News Happy 50th Birthday to Walt Disney World!

[Bullseye1967]

I view Kite Tails as a metaphor for the future of TWDC. It’s frankly one of the most brilliant shows Disney has put on in some times for its self-awareness. As @TP2000 describes it, it is both a comedy and a tragedy to behold and really a perfect benchmark as we turn a new chapter to usher in a new era of “immersive storytelling” that only the modern WDI can provide.

There’s not one aspect of the 50th that I would genuinely want to see more.

You obviously haven't seen the new 50th cupcakes!

 

[SuddenStorm]

Nothing unites the Disneyland half of the forum like laughing at Walt Disney World

 

[SuddenStorm]

Light Magic in 1997 was failure on many levels, but most notably from a crowd logistics and "onstage/offstage" perspective. At one point in the summer of 1997, they had to drag the giant floats down through the middle of Disneyland in late afternoon to stage them for a Main Street step off, after the original Small World step off location was causing crowd control near-riots to break out every night. So every afternoon just before the second Hercules parade started, these giant ugly floats never designed to be seen in daylight would roll down the parade route while CM's bellowed to get out of the way and the Voice of Disneyland explained to the crowds waiting for the Herculese Victory Parade "The large rolling stages you see before you will be used in this evening's performance of Light Magic. We thank you for your cooperation."

I had never heard this- and it's kind of awesome.

 

[TP2000]

To open this up with "Disney's magic of story telling" BS is ridiculous. What storytelling? You dragged Baloo around for awhile and then crashed him into the bleachers.

This is one thing that's gotten out of control at Disney parks lately; their language and their phrasing.

The show intros, as you mentioned, are asinine statements of corporate blather taken to Defcon 1.

But the humans explaining these shows to the fans also have fallen into this weird patter and language that is baffling. Take the info offered officially on this KiteTails show...

This show is officially introduced to us as... "Disney KiteTails is an all new daytime activation!"

Uh... what is a daytime activation? What are you activating? A force field? A fire alarm system? Huh?

Can you imagine Walt going on his TV show in 1965 and saying "And our New Orleans Square area will have all new daytime activations!"

Although, the young lady from TDO at 1:03 in this video who says "It's cool!" is genuinely endearing. There's no reason to filter out all genuine human emotion and talk like an uptight school marm.

But Disney used to filter its eye-rolling cubicle jargon out of its public statements, but no more. I'm not sure what's worse, a TDO guy telling us about "daytime activations", or the PA system telling us we are about to be "immersed in the magic of Disney storytelling". That's a tough choice.

 

[TP2000]

I had never heard this- and it's kind of awesome.

Oh, it was hysterical! The early community on alt.disney.disneyland called it "The Pixie 500" because they ran those giant rolling stages through the park as fast as they could because they were so ugly and jarring in the daytime. It helped that the Disneyland parade route is slightly downhill, so by the time they got to the Matterhorn they were really flying.

It was... bizarre and hilarious. But you best get out of their way!

Funny the things your brain remembers decades later.

 

[Californian Elitist]

Nothing unites the Disneyland half of the forum like laughing at Walt Disney World

I was thinking this as well. Somehow we can collectively get along and agree when it comes to displeasure about WDW. The kite show is a complete disaster though and it can’t be denied. The folks outside this forum are laughing, too.

All jokes aside, I do feel bad for WDW fans because they deserve better than the mediocrity that is the WDW 50th anniversary. Seems there was no genuine effort put into this, which is disappointing for long-time fans, I would imagine. I’m not a WDW fan and I have no plans to go out there during the 50th festivities, but I’d argue even Disneyland’s 60th was better than what they’re getting right now. There wasn’t even an official ceremony to commemorate the big day this past Friday on October 1st, which I was honestly shocked to hear about. I assumed they would at least have had a ceremony planned, but nope. Disneyland’s annual “happy birthday” every July 17th is more than what they got at MK on Friday, which is absolutely pathetic.

This is why I’m concerned about the 75th and potentially the 70th. Current management really just doesn’t understand the product, the legacy of the company, or the fans (casual and pixie dusted fans excluded). However, I do think Disneyland has an advantage over WDW, and that’s fanbase. This is just a theory and it’s based on my personal experiences with Disneyland, both as a guest and a CM, and interactions with WDW fans here and things I’ve read about WDW. There are enough passionate and hardcore/traditional DL fans to ensure that Disneyland anniversaries will have at least some nostalgia and connection to the park’s history incorporated somewhere. It seems it’s the opposite at WDW. Not saying that the resort doesn’t have passionate fans, just that they may be outnumbered, hence why their anniversary has no nostalgia tied into it. Again, this is just a theory. Disney management very well could just not have given a crap and it’s as simple as that.

