Is attendance really down at WDW this or…

[prberk]

I have a ton of old Disney park music on a usb drive and decided to listen to some on my way into work this morning.

Shuffling through I found the old Animal Kingdom and MGM (Hollywood) Studios parades as well as Spectromagic. It really hits hearing those again and bringing back so many memories of how different the parks felt then vs today.

Those vacations felt so much more relaxed as well without G+ and park reservations etc

Can’t agree more. SpectroMagic especially. Remember how the MK was I open nightly to at least 11 p.m. (without double-dipping on admission), and the light parade ran TWICE, with the fireworks on the hour in between? And 3-hour extra magic hours on some nights, for ALL resort hotel guests. It was wonderful and well worth the admission. Now shorter hours in summer and no night parade. And no fireworks for day visitors on the multiple “party” nights. And value resorts are twice the price of a full scale Marriott in most places for half the amenities and no evening Extra Magic Hours.

 

[Drdcm]

Can’t agree more. SpectroMagic especially. Remember how the MK was I open nightly to at least 11 p.m. (without double-dipping on admission), and the light parade ran TWICE, with the fireworks on the hour in between? And 3-hour extra magic hours on some nights, for ALL resort hotel guests. It was wonderful and well worth the admission. Now shorter hours in summer and no night parade. And no fireworks for day visitors. And value resorts are twice the price of a full scale Marriott in most places for half the amenities and no evening Extra Magic Hours.

They aren’t doing fireworks for day visitors?

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

As a guest, I do not understand what is bad about lower attendance and more rooms being available. Enjoy it while it lasts.

And for the ultimate doom and bloomers, enjoying the parks and resorts while they are still owned by TWDC.

None of us are in control. Just enjoy it while it lasts.

If you’re standing there on a given day…it’s great

As far as long term investment, quality, pricing…it’s not good at all

 

[Disstevefan1]

In a vacuum, nothing. But Disney isn't just having lower attendance and room rentals and just going "Eh, it will pick back up." They will run less vehicles, less staff, and less entertainment. Which is why this idea that "This is what they want" is so laughable.

Totally agree about they will go with less as you say. As guests we can only hope its too bad.

TWDC is quick to do this at the parks and resorts but allow their movie business to contentiously lose truckloads of money.

Its too bad.

 

[el_super]

In a vacuum, nothing. But Disney isn't just having lower attendance and room rentals and just going "Eh, it will pick back up." They will run less vehicles, less staff, and less entertainment. Which is why this idea that "This is what they want" is so laughable.

Why wouldn't they want that?

 

[DisneyCane]

Totally agree about they will go with less as you say. As guests we can only hope its too bad.

TWDC is quick to do this at the parks and resorts but allow their movie business to contentiously lose truckloads of money.

Its too bad.

Which is why I wish they would spin parks and resorts off into a separate company. The stock price of "Disney Parks and Resorts" would be based on the financial performance of only those sectors of the business and would therefore motivate the leadership of the entity to do what is necessary to attract the most customers at the highest prices.

Instead, they have to cut back on P&R spending to subsidize Disney+ and the movie studio.

 

[LSLS]

Why wouldn't they want that?

Why wouldn't they want less people? Because it's less people spending money? What have you possibly seen from Iger that makes you think he's willing to leave a dime on the table. They don't want to raise the prices to $200 and have 10,000 people in the parks, they want to raise the prices to $200 and still have 50,000 people in the parks. If the reason to raise prices was to give customers a better experience with lower crowds, they would not cut cast member hours and operation capacities to match the lower crowds, they would still max out to give that great experience.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

In a vacuum, nothing. But Disney isn't just having lower attendance and room rentals and just going "Eh, it will pick back up." They will run less vehicles, less staff, and less entertainment. Which is why this idea that "This is what they want" is so laughable.

I felt like I might have said this once before?

…Disney will never want lower attendance. The model they designed and make money off of benefits more with each person added into the compounds

That was a throw away nonsense line by a now failing executive that didn’t scan for one minute.

 

[celluloid]

Why wouldn't they want less people? Because it's less people spending money? What have you possibly seen from Iger that makes you think he's willing to leave a dime on the table. They don't want to raise the prices to $200 and have 10,000 people in the parks, they want to raise the prices to $200 and still have 50,000 people in the parks. If the reason to raise prices was to give customers a better experience with lower crowds, they would not cut cast member hours and operation capacities to match the lower crowds, they would still max out to give that great experience.

Exactly. You don't have Genie Plus being a thing that people who are wanting it without also wanting a lot of people coming in, making it a self fulfilling prophecy of increased perceived value.

Priority passes don't work at theme parks without having them as busy as possible.

A somewhat micro example in form of an event. HHN loves having millions of people show up annually and the hundred thousands that will also pay for express becuase the millions of others are there too. They added four nights in the final hours of scheduling the event this year so they could increase the value and appeal to many types of guests.

