Having a party member save a table while others get the food?

jhastings74

Well-Known Member
There are also families that have young kids (stroller-age kiddos) who would not be able to negotiate standing in line, holding the kids (because they can't bring the strollers in) as well as carrying trays of food, and then trying to find a table. So sometimes, it is practical...well, more accurately, necessary...to have mom or dad go to the table with the little ones while the other parent brings the food. My theory? If you know going in that people will be doing this, it may be less frustrating for you when you see it happening. And like others have said, there may be medical issues that make it necessary for someone to have a seat instead of standing in line. And also, like others have said, the lines at busy times are tough for one or two people to stand in, let alone a family of 4 or more, especially AFTER you order and are in the railings waiting for your food at the counter.

I have no problem with people who save tables and can appreciate the CM comment/rant about the guests.

:wave:
 

Cosmic Commando

Well-Known Member
Sure, it's not as efficient to have someone hold a table while someone else orders, but I think it's a courtesy that people should be able to take advantage of. I think Disney has the right balance: let people do whatever they want except on the busiest days where they need all the capacity.

The ordering area for every counter service restaurant I can think of is tiny-- where would 4x as many people fit? Then, you cram four meals and four drinks onto a tray that was meant for two or three and then you get to snake your way around the whole restaurant?

I think you count as a customer of the restaurant when you enter intending to purchase food. So I see it as each group accounts for an occupied table as soon as they enter the restaurant. The customers saving tables are already going to need a table in the next five minutes anyway... it's not like someone is saving a table for dinner at 2 PM. It's no different capacity-wise than eating slowly, going to the bathroom in the middle of the meal, or lingering at the table while finishing up. Yet, I've rarely heard anyone complain that you should have known you would have to use the bathroom or are expected to eat at breakneck pace to satisfy "efficiency".
 

fireman17

Well-Known Member
As a parent of four children the youngest being three our family has done this on numerous trips to WDW. We would order our food and either I or my DW would head for a table while we would wait for our food and leave the older child to help the parent with the food. My feeling is this, once our food is ordered I'd rather have my children seated instead of trying to keep them occupied while waiting.
At our table we'll try to have the younger children help with little thing like getting napkins, utensils and so on. And too we do try to eat at off peak hours and if there are plenty of tables available we'll wait.
Now as far as hovering I will never do this to another family and if we are asked how long we'll be my response is always "as long as it takes our family to eat our meal". That normally sends the message. If we are finishing and see a family looking by all means we'll let them know the table is available so they can sit.
I will say this is a touchy subject though.
 

draybook

Well-Known Member
Sure, but the line would move four time faster because each person would be ordering for one person instead of ordering for four people.

you think that each person individually stepping up to the CM and saying what they want and then handing over their card/cash to pay would be faster than one person doing it? You also think it would go faster even though all those people would be clogging the already small waiting areas near the food pick up counters?


For me and my family, we'll keep doing it our way because it's simple and fast. We know what we're ordering before my wife or I head up to the counter so the only wait time is on the servers, not us.
 

sublimesting

Well-Known Member
I'd rather one person wait in line while their family gets out of the way. The extra 5 minutes they are at the table isn't holding it up for anybody. Usually I get the food and the DW and DD get condiments and napkins etc. and find a place to sit. Then a few minutes later I happen over with the food. I can't stand 4, 5, 6 people hovering in line with strollers etc. This just makes people think lines are longer than they are and folks start getting antsy. Plus there is often no clear cut line when families just linger around and people cut or wind up not in line but behind a waiting family....in other words just go sit down and get out of my way.
 

Chevross

Active Member
My father has back problems from when he broke it as a young man, so he usually finds a seat while we order. I just don't see a problem if the person sits at an available seat and they have someone in their party ordering food.

However, if a person is asking another person how long they'll be sitting there and wanting them to move, or finish eating as soon as possible, yeah I can see the problem.

The seats are first come, first use at a quick service.
 

graphite1326

Well-Known Member
Well, I admit I probably don't have as much time put in as most folks here, especially during peak seasons, but we've never had trouble finding a spot to sit during Free Dining. If every table was held by someone with a group, then imagine how clustered the serving area would be if all of those people were up front in those small waiting lines.

exactly


We usually order as a group and then a couple of us stay and get the food while the others find a table. There usually isn't much of a gap in time between ordering and picking the food. But if you don't like the way I do it oh well.
 