Disneyland also has the benefit of being the original. Any significant anniversaries after ours, particularly stateside, will have to come up with something unique and great each time. Even the 60th didn’t live up to the 50th, though it was still a well-done anniversary. Being the original also means having rich history and a connection to Walt Disney that the others just don’t have, another advantage. I think that’s WDW’s, particularly MK’s problem. Its history is unique, but there’s a significant lack of connection to it. MK will always live in DL’s shadow, in my opinion, because both the fans and the company even seem to re-write the park’s history to make it seem similar to Disneyland’s, and it’s not similar at all. I’ve been seeing a lot of comments from fans complaining about the lack of Walt Disney mentions during the 50th. With the exception of planning E.P.C.O.T. (which never happened), Walt Disney had really nothing to do with WDW, if we’re being honest. Roy Disney is more deserving of a mention than Walt Disney. This is a classic example of what I’m talking about. Fans using quotes from Walt Disney about Disneyland to make points about WDW is another example and something I don’t understand. I’ve seen references to MK as “the happiest place on earth” as well. The histories between the two parks are obviously very distinct and different from each other, but there seems to be a lack of awareness regarding MK’s history. I do partially blame the company for this, as they don’t celebrate MK’s history anywhere near as much as they do DL’s. Maybe that’s another reason why WDW’s 50th is a dud.

Sorry for this dissertation of a response lol.

 

[BuzzedPotatoHead89]

I was thinking this as well. Somehow we can collectively get along and agree when it comes to displeasure about WDW. The kite show is a complete disaster though and it can’t be denied. The folks outside this forum are laughing, too.

All jokes aside, I do feel bad for WDW fans because they deserve better than the mediocrity that is the WDW 50th anniversary. Seems there was no genuine effort put into this, which is disappointing for long-time fans, I would imagine. I’m not a WDW fan and I have no plans to go out there during the 50th festivities, but I’d argue even Disneyland’s 60th was better than what they’re getting right now. There wasn’t even an official ceremony to commemorate the big day this past Friday on October 1st, which I was honestly shocked to hear about. I assumed they would at least have had a ceremony planned, but nope. Disneyland’s annual “happy birthday” every July 17th is more than what they got at MK on Friday, which is absolutely pathetic.

This is why I’m concerned about the 75th and potentially the 70th. Current management really just doesn’t understand the product, the legacy of the company, or the fans (casual and pixie dusted fans excluded). However, I do think Disneyland has an advantage over WDW, and that’s fanbase. This is just a theory and it’s based on my personal experiences with Disneyland, both as a guest and a CM, and interactions with WDW fans here and things I’ve read about WDW. There are enough passionate and hardcore/traditional DL fans to ensure that Disneyland anniversaries will have at least some nostalgia and connection to the park’s history incorporated somewhere. It seems it’s the opposite at WDW. Not saying that the resort doesn’t have passionate fans, just that they may be outnumbered, hence why their anniversary has no nostalgia tied into it. Again, this is just a theory. Disney management very well could just not have given a crap and it’s as simple as that.

Disneyland also has the benefit of being the original. Any significant anniversaries after ours, particularly stateside, will have to come up with something unique and great each time. Even the 60th didn’t live up to the 50th, though it was still a well-done anniversary. Being the original also means having rich history and a connection to Walt Disney that the others just don’t have, another advantage. I think that’s WDW’s, particularly MK’s problem. Its history is unique, but there’s a significant lack of connection to it. MK will always live in DL’s shadow, in my opinion, because both the fans and the company even seem to re-write the park’s history to make it seem similar to Disneyland’s, and it’s not similar at all. I’ve been seeing a lot of comments from fans complaining about the lack of Walt Disney mentions during the 50th. With the exception of planning E.P.C.O.T. (which never happened), Walt Disney had really nothing to do with WDW, if we’re being honest. Roy Disney is more deserving of a mention than Walt Disney. This is a classic example of what I’m talking about. Fans using quotes from Walt Disney about Disneyland to make points about WDW is another example and something I don’t understand. I’ve seen references to MK as “the happiest place on earth” as well. The histories between the two parks are obviously very distinct and different from each other, but there seems to be a lack of awareness regarding MK’s history. I do partially blame the company for this, as they don’t celebrate MK’s history anywhere near as much as they do DL’s. Maybe that’s another reason why WDW’s 50th is a dud.

