Journey of Water featuring Moana coming to Epcot

Animaniac93-98

Well-Known Member
‘World nature’ - a new made up overlaid name that has no real visual or emotional connection for guests… and what even establishes it within the park? Can anyone even tell if they are in world nature vs somewhere else?

Nothing in the last 5 years has changed the scale, colour or spatial relation between Imagination and The Land, but now they are in two different themed lands because the current map says so. 🤷‍♂️

Maybe they'll do what they did with New Fantasyland and put up a literal wall between areas? ;)
 

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
Nothing in the last 5 years has changed the scale, colour or spatial relation between Imagination and The Land, but now they are in two different themed lands because the current map says so. 🤷‍♂️

Maybe they'll do what they did with New Fantasyland and put up a literal wall between areas? ;)
"Because the map says so" is the only way you know you've moved from Tomorrowland into Fantasyland, or, from Liberty Square to Frontierland.
 

James Alucobond

Well-Known Member
You should rethink that post before you really let it sit.
I would agree that they make little sense as a comparison. Liberty Square to Frontierland is intentionally subtle and elegantly executed, and there is thoughtful placemaking relative to the Rivers of America. The ability to take everything in simultaneously and have it look cohesive was a conscious choice. Tomorrowland to Fantasyland, on the other hand, is an obvious stylistic transition but a bit clumsy and abrupt without 20k Leagues.

World Nature (and Discovery, for that matter) is problematic because, from certain approaches, there is really no transition at all. It’s neither deft nor clumsy; it’s just nonexistent. I’m still a bit baffled that they’re not trying to pull Imagination into Nature. Without doing so, you end up with weird things like the World Nature bathrooms existing within World Celebration.
 

networkpro

Well-Known Member
In the Parks
Yes
‘World nature’ - a new made up overlaid name that has no real visual or emotional connection for guests… and what even establishes it within the park? Can anyone even tell if they are in world nature vs somewhere else?

It beats hands down most of the splashed concrete sections of Magic Kingdom and Hollywood Studios when it comes to landscaping.
 

James Alucobond

Well-Known Member
It’s not just the lack of a queue but also around Moana herself. There’s no ability to have simultaneous meet and greets as is done with other popular characters in dedicated spaces. Nor is there really the ability for Moana to dip backstage and quickly switch actresses so that they can run meet and greets continuously throughout the day.
I might be wrong on this, but doesn't she actually have relatively quick utilidor access via this path?
utilidor_access.png


I know there's not a connector there in the site plan, but I'm pretty sure there's been one visible in the aerial photos unless it was temporary for the construction. I've not seen a video of the area yet with the walls down since it's mostly been roped off for the previews.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
I might be wrong on this, but doesn't she actually have relatively quick utilidor access via this path?
View attachment 747612

I know there's not a connector there in the site plan, but I'm pretty sure there's been one visible in the aerial photos unless it was temporary for the construction. I've not seen a video of the area yet with the walls down since it's mostly been roped off for the previews.
That’s what I’d call a problem. In order to switch actresses, the onstage Moana has to leave her meet and greet, clearly in view and walk down to that stair, then, only after she has clearly entered the backstage space can the next Moana come out on stage and proceed to the meet and greet. That’s a process despite being nestled into an otherwise backstage space. Think of something like the Main Street Theater or Royal Summerhus where there are multiple rooms. That could have been done with rock work and landscaping to create “rooms” and the ability to have multiple meet and greets. Even for just one meet and greet it would have been possible to at least be able to rotate through cast without guests seeing it occur.
 

Animaniac93-98

Well-Known Member
That’s what I’d call a problem. In order to switch actresses, the onstage Moana has to leave her meet and greet, clearly in view and walk down to that stair, then, only after she has clearly entered the backstage space can the next Moana come out on stage and proceed to the meet and greet. That’s a process despite being nestled into an otherwise backstage space. Think of something like the Main Street Theater or Royal Summerhus where there are multiple rooms. That could have been done with rock work and landscaping to create “rooms” and the ability to have multiple meet and greets. Even for just one meet and greet it would have been possible to at least be able to rotate through cast without guests seeing it occur.

Perhaps the addition of a meet and greet was a late decision to the project which is why it wasn't built like most greeting venues for a character of that popularity.
 