Timekeeper

Well-Known Member
Until Disney designates otherwise, the tables at and around the food service areas are for the use of all guests, whether they are waiting for one person who is placing an order; eating food brought from home; or checking email on their iPad. Period.

:brick:
 

MKCP 1985

Well-Known Member
Until Disney designates otherwise, the tables at and around the food service areas are for the use of all guests, whether they are waiting for one person who is placing an order; eating food brought from home; or checking email on their iPad. Period.

:brick:

:king:

No joke.

I see no problem with having someone go wrangle the napkins, spices and grab a table so that when the other who stands in the line and brings the food and beverages gets out of the queue there is somewhere to go quickly sit down before the food gets cold or knocked over.

:xmas:
 

C.FERNIE

Well-Known Member
For hundreds of reasons we have done it different ways, depends who were with and we make a judgement call aswell, my mum has been with us a couple of times and has health issues and has to take short breaks to sit down so we often send her to sit down while one of orders, never really thought of it taking up space! Other times if it is the young ones we will just all go up in order unless its super busy, and thats so we dont annoy the people that possible could join behind us! Ive been over 4th July and never had a problem getting a table to be fair and there was 8 of us, we just planned ahead! If anyone asked me how long i was going to take, i would probs just eat slower lol :wave:
 

Dukeblue1227

Well-Known Member
Until Disney designates otherwise, the tables at and around the food service areas are for the use of all guests, whether they are waiting for one person who is placing an order; eating food brought from home; or checking email on their iPad. Period.

:brick:

This.

I'm legitimately baffled that people find it rude if someone finds a table while someone orders food.

When I order my food I'd rather not spend 10 minutes looking for a table while my food gets cold...

So I send my GF to find a table while I wait in line (usually right after ordering)

No more than 5 minutes pass... sometimes it takes the full 5 minutes for her to find a table but at least that way I sit right down.. we spend 10 minutes eating, and then leave.

Legitimately mind boggling to waste time looking for a table with a tray full of food when you could just go and grab a table... spend a maximum of 5 minutes "holding it" and eat your food warm and quickly.
 

Timekeeper

Well-Known Member
I'm legitimately baffled that people find it rude if someone finds a table while someone orders food.

:sohappy:

The irony is that this whole topic of discussion is really just and indirect criticism of Disney's efficiency (or lack thereof) in serving food.

For the opponents of saving tables:

If 9-Eye and I go to Casey's for some hotdogs, and 9-Eye spots a table (easy for her to do with her 9 eyes) and she takes a seat while I order, the only time "wasted" (during which other guests can't sit at that particular table) is the time that it takes for the CMs to get our food ready. This usually takes a minute or two, so that's how much time was "wasted." Now, if it takes the CMs 20 minutes to get the hotdogs ready, then that sounds like a Disney problem, and not a Timekeeper/9-Eye problem.

Lest we not forget that there are many more time variables that have a much greater impact than 2 minutes. For example, the time that it takes for a fast eater to eat a hotdog meal, versus a slow eater to consume the same, will be greater than a couple of minutes.

When presented with this "problem," insofar as that opponents consider it to be a "problem," I can't help but wonder "What would Walt do?" And I am reminded of the story about guests cutting through grass at MK and making their own pathway that was more efficient than the paved sidewalks. When faced with the recommendation that a fence be installed to prevent guests from doing this, Walt instead suggested that the guest-made pathway be paved, as this was obviously the most logical and efficient preference as illustrated by the guests themselves.

Table saving obviously isn't a problem (if we assume that Disney addresses problems, like line-cutting), and it's common everywhere, not just WDW. Any casual eatery popular enough to attract overcrowding will result in table-saving. It's permitted everywhere (I've never seen it prohibited). Welcome to America. :sohappy:

If it is deemed to be a "problem," then it is easily solved. For example, some restaurants require that the entire party be present before being seated, even with reservations. If Disney wanted to "fence off" these areas and implement the same policy, they could. But we all know how Walt felt about fences... :(

So, would you rather I save a table for the couple of minutes that it takes for me to get our hotdogs, or would you rather that 9-Eye hovers over you (pun intended) while you try to enjoy your meal? Pick one. :brick:
 

mergatroid

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
Some interesting points of view with some valid arguments on both sides. I can see a family not wanting to crowd the ordering area, however in a place like Cosmic Rays there are fairly large areas to wait for the person ordering without having to take a table to do so. Also I'm sure there are scenarios where the restaurants aren't nearly full when taking a table will obviously not stop somebody else getting it.