Sorry for this dissertation of a response lol.

Very well written dissertation.

This has me pondering comparing the nature of the WDW vs DL celebrations: in the eyes of WDI and TDO (vs TDA) I think perhaps they lean in too heavily on how they foresee a different target market for WDW, one that is based in “middle America” and even some international travelers (COVID restrictions nin-withstanding) that as you note may not have the benefit of growing up with traditional park IPs.

For this reason I think there’s a prevailing belief out there (though it’s one I disagree with) that many guests that come to FL for the WDW celebration won’t have knowledge of classic attraction scores, Roy Disney, etc and know much of there Disney knowledge from the 90s/second golden age through predominantly the modern era films.

I imagine WDI creative thinks that a new guest trekking out to Florida would find a fireworks featuring Roy’s opening day speech and a collection of Magic Kingdom ditties from MSEP/baroque hoedown, It’s a Small World, Grim Grinning Ghosts, Peter Pan, Tiki Room, It’s a Great Big Beautiful Tomorrow, etc. to be boring and un-relatable to a first time visitor.

Contrast this to your average Disneyland visitor, many of whom are “lifers” of the park based in CA with APs or at a minimum have multiple visits under their belts.

 

[DrAlice]

Very well written dissertation.

This has me pondering comparing the nature of the WDW vs DL celebrations: in the eyes of WDI and TDO (vs TDA) I think perhaps they lean in too heavily on how they foresee a different target market for WDW, one that is based in “middle America” and even some international travelers (COVID restrictions nin-withstanding) that as you note may not have the benefit of growing up with traditional park IPs.

For this reason I think there’s a prevailing belief out there (though it’s one I disagree with) that many guests that come to FL for the WDW celebration won’t have knowledge of classic attraction scores, Roy Disney, etc and know much of there Disney knowledge from the 90s/second golden age through predominantly the modern era films.

I imagine WDI creative thinks that a new guest trekking out to Florida would find a fireworks featuring Roy’s opening day speech and a collection of Magic Kingdom ditties from MSEP/baroque hoedown, It’s a Small World, Grim Grinning Ghosts, Peter Pan, Tiki Room, It’s a Great Big Beautiful Tomorrow, etc. to be boring and un-relatable to a first time visitor.

Contrast this to your average Disneyland visitor, many of whom are “lifers” of the park based in CA with APs or at a minimum have multiple visits under their belts.

But yet..... they must have statistics about repeat visitors, right? They must know that there are many families visit year after year after year. I can't imagine that the majority of guests are 1st timers. Maybe I'm wrong. Either way, it's a terrible excuse to ignore the legacy of 50 years.

A youtuber recently mentioned that while current Disney loves to promote IP in the parks, it doesn't seem to recognize its own parks as IP (credit where it is due: https://www.youtube.com/user/AdventuresInDesign) . I think that is spot on. People don't plan trips to WDW or DL because of the latest Disney movie. They go because the parks are a special thing that people enjoy for being theme parks. The connection to the Disney movies are great obviously, but that's only one part of the park experience. We go to the parks for THE PARKS. This just doesn't seem to be something the latest execs understand.

 

[Centauri Space Station]

What's interesting is that over the last few decades Disneyland's entertainment team has already made many of these same mistakes that KiteTails has. This is yet more proof that Disney's American parks never actually talk to each other.

• Jetskis were added to Disneyland's Fantasmic! in 2009 to drag inflatable eels around during the Ursula scene, and kept crashing and flipping and generally failing. The jetskis were removed within weeks and never seen again.
• 
  
• The giant Ursula balloon herself in Fantasmic! was a pain in the neck for years, and eventually had to be removed and replaced with a screen projection.
• 
  
• How many times did they try doing shows in DCA's early failing years in that lagoon ampthitheater? And every time, the audience would hate it because they were sitting out in the hot sun without any shade. Now make that three times worse in Orlando's more brutal climate.
• 
  
• Light Magic in 1997 was failure on many levels, but most notably from a crowd logistics and "onstage/offstage" perspective. At one point in the summer of 1997, they had to drag the giant floats down through the middle of Disneyland in late afternoon to stage them for a Main Street step off, after the original Small World step off location was causing crowd control near-riots to break out every night. So every afternoon just before the second Hercules parade started, these giant ugly floats never designed to be seen in daylight would roll down the parade route while CM's bellowed to get out of the way and the Voice of Disneyland explained to the crowds waiting for the Herculese Victory Parade "The large rolling stages you see before you will be used in this evening's performance of Light Magic. We thank you for your cooperation."