James Alucobond

Well-Known Member
That’s what I’d call a problem. In order to switch actresses, the onstage Moana has to leave her meet and greet, clearly in view and walk down to that stair, then, only after she has clearly entered the backstage space can the next Moana come out on stage and proceed to the meet and greet. That’s a process despite being nestled into an otherwise backstage space. Think of something like the Main Street Theater or Royal Summerhus where there are multiple rooms. That could have been done with rock work and landscaping to create “rooms” and the ability to have multiple meet and greets. Even for just one meet and greet it would have been possible to at least be able to rotate through cast without guests seeing it occur.
It certainly could have been done, but I guess I just fail to see why that's much of a problem. Relatively speaking, it's a short walk, and I feel like I see tons of M&Gs walk into position in EPCOT, sometimes over much greater distances.
 

WondersOfLife

Blink, blink. Breathe, breathe. Day in, day out.
I would agree that they make little sense as a comparison. Liberty Square to Frontierland is intentionally subtle and elegantly executed, and there is thoughtful placemaking relative to the Rivers of America. The ability to take everything in simultaneously and have it look cohesive was a conscious choice. Tomorrowland to Fantasyland, on the other hand, is an obvious stylistic transition but a bit clumsy and abrupt without 20k Leagues.

World Nature (and Discovery, for that matter) is problematic because, from certain approaches, there is really no transition at all. It’s neither deft nor clumsy; it’s just nonexistent. I’m still a bit baffled that they’re not trying to pull Imagination into Nature. Without doing so, you end up with weird things like the World Nature bathrooms existing within World Celebration.
That's because the front half of Epcot is not made up of lands. It was never designed to be lands. It was designed to include extremely large, impressive, pavilions.. with the theming beginning inside those pavilions. Not the land it is surrounded in.

I agree. World Discovery for the entire front portion would have been a better choice.
 

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
That's because the front half of Epcot is not made up of lands. It was never designed to be lands. It was designed to include extremely large, impressive, pavilions.. with the theming beginning inside those pavilions. Not the land it is surrounded in.

I agree. World Discovery for the entire front portion would have been a better choice.
I agree the three neighborhood distinction is laborious.

But, I'd go for World Celebration over World Discovery. "World Discovery" sounds too science-museum-y to me. If they're doubling down on EPCOT being all-festival all the time, then 'Celebration' works best, IMO.
 

Bocabear

Well-Known Member
I agree the three neighborhood distinction is laborious.

But, I'd go for World Celebration over World Discovery. "World Discovery" sounds too science-museum-y to me. If they're doubling down on EPCOT being all-festival all the time, then 'Celebration' works best, IMO.
but "World Celebration" sounds too much like World Showcase... isn't that what World Showcase is? a celebration around the world? I think all of the names were too contrived and felt designed by committee... The three "neighborhoods" just feels ridiculous especially since one of the three pavilions in a row is not part of that neighborhood... It is just feels poorly thought out.
 

flynnibus

Premium Member
<sits down to consider the complete lack of functional transition in between Speedway and Tea Cups, or the fact that a Mississippi Steamboat is docked in Liberty Square...>

No, I'm fine.

Good day.

You're right.. no one can tell the difference between colonial era costumes and the Georgian architecture of Liberty Square to the timber motiffs of frontierland and or frontierland costumes... nor can they identify the kinds of background music used in each. Your attempt at picking on their relatively smooth transition as some failed distinction is rather horrid. It's some of the slickest work the Imagineer's did where given the space constraints and sightlines achieve quite a feat. Meanwhile, you also fail to miss the obvious in that all your examples there are hooks and ideals that the guests can associate with those lands and hence draw distinction and association with.

Meanwhile... what exactly is the identifiable thread people will associate with 'World Nature' to associate it with their prior knowledge and idea associations? And the same with World Discovery?

They're gonna end up being stuck with icons and color association... because there is basically nothing the guests will bring along with them.
 

SilentWindODoom

Well-Known Member
When I think of recent Meet and Greets being introduced, I think of Gaston. I suppose that's not new anymore, but besides Snow's former home and Sommerhaus, I can't think of any newer places that would fit the criteria mentioned before for quick switches. Is there a lot of those?
 

MisterPenguin

President of Animal Kingdom
Premium Member
but "World Celebration" sounds too much like World Showcase... isn't that what World Showcase is? a celebration around the world? I think all of the names were too contrived and felt designed by committee... The three "neighborhoods" just feels ridiculous especially since one of the three pavilions in a row is not part of that neighborhood... It is just feels poorly thought out.
World Discovery has the same problem. As well as World Plaza. And World's Fair. And World Nature.

Just two World ______ and that's it. Not so hard to keep them distinguished.
 

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