It is not like Disney got rid of all their quick service or popcorn kiosk options because they realized they could just have table service at higher prices. They know some people want a sit down table meal, and others will pack their own snacks and survive off of sharing popcorn and snacks throughout the entire 11 hour day.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Why wouldn't they want that?

That question is Way over your head

 

[Marionnette]

Why wouldn't they want that?

Because there's a tipping point where fewer bodies in the parks begins to diminish revenue regardless of the cuts they make.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Because there's a tipping point where fewer bodies in the parks begins to diminish revenue regardless of the cuts they make.

Less people increases their risk to economic trouble/bad times as well.

It’s what was overlooked the minute people started this “they are luxury now…” stupidity.

Boy…mom is right…I feel like I had this class before?

But we are talking about attendance and the mechanisms it triggers/is affected by.

So say revenue is $100,000,000 a month with an average attendance of 5,000,000

Great.

Now say they increase the price, but drive out 20% of the pool and now make $100,000,000 on 4,000,000

The armchair defenders will say “great! More profit on lower overhead!”

It good times…everything works.

Now what if they had a 2% drop in scenario A or B?
The money loss is the same…but every individual lost in scenario B is more important to the bottom line is more of a liability.
That’s more risky. Mainly because you’ve drained a big chunk of the pool that can mitigate that bleed and backfill the slots.

Now my head hurts….STARBUCKS!!!!

 

[John park hopper]

Which is why I wish they would spin parks and resorts off into a separate company. The stock price of "Disney Parks and Resorts" would be based on the financial performance of only those sectors of the business and would therefore motivate the leadership of the entity to do what is necessary to attract the most customers at the highest prices.

Instead, they have to cut back on P&R spending to subsidize Disney+ and the movie studio.

Been saying the same thing for a long time. IMO the parks would improve tremendously if the money stayed in the parks for guest improvements. When the goose that lays the golden egg drys up maybe it will happen

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Been saying the same thing for a long time. IMO the parks would improve tremendously if the money stayed in the parks for guest improvements. When the goose that lays the golden egg drys up maybe it will happen

But that can’t happen because the parks prop up the entire portfolio

The solution for “quality control” would be for Disney to be taken private

And if Bob doesn’t leave the price might drop low enough for people to actually do it!!

Quality is destroyed on the market.

Itâs No Surprise Disneyâs Stock Hit A Nine-Year Low. Hereâs Why

When Disney's stock price fell below $84 last week, it hit a nine-year low, and it shouldn't have come as a surprise.

www.forbes.com

 

[Disstevefan1]

Less people increases their risk to economic trouble/bad times as well.

It’s what was overlooked the minute people started this “they are luxury now…” stupidity.

Boy…mom is right…I feel like I had this class before?

But we are talking about attendance and the mechanisms it triggers/is affected by.

So say revenue is $100,000,000 a month with an average attendance of 5,000,000

Great.

Now say they increase the price, but drive out 20% of the pool and now make $100,000,000 on 4,000,000

The armchair defenders will say “great! More profit on lower overhead!”

It good times…everything works.

Now what if they had a 2% drop in scenario A or B?
The money loss is the same…but every individual lost in scenario B is more important to the bottom line is more of a liability.
That’s more risky. Mainly because you’ve drained a big chunk of the pool that can mitigate that bleed and backfill the slots.

Now my head hurts….STARBUCKS!!!!

For you, Sir Walter

 

[el_super]

Why wouldn't they want less people? Because it's less people spending money?

Not all people spend money at the same levels.

What have you possibly seen from Iger that makes you think he's willing to leave a dime on the table.

Price increases at the parks, really, we don't look at just as increases. We look at it as an overall​

strategy that, as Christine said in her comments, is designed to basically grow yields or yield​

management. We're trying to basically increase the park experience by spreading demand out​

and by making the parks more affordable during periods of time that – basically lower peak​

periods and, obviously, more expensive during peak periods to limit the number of people that go in.​

They don't want to raise the prices to $200 and have 10,000 people in the parks, they want to raise the prices to $200 and still have 50,000 people in the parks. If the reason to raise prices was to give customers a better experience with lower crowds, they would not cut cast member hours and operation capacities to match the lower crowds, they would still max out to give that great experience.

It can be both. You can cut operating expenses and still have a better experience than you did in 2019. A 30 or 40 minute wait is still better than a 60 or 90 min wait.

The reality is that their business was struggling to keep up with the demand at the lower pricing, and that has larger downstream impacts that couldn't be easily accounted for.

 

[el_super]

Because there's a tipping point where fewer bodies in the parks begins to diminish revenue regardless of the cuts they make.

Sure, but so far that hasn't happened. Not even close.

 

[prberk]

They aren’t doing fireworks for day visitors?

I was referring to the many party nights.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

For you, Sir Walter
View attachment 740152

…is there a giftcard hidden in that thing somewhere?

 

[Drdcm]

I was referring to the many party nights.

Yeah I figured. I didn’t realize they stopped regular fireworks on those nights. A few years ago, we went early, watched HAE and then later the Halloween fireworks I believe.

Although, my memory might be off. I don’t know for sure.