Is attendance really down at WDW this or…

[Tha Realest]

Yes it is off peak

A ticket to MK today is $164, not anywhere near the lowest price and not far off from top price.

Kids are out of school and families are traveling now.

“Off peak” or “seasons have shifted” feels like a convenient excuse belied by any evidence.

 

[flynnibus]

Well, for those of us that live in NYC and work in Manhattan, we kinda do pay those prices every day.

Yeah but disney isn’t paying manhattan rent prices, the yankees payroll, and has more economies of scale. It has every advantage going for it to be cheap… yet you are noting how it’s on par with one of the most expensive places in the world.

Prices are so expensive there (ny) because costs are so expensive. Wdw is a monopoly that is vertically integrated and operates in one of tge cheapest regions in the country.

thank you for framing up the problem….

 

[Laketravis]

On just our last three visits since December the lack of lines at QS and snack stands has been visibly noticeable. Not many are partaking in outrageously expensive Mickey pretzels, etc. The QS's seemed only lightly loaded, we never had an issue finding seating, and the TS's always seemed more than half empty. Whether it was in the parks or at the resorts.

Due to price hikes and lower quality, our previously long list of favorites has dwindled down to just a few over the last 15 years - we still frequent Cape May for dinner even though they took crab legs off the menu and have the audacity to offer it at an additional charge (seldom do I see any takers) and the brunch/lunch AYCE options at Whispering Canyon for less than $30 are still probably the best deal on property although the quality of the menu items has taken a dive and the place hasn't been filled to more than maybe 20% capacity every time we've been there. About the only other TS we will still eat at is Yachtsman's, which is priced comparatively to Capital Grille but nowhere near the quality or portion size.

It seems the reduction in food service capacity has reached it's lowest possible level (you can't close anymore POS's when you are down to one queue or staff a TS below a certain threshold) so I anticipate shortened hours and even some closures in order to squeeze more blood from the stone.

 

[Laketravis]

This was at 1pm in the afternoon and only the front section was open:

 

[James Alucobond]

Food tastes are also highly subjective. That is part of the challenge of talking about WDW food.

Yesterday I got a $10 jumbo burrito (the regular size one is only $6.50) at locally owned place and the quality blows the socks off any similar Mexican food at WDW.

For me, what I find frustrating is the lack of produce at WDW. Even when we eat TS, there is often a lack of vegetables. Menus often list a veggie, but what arrives is merely a tiny garnish. When I pay extra for a side vegetable, the thing that arrives is often terrible quality to the point of being nearly inedible. A good deal of the WDW produce just isn't poor quality and/or not at all fresh. Like their apples are just mealy and nasty. At WDW, I end up eating boring salads every day, and most are not that great.

In the last few days, I bought fresh local berries. Good luck finding berries of any kind at WDW. The Norway bakery used to have a dessert that was a basically a dark chocolate shell cup full of fresh blueberries and raspberries, but that was a long time ago.

Disney could do it, because they used to do it, but quality food costs money.

Then again, many people don't care about eating fruit or vegetables at all.

This is certainly a valid point, but not one really related to the original discussion. The topic was quick service and its quality and value relative to external fast casual options. Ordering fruit and vegetables at any fast casual establishment is at best a game of roulette.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

On just our last three visits since December the lack of lines at QS and snack stands has been visibly noticeable. Not many are partaking in outrageously expensive Mickey pretzels, etc. The QS's seemed only lightly loaded, we never had an issue finding seating, and the TS's always seemed more than half empty. Whether it was in the parks or at the resorts.

Due to price hikes and lower quality, our previously long list of favorites has dwindled down to just a few over the last 15 years - we still frequent Cape May for dinner even though they took crab legs off the menu and have the audacity to offer it at an additional charge (seldom do I see any takers) and the brunch/lunch AYCE options at Whispering Canyon for less than $30 are still probably the best deal on property although the quality of the menu items has taken a dive and the place hasn't been filled to more than maybe 20% capacity every time we've been there. About the only other TS we will still eat at is Yachtsman's, which is priced comparatively to Capital Grille but nowhere near the quality or portion size.

