If this is not a blantant money grab, I don't know what is.....

[UNCgolf]

So now instead of a blatant money grab it's just an appeal to be quicker at doing the thing they are going to do anyway?

They will eventually drop it to standby. But there is nothing all that wrong with ensuring as much capacity goes to first time riders as possible first.

This is the exact opposite of what the VQ is doing. It ensures more capacity goes to repeat riders and locals over first time riders. That's probably the biggest problem with the system.

 

[JMcMahonEsq]

The VQ does more harm than good here, though. It's better for locals and repeat visitors who have already been on CR at the expense of people who are visiting for the first time, or only visit rarely. There are locals/AP holders who have been on it 25 times and are still taking VQ spots that could go to a first time rider who may not be back for years.

The existence of ILL helps with this since they can purchase a spot if they don't get the VQ (as does the somewhat regular availability of the 1 PM drop, but that's not true every day), but that's a significant added expense for a family.

No system is perfect, but the VQ is definitely skewed against the average visitor.

Even the way you put it here would seem to lead one to the opposite conclusion you make.

If anything a VQ would benifit a first or rare visitor, not the local AP. People who have been to the parks 25+ times have at this point seen and done it all (or at least everything they want to do.) If there was just a static non-virtual line they could afford to dedicate an hour or more to their favorite ride. They have seen everything else in the park, so they are not missing anything, and even if they don't get to something else, they will be back next week/month anyway.

But if your a first timer/rare visitor, the VQ give you the chance to "wait" in your hour line, and still see other things. You get to take your castle photo, go try and pull the sword out of the stone. Ride its s small world or little mermaid, ect. while not wasting your time in an hour ride.

 

[el_super]

This is the exact opposite of what the VQ is doing. It ensures more capacity goes to repeat riders and locals over first time riders.

Incorrect. The VQ is limited to once a day, so basically everyone has an equal chance of getting their one ride.

If it went back to standby, capacity would be weighted toward those that paid an admission point that justified a higher time spend on just one attraction (ie discounted admissions).

You got it backwards.

 

[UNCgolf]

Even the way you put it here would seem to lead one to the opposite conclusion you make.

If anything a VQ would benifit a first or rare visitor, not the local AP. People who have been to the parks 25+ times have at this point seen and done it all (or at least everything they want to do.) If there was just a static non-virtual line they could afford to dedicate an hour or more to their favorite ride. They have seen everything else in the park, so they are not missing anything, and even if they don't get to something else, they will be back next week/month anyway.

But if your a first timer/rare visitor, the VQ give you the chance to "wait" in your hour line, and still see other things. You get to take your castle photo, go try and pull the sword out of the stone. Ride its s small world or little mermaid, ect. while not wasting your time in an hour ride.

That's not how it works -- because entering the VQ requires no commitment whatsoever, people try for a spot just because. People here have even talked about doing it -- they'd try for a VQ spot just to see if they get one, and they'll stop by EPCOT (or DHS when it was Rise) if they do but won't visit if they don't. That's taking spots away from rare visitors.

If a rare visitor isn't able to get the VQ spot, they're just out of luck unless they want to pony up for the ILL. If the local or repeat visitor doesn't get one, they don't care because they'll just try again soon -- but they're taking up a significant amount of VQ capacity.

 

[UNCgolf]

Incorrect. The VQ is limited to once a day, so basically everyone has an equal chance of getting their one ride.

If it went back to standby, capacity would be weighted toward those that paid an admission point that justified a higher time spend on just one attraction (ie discounted admissions).

You got it backwards.

No. The VQ has significant capacity taken up by locals and repeat visitors, some of whom wouldn't even go to the park if they didn't get a spot. They certainly wouldn't be there waiting in a 90 minute line to ride, because there's no reason to. They can just come back and ride it another time when the line is shorter.

This was discussed in detail when Rise was on VQ; there was a not insignificant number of people who would try for a spot just because they could but didn't really care if they got one because they'd already been on it numerous times. All of those people were taking VQ spots from first time/rare visitors, and they would not have shown up to the park to wait 90 minutes to ride.

There were even people who got spots nearly every day but didn't always show up to use them.

If Disney really cared about making it fair for everyone, it would be a lottery rather than something that required fast fingers at 7 AM (that already disadvantages a significant number of guests). And if they wanted to ensure first time/rare visitors were advantaged, they could weight it in their favor.

No system is perfect, but it's illogical to argue that the VQ is either the fairest way to do things or better for one-time/rare visitors.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

Incorrect. The VQ is limited to once a day, so basically everyone has an equal chance of getting their one ride.