My personal viewpoint is that when we enter and see a shortage of tables, the people already queueing by definition have more of a right to one of the few remaining tables than we do as they entered the establishment before us. They got in the restaurant first so deserve a table ahead of us just like the guy 20 people ahead of me in the queue for Space Mountain deserves to ride before me as he got there first.

I don't get upset about the issue and genuinely don't know what the correct procedure is but it feels right for us to order and collect before being seated. Very often one of us will go in the queue whilst the other stands and waits nearby making sure they're not obstructing anyone (easier in Cosmic Rays) and keeps their eyes open for a table for when the food is served. At this point we'll grab a table and if there isn't one readily available then it's our fault for going when it's busy.
 

Timekeeper

Well-Known Member
My personal viewpoint is that when we enter and see a shortage of tables, the people already queueing by definition have more of a right to one of the few remaining tables than we do as they entered the establishment before us. They got in the restaurant first so deserve a table ahead of us just like the guy 20 people ahead of me in the queue for Space Mountain deserves to ride before me as he got there first.

The keywords are highlighted (bold) above. You're absolutely correct that "got there first" is the rule of thumb. :sohappy:

The reason for why the "they entered the establishment before us" argument fails is because, unlike most restaurants outside of WDW, seating at tables at WDW fast food service areas is not restricted by Disney to patrons of the establishment. As previously pointed out, guests may use the tables for anything that is not otherwise prohibited at WDW.

So, when a guest at WDW finds a table and "got there first," there's no "establishment" consideration at issue. The theme park is the "establishment," to which the guest already gained admission. Whether they have someone ordering food or not is completely moot.

As for your Space Mountain example, it sounds reasonable, but many of us repeat visitors have experienced something to the contrary. Sometimes CMs will need to fill a rocket, elevator, or flume log with a specific number of guests and will yell out "Is there a party of two?" etc. So, there are plenty of times when I skipped over the guy 20 people ahead of me simply because of the number of people in my party and following the directions of the CMs.

So, until Disney (via their CMs) specifically designate food tables for the exclusive use of food venue patrons in the order in which they receive their food from the counter, then "got there (table) first" is the name of the game. :sohappy:
 

draybook

Well-Known Member
The Space Mountain argument would only be valid if both parties had the opportunity to claim one of the ride vehicles. At an eatery, you have the option of claiming a spot, on a ride you do not(in most cases).
 

mergatroid

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
The keywords are highlighted (bold) above. You're absolutely correct that "got there first" is the rule of thumb. :sohappy:

The reason for why the "they entered the establishment before us" argument fails is because, unlike most restaurants outside of WDW, seating at tables at WDW fast food service areas is not restricted by Disney to patrons of the establishment. As previously pointed out, guests may use the tables for anything that is not otherwise prohibited at WDW.

So, when a guest at WDW finds a table and "got there first," there's no "establishment" consideration at issue. The theme park is the "establishment," to which the guest already gained admission. Whether they have someone ordering food or not is completely moot.

As for your Space Mountain example, it sounds reasonable, but many of us repeat visitors have experienced something to the contrary. Sometimes CMs will need to fill a rocket, elevator, or flume log with a specific number of guests and will yell out "Is there a party of two?" etc. So, there are plenty of times when I skipped over the guy 20 people ahead of me simply because of the number of people in my party and following the directions of the CMs.

So, until Disney (via their CMs) specifically designate food tables for the exclusive use of food venue patrons in the order in which they receive their food from the counter, then "got there (table) first" is the name of the game. :sohappy:

Hello my friend, some well thought out answers there. As for the Space Mountain example I just randomly picked an attraction to explain in principal why I would feel bad reserving a table (it could have been Spaceship Earth etc where that never happens). I too am very familiar with the parks and have been coming regularly for over 35 years. On many occasions I too have raised my hand as a single rider and been 'bumped' to the front passing people in front of me at the cast members request. I don't feel bad about this as looking at the bigger picture it means those behind me get through a little quicker as the attraction is riding to capacity and getting more people through quicker.

