewhere there. The reason she brought it up was to ask me if she had somehow missed something, because she said (I quote) "If it hadn't been for the weather, I would have sworn I was in Freeport or Cape Cod....except the water was fake" (two of hundred or so seaside coastal towns that are nearly identical to it).

It's pretty, no doubt. But also pretty generic.

I don’t really get the argument that it looks too much like a local mall to visit.

Of course, what is local to everyone is going to be different - but here is the type of place folks are talking about. We aren't talking 1970's/80's style indoor malls. Places that are pretty much indistinguishable from Disney Springs are up and down the seaboard on both coasts, at least. Places like this:

 

[Disone]

I find his lack of faith disturbing.

Best post of the week!

 

[mikejs78]

he deserves blame for the mismanagement of the parks for the last several decades just as much as he deserves credit for the astute handling of the film division.

Iger deserves some blame, but not for the last several decades. He's only been CEO since 2005 - so that's a little more than a decade. Before that you can blame Eisner. He was CEO for 20 years....

 

[AEfx]

Iger deserves some blame, but not for the last several decades. He's only been CEO since 2005 - so that's a little more than a decade. Before that you can blame Eisner. He was CEO for 20 years....

And people used to. I mean, people here cheered when Eisner was humiliated and ousted from the company in one of the most embarrassing events in corporate American history.

I fully expect the new CEO to become take the mantle of Sith Lord, and Darth Iger will be remembered much differently in ten years than folks think he will be now.

 

[Casper Gutman]

Iger deserves some blame, but not for the last several decades. He's only been CEO since 2005 - so that's a little more than a decade. Before that you can blame Eisner. He was CEO for 20 years....

Of course. But I am loathe to criticize Eisner, because as detrimental as his last years were, he deserves a great deal of credit for saving Disney as a whole and overseeing WDW's glory days during the first 10 years of his administration.

As to the joy some experienced at his ouster, I never got that - I was more saddened by his decline and by the DCA boondoggle than anything else. I don't think Iger's reputation will grow by much in hindsight - although again, he has been amazingly successful on the film front.

 

[Pixieish]

I think you've hit the nail on the head why many don't find it to be the bee's knees - it's the lack of the Mouse (figuratively and literally).

A friend of mine (who has been all of twice before, so not terribly knowledgeable about WDW), offhandedly mentioned not long ago that they were really surprised by it on their recent visit. With the name Disney Springs, they really expected "Disney" somewhere there. The reason she brought it up was to ask me if she had somehow missed something, because she said (I quote) "If it hadn't been for the weather, I would have sworn I was in Freeport or Cape Cod....except the water was fake" (two of hundred or so seaside coastal towns that are nearly identical to it).

It's pretty, no doubt. But also pretty generic.



Of course, what is local to everyone is going to be different - but here is the type of place folks are talking about. We aren't talking 1970's/80's style indoor malls. Places that are pretty much indistinguishable from Disney Springs are up and down the seaboard on both coasts, at least. Places like this:

Yep, we have at least 3 that I can think of off the top of my head on the east coast of MA.

 

[GoofGoof]

I think you've hit the nail on the head why many don't find it to be the bee's knees - it's the lack of the Mouse (figuratively and literally).

A friend of mine (who has been all of twice before, so not terribly knowledgeable about WDW), offhandedly mentioned not long ago that they were really surprised by it on their recent visit. With the name Disney Springs, they really expected "Disney" somewhere there. The reason she brought it up was to ask me if she had somehow missed something, because she said (I quote) "If it hadn't been for the weather, I would have sworn I was in Freeport or Cape Cod....except the water was fake" (two of hundred or so seaside coastal towns that are nearly identical to it).

It's pretty, no doubt. But also pretty generic.



Of course, what is local to everyone is going to be different - but here is the type of place folks are talking about. We aren't talking 1970's/80's style indoor malls. Places that are pretty much indistinguishable from Disney Springs are up and down the seaboard on both coasts, at least. Places like this:

That looks like a pretty generic outlet mall to me. The Town Center section of Disney Springs that has mostly stores does look pretty similar to some high end outdoor shopping malls, but there’s still a lot more to Disney Springs than just that. I’m not familiar at all with Freeport Village Station but does it have

• A large lakefront area with boat/cars you can rent
• A hot air balloon you can ride
• A Splitsville bowling Alley
• A House of Blues
• A Cirque Du Soleil theater
• Entertainment venues with live music
• A decent number of kid friendly restaurants like Rain Forest and T-Rex
• Dozens of high end restaurants

And that doesn’t include the Disney specific or specialty stores mostly in the marketplace area like World of Disney and LEGO Store. So while a section of Disney Springs May resemble a mall I stand by my statement that I don’t get the argument that because of that it’s not worth visiting. I haven’t come across many places that I would say are indistinguishable from Disney Springs. I wish I had something like that local to me.