“Everyone has an equal chance of getting their one ride” is only true if everyone has an iOS device, has the Disney parks app, understands how to make a reservation, and understands and remembers the specific times they must try and make that reservation.

To me, it’s more fair for a visitor to decide if they want to ride or not. Whatever the wait is, can be factored into that decision.

I think it is the ultimate unfair practice, to tell a one-day visitor to Epcot “sorry, you should have downloaded the app and practiced before you got here, your one chance at cosmic rewind is gone”

*edit - at least there is a second chance that has some decent time but hopefully you understand the point.

 

[el_super]

No. The VQ has significant capacity taken up by locals (...)

This was discussed in detail when Rise was on VQ; there were large numbers of people who would try (...)

What are the actual numbers? This sounds pretty exaggerated.

If Disney really cared about making it fair for everyone, it would be a lottery rather than something that required fast fingers at 7 AM (that already disadvantages a significant number of guests). And if they wanted to ensure first time/rare visitors were advantaged, they could weight it in their favor.

I agree... they absolutely should do a lottery just like Tokyo.

 

[el_super]

To me, it’s more fair for a visitor to decide if they want to ride or not. Whatever the wait is, can be factored into that decision.

It's almost as though, so much time has past since the parks were standby only, that people forget what it was like.

It isn't just a choice to wait in standby. Some people are not physically able to wait in extremely long queues (3 to 5 hours) and those were routine before (even back to 2017). It's about sacrificing time to see other attractions or entertainment, or even sacrificing time with loved ones if the party decides to split up. Even those that are physically able will still feel stressed in a long wait, being crammed up with other people, crying babies, loud children, the differently odored... it's not great. Remember the bathroom issues at Flight if Passage?

And in the end, you could wait 3 hours and not even be guaranteed a ride. That's a huge time commitment on a gamble.

Standby is just an illusion of choice.

 

[TrainsOfDisney]

Some people are not physically able to wait in extremely long queues (3 to 5 hours) and those were routine before (even back to 2017).

They were not routine at all - New Years Eve I would see 3-4 hour waits at headliners but on normal days nothing above 2 except when flight of passage opened.

I loved the FOP solution - keep the park open late. I jumped in line at like 11:59 and was leaving the park by myself at 1:00 am. Kinda fun!

 

[Jrb1979]

It's almost as though, so much time has past since the parks were standby only, that people forget what it was like.

It isn't just a choice to wait in standby. Some people are not physically able to wait in extremely long queues (3 to 5 hours) and those were routine before (even back to 2017). It's about sacrificing time to see other attractions or entertainment, or even sacrificing time with loved ones if the party decides to split up. Even those that are physically able will still feel stressed in a long wait, being crammed up with other people, crying babies, loud children, the differently odored... it's not great. Remember the bathroom issues at Flight if Passage?

And in the end, you could wait 3 hours and not even be guaranteed a ride. That's a huge time commitment on a gamble.

Standby is just an illusion of choice.

Again some how outside of Disney standby is the norm. For those who can't wait in long lines there is options for them.

Maybe visit some other parks to see what reality is for theme parks

 

[Vclguy90]

Guardians of the Galaxy: Cosmic Rewind Sticks to Virtual Queue Despite Test Track Closure

Guardians of the Galaxy: Cosmic Rewind Sticks to Virtual Queue Despite Test Track Closure

www.wdwmagic.com

Seriously
I know WDW is a greedy house, but come on now.
1 headliner down for a long time and they still need to squeeze people into the virtual BS and hope others will pay. And they do....

This is a new Dis low for me,
Open this bloody que already WDW.

Disney, to me, has been playing with the crabs at rock bottom for quite some time now. They just aren't good at polishing it up anymore because they don't care.

 

[NickMaio]

VQ is as far from equal as you can get.....

 

[NickMaio]

It's almost as though, so much time has past since the parks were standby only, that people forget what it was like.

It isn't just a choice to wait in standby. Some people are not physically able to wait in extremely long queues (3 to 5 hours) and those were routine before (even back to 2017). It's about sacrificing time to see other attractions or entertainment, or even sacrificing time with loved ones if the party decides to split up. Even those that are physically able will still feel stressed in a long wait, being crammed up with other people, crying babies, loud children, the differently odored... it's not great. Remember the bathroom issues at Flight if Passage?

And in the end, you could wait 3 hours and not even be guaranteed a ride. That's a huge time commitment on a gamble.

Standby is just an illusion of choice.