I'm interested where the 'seating at tables at WDW fast food service areas is not restricted by Disney to patrons of the establishment' rule can be found. Is it actually a Disney rule as somebody stated that when very full Disney cast members have stopped those without food taking a table which seems in complete contradiction to their own law? Is this written in the cast members rule book for instance or is it your take on the issue and how you feel it should be?

I don't get upset by others saving tables but after our last visit when it was very crowded the thought popped into my head. If as you say Disney openly advertises those tables as for use by anyone, anytime then I would agree that saving tables is completely fine at their say so, however I'd like to know where this rule is available to see? Even so my wife and I will probably continue to wait till we've got our food but that's just our personal choice.
 

Crockett

Banned
On our last visit I was annoyed by a family hovering around our table with their tray and shouting loudly whilst we finiahed our desert and asking twice "how long we thought we were going to be",
How rude!

If that ever happens again: Simply look up at the person(s) asking, smile (without responding), and continue calmly eating. Had this happened to us, we would have taken extra care to extend our eating time. ;)
(Better for digestion, too)

If the people are overly annoying in bugging you to "hurry up" (while continuing to ignore them):
-Have a person in your party go up to the serving area and find a family who has just picked-up their meal.
-Kindly offer that family your seat, "I saw you're about to be seated, and we're going to open up a table over here...you may have ours.." etc
-Let THAT family take your spot, without even acknowledging the rude family.
 

Timekeeper

Well-Known Member
I'm interested where the 'seating at tables at WDW fast food service areas is not restricted by Disney to patrons of the establishment' rule can be found. Is it actually a Disney rule as somebody stated that when very full Disney cast members have stopped those without food taking a table which seems in complete contradiction to their own law? Is this written in the cast members rule book for instance or is it your take on the issue and how you feel it should be?

...If as you say Disney openly advertises those tables as for use by anyone, anytime then I would agree that saving tables is completely fine at their say so, however I'd like to know where this rule is available to see?

We can get into philosophical discussion about "rules," but needless to say, it's well and generally accepted that "rules," or "laws" as you put it, are typically prescribed by prohibited acts, not affirmative rights. For example, Disney states that I cannot smoke, except in designated smoking areas. Conversely, Disney does not state that I can smile, laugh, take pictures of the castle, or sit down at a table that is otherwise unrestricted by reservations or seated by a host/hostess. It's quite silly to think that Disney would attempt to list all of the "laws" that guests may engage in. It's much more efficient to publish the "thou shall not" commandments.

As for your "when Disney is full" illustration, then yes, Disney - via its CMs - are expressly providing a "rule" for that situation. And that is perfectly fine. Their "laws" are subject to change to meet variables that can change.

For example, I can stop on the sidewalk on Main Street and take a photo, or window shop, etc. Do I need a "rule" or "law" published in the guidemap or a sign on the sidewalk telling me that I can? Of course not. We don't leave our common sense at the turnstiles. However, during a parade, Disney makes an adjustment to this otherwise permissible behavior by having CMs tell me and other guests that we cannot stop on the sidewalk (unless we're in a designated viewing area) and that we must keep moving. Are they "contradicting their own law?" Of course not. They are implementing a procedure appropriate for that specific time of day, during that specific show event. Guests don't need to be told that they may stop on the sidewalk before and after that time period. :hammer:

:)
 

sbkline

Well-Known Member
I usually go get the food while my wife sits down with one of our two children. I do not see a problem with this, as we sit and eat, then leave. We do not stay around really any longer than we need to be there. I would rather have people sit down than having their whole families standing in line and crowding it even more than it already is. There really is not need to have your whole family standing and waiting.

I'm trying to figure out how on Earth this would create capacity problems? This statement makes no sense to me. Have you seen the lines that you stand in to get your food at a counter service? There's barely enough room for one person with a tray, and you want me to clog it up with the four of us? This is really just mind boggling to me. When we do counter service, either I or my wife takes our 2 kids(11 &10) and we find a table, while the other goes to get the food. We know what we like to eat so it doesn't take but maybe 5 minutes to get it.


Want proof? I'd bet that the family that was bugging the OP had went in the line as a group and went to find a table as a group.


