Is attendance really down at WDW this or…

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Oh I'm sure they're going to advertise a ton -- I just don't think the average guest pays any attention to what's going on with/at theme parks at all. I remember people going to Disney in the late 90s/early 2000s and not even knowing Animal Kingdom existed.

I think the internet killed that

Wdw travel was boosted immensely in the golden age by promos on gma and Regis…

But no one wants TV ads (cough) anymore and their effectiveness is vastly diminished by Siri and Alexa

 

[JD80]

Oh I'm sure they're going to advertise a ton -- I just don't think the average guest pays any attention to what's going on with/at theme parks at all. I remember people going to Disney in the late 90s/early 2000s and not even knowing Animal Kingdom existed.

Maybe. But the late 90s/2000s didn't have any of the social media reach that exists today for marketing.

 

[JD80]

Nail meet head.

There’s no free lunch. If WDW gave a free genie+ with resort bookings they would just charge more in the hotel cost and absorb it there. Aka the DDP.

They need to get creative like that 50% discount they offered for kids. Would be nice if kids weren't just 9 and under.

 

[MagicHappens1971]

Disney doesn’t have the park capacity to offer G+ to all of its hotel guests for “free”. It would have to be only a perk for “certain guests”

 

[wannabeBelle]

Disney doesn’t have the park capacity to offer G+ to all of its hotel guests for “free”. It would have to be only a perk for “certain guests”

Not sure I agree with that. Fast Pass Plus was offered not only for onsite guests but anyone with a park ticket. Granted FP+ was limited to three initial selections and then anything after that was done on the day of, based on availability. Still, can it be done? I think so. Will it, that is the question. Marie

 

[JD80]

Disney doesn’t have the park capacity to offer G+ to all of its hotel guests for “free”. It would have to be only a perk for “certain guests”

G+ requires less capacity than FP+ because FP+ allowed you to re-do rides and was given to anyone with a ticket.

 

[Lilofan]

Some dream that danger lurks around every corner.

The Mouse has had a bullseye since its existence. UO / Epic will have visitors like me for a day or two but most of the vacation will be spent by us at WDW parks and resorts.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Maybe. But the late 90s/2000s didn't have any of the social media reach that exists today for marketing.

Id argue that media is too widespread/available

More difficult to create a captive audience

 

[Lilofan]

Oh I'm sure they're going to advertise a ton -- I just don't think the average guest pays any attention to what's going on with/at theme parks at all. I remember people going to Disney in the late 90s/early 2000s and not even knowing Animal Kingdom existed.

The cast working at AK must have loved working bankers hours , park open 9am , park close 5pm.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

G+ requires less capacity than FP+ because FP+ allowed you to re-do rides and was given to anyone with a ticket.

Fastpass + was mathematically stupidity…and created the boondoggle that is genie today

 

[Nubs70]

That will get people to look but I don't think it'll have a major impact.

DME saves you maybe $100 in uber/bus costs per family? Free G+ at deluxe books when rack rate is way too expensive for "average" guests? Even then, a family of 4 you're maybe saving $100 per park day? That's basically in the same realm as a rack rate discount you'd get. In same cases a 30% rack rate discount may be a better deal.

They won't have a significant impact in bookings unless they start offering ticket discounts/deals.

Just for an extreme example (family of 4), the cost of 4 park tickets today is around the same cost (adjusted for inflation) as a package of 10 in 2019. Today, going from 3 to 4 tickets is roughly +$600. In 2019 it was +$440 (overall cost $2300 vs $1900).

Going from 4 to 5? 2024: +$300 | 2019: $50

Anyway, the biggest cost driver in a WDW vacation is park tickets, at least for families. Value/Mods prices aren't awful.

In the end. The guest is paying a premium for the Spirit Airlines experience of theme parks. I would not be surprised if the WDW mobile merch vendors start selling lottery tickets like the flight attendants on Ryan Air

 

[UNCgolf]

Maybe. But the late 90s/2000s didn't have any of the social media reach that exists today for marketing.

I think TV ads of that era were probably more effective than social media marketing in terms of attracting new customers/increasing overall awareness -- social media marketing is probably more likely to target/bring back repeat guests due to the nature of how it works.

Regardless, I'd expect EU to have broader awareness among the general public after it's been open a couple of years.