Standby is choice.........shorter line I can choose to go there or stay.

VQ is gambling and money sucking at it's finest

Every ride can break down, 3 hour wait or not

 

[JMcMahonEsq]

Standby is choice.........shorter line I can choose to go there or stay.

VQ is gambling and money sucking at it's finest

Every ride can break down, 3 hour wait or not

VQ is just as much a choice as standby.

VQ isn't money sucking. You're not paying for VQ, as opposed to paying for an ILL.

Sure every ride can break down, 3 hour wait or not. But with a VQ you get to do other things while that wait happens. You're not simply sitting there and when the ride breaks down, realize that entire sunk time cost you spent in that line is wasted. Whereas while i was in the VQ I did those ride that had shorter lines you mentioned, WITHOUT having to get out of my Virtual line, plus got my pictures, food, and did my pin trading and tee shirt purchases.

 

[JMcMahonEsq]

VQ is as far from equal as you can get.....

There is nothing more equal than VQ. Everyone gets a chance to log in at the same time. Doesn't matter how far away from the ride entrance you are, Doesn't matter if you are by yourself, or pushing a stroller with 2 kids trying to race to a line, and having to deal with melt downs, bathroom breaks, ect. Everyone getting the exact same shot, whether you drove in from down the street or flew in from NY, wheither its your first visit or your 100th, is the very definition of equal. You could claim its not the most efficient, (i would disagree but there's an argument) but not that its not equal.

 

[Jrb1979]

VQ is just as much a choice as standby.

VQ isn't money sucking. You're not paying for VQ, as opposed to paying for an ILL.

Sure every ride can break down, 3 hour wait or not. But with a VQ you get to do other things while that wait happens. You're not simply sitting there and when the ride breaks down, realize that entire sunk time cost you spent in that line is wasted. Whereas while i was in the VQ I did those ride that had shorter lines you mentioned, WITHOUT having to get out of my Virtual line, plus got my pictures, food, and did my pin trading and tee shirt purchases.

Not everyone wants that. Not everyone wants to schedule their days out for rides. I do enough scheduling at home.

 

[NickMaio]

There is nothing more equal than VQ. Everyone gets a chance to log in at the same time. Doesn't matter how far away from the ride entrance you are, Doesn't matter if you are by yourself, or pushing a stroller with 2 kids trying to race to a line, and having to deal with melt downs, bathroom breaks, ect. Everyone getting the exact same shot, whether you drove in from down the street or flew in from NY, wheither its your first visit or your 100th, is the very definition of equal. You could claim its not the most efficient, (i would disagree but there's an argument) but not that its not equal.

At the same time.....
1 moment in time......twice a day
How on earth is that equal..

Standby is equal 100% throughout the entire day.
Agree to disagree

 

[flynnibus]

If there aren't VQ spots available, it means enough people wanted to ride the ride that they got into the virtual line (something that is open to anyone/everyone.) If someone is walking around the park and didn't join the VQ, and just decided on a whim to try and ride guardians as a walk up, if there was no VQ they would have to walk up and wait behind all the people who got there before them, waiting in a real line vs a virtual one.

VQ lowers the barrier of entry - at the expense of those that may want to ride more.

Instead of making a decision of "is this ride worth 90mins to me?" - X number of guests get to ride with a low commitment... nullifying the normal feedback loop that normally regulates lines.

When VQ is available for long periods of time... that means it's attracting people because of the availability, rather than because of the ride's draw. Ride demand isn't really there... and you're artificially blocking people that do want to ride (because of the no repeats).

 

[NickMaio]

VQ is just as much a choice as standby.

VQ isn't money sucking. You're not paying for VQ, as opposed to paying for an ILL.

Sure every ride can break down, 3 hour wait or not. But with a VQ you get to do other things while that wait happens. You're not simply sitting there and when the ride breaks down, realize that entire sunk time cost you spent in that line is wasted. Whereas while i was in the VQ I did those ride that had shorter lines you mentioned, WITHOUT having to get out of my Virtual line, plus got my pictures, food, and did my pin trading and tee shirt purchases.

Sorry
I don't see how something which gives the customer 2 extremely small windows to get is as equal as the alternative.....standby which gives guests the option to choose all day long. If and when they want to ride.....
I'm out......agree to disagree.

 

[flynnibus]

There is nothing more equal than VQ. Everyone gets a chance to log in at the same time

There is a reason there is more than 1 drop... ride decisions aren't just about everyone at the same moment in time. VQ forces that artificial constraint while taking away the feedback loop about investing.