This is how I see it, too. Go ahead and do it, I see no problem with it.
 

sbkline

Well-Known Member
Seating capacity is typically calculated based on a complex formula that takes into account the rate at which people can be served at an establishment, how quickly people eat and a host of other things. So the traffic flow is such that people are served at a constant rate, and the people currently sitting at the tables are in varying stages of eating. The calculations find the sweet-spot (plus a bit of a buffer to account for slow eaters, CMs wiping down tables, etc) where enough people are finishing their meals and leaving, opening up tables for people who are just walking away from the counter with their food. Saving tables throws a wrench into that calculation.

And the way I look at whether it's "right" to do it is to take the issue to the (admittedly highly-unlikely) extreme: Imagine if EVERY table was being held for people who are still in line, leaving zero open tables for people who are walking away from the counter with their food.

Over time, as others have pointed out, it's gotten to the point of self-perpetuating "cascade failure" where people hold tables, making others think that they should also hold a table, leading to too many people hold tables, not allowing those with food to sit down, and you get the fast-food equivalent of gridlock. That's why at some places like Pecos Bills they've started to strictly control traffic flow on the busiest days, not allowing people to proceed to the seating area until they actually have their food.

-Rob

As you say, it is a highly unlikely scenario and, in my opinion, so theoretical that it would never really happen.

But assumming it does, then unless there is some flaw in my reasoning that I am not considering, it seems to me that the only people this would affect would be single eaters. Because, in your hypothetical example, ALL parties of two or more have the rest of their party reserve a table. So that means that everyone in line (except single eaters) have someone holding a table for them. This means that, unless you are a single eater, when you walk away from the counter, someone is holding a table for you. Unless you want to add the further unlikely scenario that this does not apply to the first batch of people in line. That, after my wife and I get in line for food, a herd of people all come rushing in and have someone hold tables for them, such that by the time my wife and I are leaving the counter, all the tables have somehow filled up in 5 minutes. On second thought though, perhaps it's not as unlikely as I think, considering that the McDonald's drive through can look empty from the highway as I approach, but by the time I get there, there is a line. :lol: Seriously though, I look at terms of logic and efficiency, and I see no logic nor efficiency in having a bunch of people needlessly clogging up the line, getting in everyone's way, potentially making the line longer and thus getting in people's way who try to go through. Just makes no sense to me.

And the problem with taking the approach of "what if everyone did it", such instances are so unlikely that it's a moot point. It reminds me of the Daffy Duck cartoon where the shady insurance salesman is trying to rip him off with an insurance policy. Finally, he signs on the line, and then the salesman reveals the fine print that it will only pay out if it is on a snowy day on the fourth of July, with a herd of pink elephants stampeding, and a baby zebra coming through the door. Of course, as all cartoons go, the scenario actually came to pass, but in reality, we can conjecture extreme scenarios like that all we want, but it just doesn't happen.

But just to continue on the "what if everyone did it" hypothetical, let's look at the opposite and ask "what if NO ONE did it?". So let's say the average vacation party is a family of 3, and perhaps the statistics actually say it's 4 or 5, but we'll just go with 3. So for every 10 families represented in line, we have 30 people in line. Not only does this clog the line, and people can only stand side by side so far, before they have to stand behind each other, lengthening the line and giving the illusion of a longer line than it really is. So how much money in sales is Disney going to lose by other parties looking for a place to eat, but deciding that the line at this place is just way too long.? I know my wife and I often pass by a restaraunt that we want to eat at because the line is too long and we don't want to stand in that line. But perhaps the line isn't really as long as it looks. Maybe there are several families of 5 making the line longer, by not having the rest of the family get a table. So Disney can lose money by having people walk away because of this.

But the reality is that it all balances out in the end because neither "what if everyone did this" scenario will ever happen. Fact is, the bigger your party is, the more food that one person has to remember. If you're the one standing in line for a family of 5, for example, you have to remember what Mom wants, and what your three kids want, and sometimes people don't want to mess with that, either. Sometimes it's easier to have everyone there to say what they want, without having to remember everything. In addition, how is one person going to carry all that food? One person cannot carry all the food single handedly for 5 people. So the reality is, there will always be people holding tables and there will always be families who do not do this, for the reasons given.
 

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