It seems the reduction in food service capacity has reached it's lowest possible level (you can't close anymore POS's when you are down to one queue or staff a TS below a certain threshold) so I anticipate shortened hours and even some closures in order to squeeze more blood from the stone.

I’ve observed the quicks slow…the tables dead

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

Not necessarily. They know, due in part to the pandemic, absense makes the heart grow fonder, and people will pay the higher prices if they take a break from visiting for a few years.

By the time that wears out, they will have $60B in New attractions to get them to come back.




This thread goes back and forth from saying the parks are empty and no one is there to insisting the parks are still packed and everyone is miserable from the crowding. Seriously which is it?

Which one is it today?

I think it is a bit of both. It seems like the total numbers are down, but Disney is doing their best to hide it.

As much as people complain about long waits, they also don't want Rise to be walk-on all the time. If the last few years have shown us anything, it is that We- the general we- crave being around other people. To simplify, we are herd animals. We don't want to be the stray antelope that gets picked off by the lion. (sorry, just watched a nature documentary last night).

We want to be where the people are....

But then we also like to complain about the crowds. It is a double bonus! We get to be in the popular place AND complain that it is too popular, and double bonus, we get to complain about all the things those annoying people do.

How long have you been a member of this forum?


This is the Magic of Disney. (in my best sing-song voice)

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

Its not Genie… the cutbacks to hours was long before that. It’s all about saving OpEx

Same thing with the hotels… when you are forced by your overlords to keep finding growth and protecting margins… you trim expenses to make up for revenue you can’t shake from the tree. Profit growth ends up coming from cost cutting.

And Disney stopped being a resort a long time ago… you’re paying inclusive resort prices and getting motel level amenities.

I wasn't so much blaming G+. I saw the same thing in the days of FP+. In the days of FP-, the parks were busy past midnight. But then under FP+, once people ran out of fast passes, they were less eager to stay. It changed a little when 4th FP came along, but many people didn't book a 4th FP. So the parks aren't as crowded at night, and that = further cuts.

I'm partly speaking for myself, but if I'm in HS, and all the good G+ passes are gone, and the (current posted) wait for Aliens SS is 45 minutes, MMRR down, MF:SR 40, Sinky 70, RSM 60, ToT 70. none of those waits are very appealing to me. What am I going to do, watch Muppets 10 times until park close?

As I also just posted, shorter park hours also give the illusion that WDW is more crowded than it is. People can't spread out time-wise.

 

[Laketravis]

100% correct.

In short, a stroke of short-term brilliance that's bringing about long-term disaster.

Sounds like more of the All Star complex is going offline (if not already), and a chunk of capacity could be moving over to some of the blind or aggregate booking sites. If you want an absolute bottom-dollar price on a Value Resort, keep searching Hotwire / Booking / Kayak, etc.

Seeing that. Seems like they are trying to lead with the higher priced offerings when shopping the current promos.

When do you think the next round of discounts (Winter) will come out?

 

[bwr827]

For me, what I find frustrating is the lack of produce at WDW. Even when we eat TS, there is often a lack of vegetables. Menus often list a veggie, but what arrives is merely a tiny garnish. When I pay extra for a side vegetable, the thing that arrives is often terrible quality to the point of being nearly inedible.

Agreed - which led me to a pleasant surprise on our last trip when we checked out of Disney and headed to Universal and the Cabana Bay resort. Their food court meals came with plenty of veggies if you wanted. Maybe not fantastic veggies, but hearty at least.

 

[MickeyLuv'r]

Agreed - which led me to a pleasant surprise on our last trip when we checked out of Disney and headed to Universal and the Cabana Bay resort. Their food court meals came with plenty of veggies if you wanted. Maybe not fantastic veggies, but hearty at least.

Agreed, I dare say....I know many on this forum live in Europe, and I am sure Universal's attempts at British food are probably pale attempts, but one entree I love is the minted peas offered at Leaky Cauldron. The Bangers and Mash comes with some great sides. Where else can you get root veggies, sauteed onions, and roasted tomato as a QS option?