 

[JoeSchmoe]

Sorry about the thread drift. Good luck. Hopefully it won’t be as bad as you fear.

Are there any opportunities to transfer into other roles with these layoffs or is it mostly if you receive notice, you are gone?

From what I have heard, most if not all of the recent layoff are being given assistance in finding new roles either inside or outside the company.

 

[JoeSchmoe]

ESPN is a disaster-when you turn a profit machine into what appears to be an albatross because of poor decisions-it it a disaster. There were many other areas where a return on that investment would have been better utilized than the billions spent on Star Wars-it was not a great business decision and their return will not pay off as anticipated. Yea whatever on the parade. That sounds like double speak for short changing the customers. It is foolish to be an apologist for Iger as you seem to be.

As I understand it, the cost of purchasing the Lucas properties was recouped almost immediately through merchandising. If you think that was a bad investment, you're kidding yourself.

 

[AEfx]

So while a section of Disney Springs May resemble a mall I stand by my statement that I don’t get the argument that because of that it’s not worth visiting.

I don't think that's what people are saying, though. I mean, some folks have said they personally have no reason to be there, but the point people are arguing is that it isn't largely some "unique Disney experience", nor evidence of some masterful or "must see!" addition to WDW. Or some sort of proof that WDW has been adding amazing attractions for guests. You know, how we are always going on about how everything at Disney be unique and special and original and "only at Disney". It's fine - it's lovely - especially if you are stuck only using Disney transportation, you don't have many other options.

You can disagree with that, as well, but most of the stuff you are referring to was already there before, and/or part of a non-Disney chain that is available elsewhere. A hot air balloon and a boat rental place are cool - but not exactly "innovative" or especially impressive.

 

[AEfx]

As I understand it, the cost of purchasing the Lucas properties was recouped almost immediately through merchandising. If you think that was a bad investment, you're kidding yourself.

Not to mention something I haven't seen brought up - only half of it was in cash, the other half in stocks.

Deal. Of. The. Century.

Especially now with what they have done with it, it's easily worth exponentially more than it was in 2012 as it has proven to be a box office powerhouse all over again.

 

[WDWTrojan]

Outdoor "lifestyle centers" have proved immensely popular throughout the country, offering a leisurely place to stroll around, shop and get good food. Orlando, you must remember, is a city with millions of tourists every year and it had no such place (Winter Park Village is 45 minutes away). The closest non-outlet mall to WDW is 20-25 minutes away - and even there it's based on a very 1980s/90s concept of what shopping is like: inside, the food is low-brow, little to no atmosphere, etc.

Disney Springs was an easy cash grab based on guest research that people (locals and tourists alike) would be likely to spend a significant amount of time at a high-end mall near Disney property. They also saw lots of tourists leaving property to shop at the outlets. Hence why they built a giant mall. Unfortunately, they didn't build something unique or particularly themed, they built what dozens of cities across the US have now - a pretty, outdoor shopping center. Yes, there's a few different "themes" to it (West Side, The Landing, etc) but it's all still a mall no different than what is offered elsewhere in the country. To those offering counterpoints about hot air balloons, House of Blues and Cirque du Soliel - they need to get out more. There's dozens of high-end retails centers across the United States anchored by theaters and/or featuring bowling alleys - heck Anaheim GardenWalk even has a Bowling Alley AND a House of Blues!

To be fair, the previous iteration of Downtown Disney wasn't particularly grand or "Disney," either. The Marketplace feels hopelessly drab and the West Side only exists for the hubs (Cirque, bowling and AMC). Pleasure Island, oddly, was the most Disney thing there. No other place let someone hop to eight different nightclubs on one cover charge but it was so mismanaged in its later years and became such an ugly step-child in the Iger "every child is a princess and we must cater to them only no exceptions"-era that it had no choice but to close.