 

[Laketravis]

But then we wouldn’t have had tiered fastpass 2 months in advance from the toilet…and that was so “magical”

LOL! Or those famous last words - "This better work, Bob"

 

[HauntedPirate]

In the end. The guest is paying a premium for the Spirit Airlines experience of theme parks. I would not be surprised if the WDW mobile merch vendors start selling lottery tickets like the flight attendants on Ryan Air

"We are giving our guests the flexibility to vacation the way they want to, with options for everyone!" - Disney Marketing

In other words - Lipstick on a pig. Or a bow on a flaming bag of poo, you pick. But look at how pretty it is!! Oooo!!!

 

[Grimley1968]

When I had younger children, and we had the nostalgic pull of WDW for them, plus the nostalgic pull of WDW from my wife's and my own childhood (mostly after the "tickets for everything" phase in the beginning), it seemed impossible to believe that any of the competing theme park experiences could ever catch up with WDW, in terms of guest attendance.

But these days, with the seeming reversion to the "tickets for everything" phase via making guests pay for things that used to be included and with the seeming unwillingness by Disney to do anything in WDW that doesn't promote one of the newer, less enduring IP's, Disney is squandering much of the nostalgic pull for both us and our 20-something daughters. For our daughters, Universal IP's hold as much nostalgia for them as anything Disney-related. Universal may be as money grubbing as WDW, but with WDW losing (or willingly shedding) its nostalgia advantage, it's a 50-50 shot whether our daughters decide to ditch WDW and go to Universal parks when they someday take their own kids to Florida for vacations. I think we're far from the only people our age who see the possibility coming that WDW someday loses its central Florida theme park king of the hill status.

 

[co10064]

This is going in a different direction, but one thing that drives me crazy is their refusal to run attractions at full capacity all day long.

There is no reason one side of Space Mountain should ever be closed from park opening to park closing. Same thing for using only half of the load platforms for Thunder, Guardians, or Remy... or closing a theater or two for Soarin'. It's horrible customer service and it contributes to the artificial crowding.

 

[JoeCamel]

When I had younger children, and we had the nostalgic pull of WDW for them, plus the nostalgic pull of WDW from my wife's and my own childhood (mostly after the "tickets for everything" phase in the beginning), it seemed impossible to believe that any of the competing theme park experiences could ever catch up with WDW, in terms of guest attendance.

But these days, with the seeming reversion to the "tickets for everything" phase via making guests pay for things that used to be included and with the seeming unwillingness by Disney to do anything in WDW that doesn't promote one of the newer, less enduring IP's, Disney is squandering much of the nostalgic pull for both us and our 20-something daughters. For our daughters, Universal IP's hold as much nostalgia for them as anything Disney-related. Universal may be as money grubbing as WDW, but with WDW losing (or willingly shedding) its nostalgia advantage, it's a 50-50 shot whether our daughters decide to ditch WDW and go to Universal parks when they someday take their own kids to Florida for vacations. I think we're far from the only people our age who see the possibility coming that WDW someday loses its central Florida theme park king of the hill status.

I've always held the WDW makes me give them money and Universal makes me want to give them money. Bob's hand in my pocket is creepy and Brian's hand out makes me want to fill it for the value returned

 

[Vegas Disney Fan]

The Mouse has had a bullseye since its existence. UO / Epic will have visitors like me for a day or two but most of the vacation will be spent by us at WDW parks and resorts.

I think the decline of Disney is a bigger threat to Disney than the increasing quality at Universal, Universal has reached the point they’ll very likely get 2 days from us every time we visit Florida, Disney on the other hand has become so expensive, and such a hassle, we will likely reduce our WDW trips altogether in favor of cruises and other non theme park vacation destinations.

This will likely hurt Uni also, Uni hasnt reached the point of being a standalone trip for us so if we are going to FL less for WDW that also means fewer Uni add on days from us.

 

[Splash4eva]

I also believe he said that the company believes the abuse of DAS is because people are doing everything they can to avoid paying for G+ - therefore the root problem is still G+.

I am a DAS user and i still buy Genie because with the long inflated wait times. You be basically doing a ride then waiting at least 60-75 minutes to do the next one. Not the ideal vacation especially with a child. My sample size is small but everyone else that i talk with who uses it still buys Genie as well. Not saying its the norm just stating my experience

 

[Splash4eva]

It sounds like there is some momentum internally to re-incentivize onsite bookings with additional inclusions.

Without specifics, I wouldn't be surprised if some form of DME and maybe, just maybe, "free" Genie+ with certain tiers of hotel package stays were in play. It's one of the few levers they have available that could take effect prior to EU's opening.

I just dont get how saying giving people staying “deluxe” free genie helps? Those people have the money anyways and now all you are doing is letting people who didnt buy it get access to it limiting others now.