Some of the food at Universal is bad, and when it is bad, it is really bad. But have some great options.

We LOVED the new Minions popsicles. I imagine they have some added sugar, but they actually taste like frozen fruit (or at least lemonade), not the Powerade stuff WDW offers everywhere.

 

[PREMiERdrum]

When do you think the next round of discounts (Winter) will come out?

A conundrum here, as every new discount can (and most will be) applied to existing bookings. I see them quietly rolling back rack on new bookings and keeping the discounts quite topheavy for now.

Trying to suss out some interesting comments I picked up this afternoon. Stick a PIN in that for now.

 

[Lilofan]

I keep pushing our union to put in some language allowing staff to stack up personal days to travel off season like once every 5 years or something. The fact that Florida is the center of the sun in August means it’s the one time we’re off school where we get “deals” we make work. And heck it’s 95 here in MA today so what difference is 5 degrees anyway.

Visited a friend in Easton MA and stayed in her home with NO AC. That was worse than a day in MK with at least you can retreat to some AC.

 

[LSLS]

Not necessarily. They know, due in part to the pandemic, absense makes the heart grow fonder, and people will pay the higher prices if they take a break from visiting for a few years.

By the time that wears out, they will have $60B in New attractions to get them to come back.




This thread goes back and forth from saying the parks are empty and no one is there to insisting the parks are still packed and everyone is miserable from the crowding. Seriously which is it?

Which one is it today?

It can be both if by packed you mean things like lines. Aside from some times (the 4th for example) where the crowds are significantly lower than Disney can actually drop staffing, it can feel crowded while having less crowds. We have Disney straight up admitting crowds were down last year. They said it in their quarterly reports (obviously they framed it with "But the segment is Ok because other things"). You have them closing entire blocks of hotels off. Yet the lines and QS still feel packed due to operational aspects. So, less crowds, but feels just as crowded.

 

[Andrew25]

Based on lots of dining availability for dinner time... what's the chance we see the return of an After 4PM Epcot Pass for locals who may have been priced out? I'd imagine WDW hasn't brought the pass back since it's targeted at locals who may dine at Disney Springs.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Based on lots of dining availability for dinner time... what's the chance we see the return of an After 4PM Epcot Pass for locals who may have been priced out? I'd imagine WDW hasn't brought the pass back since it's targeted at locals who may dine at Disney Springs.

I’d say zero…bob hates them

They don’t even have a yacht

I’ll tell you what…they NEED tables In wonderland. At their price levels?

Easy revenue…

But it’s not gonna happen

 

[the_rich]

Based on lots of dining availability for dinner time... what's the chance we see the return of an After 4PM Epcot Pass for locals who may have been priced out? I'd imagine WDW hasn't brought the pass back since it's targeted at locals who may dine at Disney Springs.

I was in the parks this week and they were crowded. I also didn't notice a lot of empty tables. I ate at via Napoli, prime time and raglan road at around 4pm and they were all packed

 

[HauntedPirate]

Based on lots of dining availability for dinner time... what's the chance we see the return of an After 4PM Epcot Pass for locals who may have been priced out? I'd imagine WDW hasn't brought the pass back since it's targeted at locals who may dine at Disney Springs.

You want to invite more of those freeloading locals into the parks, where they eat beforehand (or worse - bring their own food) and do nothing but take up space that families from Denver and Seattle could be using?



I don't think they have the testicular fortitude to bring back any programs that could potentially show weakness in the swamps. Pride goeth before the fall.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I was in the parks this week and they were crowded. I also didn't notice a lot of empty tables. I ate at via Napoli, prime time and raglan road at around 4pm and they were all packed

I’ve never seen you not say that.

But most of the reports are opposite

The parks are absolutely not crowded.
I’ll hop a plane and meet you there right now if you want me to show how to tell?

Don’t stop believin

 

[Andrew25]

I was in the parks this week and they were crowded. I also didn't notice a lot of empty tables. I ate at via Napoli, prime time and raglan road at around 4pm and they were all packed

The parks are still crowded, but it's pretty easy to snag up dinner reservations or join the walk-up list compared to a year ago.