This KiteTails show seems to take many of the mistakes Disneyland has already made, and roll them into one concept. But even then, the sight of Disney characters crashing into the bleachers to be stomped out by rapid-response CM's is something entirely new.

I'd buy the first round of drinks to hear the story behind how that all got approved, wouldn't you?!

Haha this is a great point but the jetskis and kites were actually used before at WDW as part of Epcot Forever. Even further back was the 20th anniversary show Surprise in the Skys featuring jet skis, kites, and inflatables too. Atleast SITS inflatables didnt crash into World Showcase

 

[BuzzedPotatoHead89]

But yet..... they must have statistics about repeat visitors, right? They must know that there are many families visit year after year after year. I can't imagine that the majority of guests are 1st timers. Maybe I'm wrong. Either way, it's a terrible excuse to ignore the legacy of 50 years.

100% I agree. I’m trying to present a devil’s advocate argument (or a “yessiree Bob (Chapek)” if you might call it that).

There seems to be a perception out there the target audience is simply not sophisticated enough to appreciate parks history, even for a milestone anniversary event. I can assume the metrics are based on sales through consumer products, but it’s kind of hard to disprove since some theme park/attractions IPs haven’t exactly been marketed heavily nationwide in a long time, if ever.

It’s the pinnacle of executive laziness to be sure but it also is shameless self promotion for the company’s latest IPs.

 

[Californian Elitist]

Very well written dissertation.

This has me pondering comparing the nature of the WDW vs DL celebrations: in the eyes of WDI and TDO (vs TDA) I think perhaps they lean in too heavily on how they foresee a different target market for WDW, one that is based in “middle America” and even some international travelers (COVID restrictions nin-withstanding) that as you note may not have the benefit of growing up with traditional park IPs.

For this reason I think there’s a prevailing belief out there (though it’s one I disagree with) that many guests that come to FL for the WDW celebration won’t have knowledge of classic attraction scores, Roy Disney, etc and know much of there Disney knowledge from the 90s/second golden age through predominantly the modern era films.

I imagine WDI creative thinks that a new guest trekking out to Florida would find a fireworks featuring Roy’s opening day speech and a collection of Magic Kingdom ditties from MSEP/baroque hoedown, It’s a Small World, Grim Grinning Ghosts, Peter Pan, Tiki Room, It’s a Great Big Beautiful Tomorrow, etc. to be boring and un-relatable to a first time visitor.

Contrast this to your average Disneyland visitor, many of whom are “lifers” of the park based in CA with APs or at a minimum have multiple visits under their belts.

Yes, exactly. I think it’s very obvious that TDO underestimates the interests of WDW’s loyal and long-time fans. It seems that maybe they don’t think WDW fans would appreciate nostalgia in the same we DL fans appreciate it, so they leave it out and assume that guests wouldn’t enjoy it.

DL fans have proven time and time again that nostalgia is a sure way for lots of money and time spent at the park, whereas WDW have yet to do that on a scale that would be noticeable to those managing the parks out there. I honestly don’t believe that DL fans have power over execs, but I do remember fans being in an uproar over Disney temporarily turning Main Street Cinema into a shop. The shop was removed after what seemed to be two or three days. Not sure if something like that would happen at WDW or not.

But yet..... they must have statistics about repeat visitors, right? They must know that there are many families visit year after year after year. I can't imagine that the majority of guests are 1st timers. Maybe I'm wrong. Either way, it's a terrible excuse to ignore the legacy of 50 years.

A youtuber recently mentioned that while current Disney loves to promote IP in the parks, it doesn't seem to recognize its own parks as IP (credit where it is due: https://www.youtube.com/user/AdventuresInDesign) . I think that is spot on. People don't plan trips to WDW or DL because of the latest Disney movie. They go because the parks are a special thing that people enjoy for being theme parks. The connection to the Disney movies are great obviously, but that's only one part of the park experience. We go to the parks for THE PARKS. This just doesn't seem to be something the latest execs understand.

I also don’t buy that the majority of WDW guests are first-timers. I do believe that there’s a difference between long-time DL fans and longtime WDW fans though, and I think that difference sometimes helps determines the decisions made for each respective resort/park.

You're also spot on about the parks themselves being an IP and current management failing to understand that.

 

[Centauri Space Station]

Its honestly crazy WDW devoted an interim firework show featuring songs from extinct attractions nobody over the age of 28 would have knowledge of at Epcot but cant bother with any nostalgia for the 50th?

 

[TP2000]

The histories between the two parks are obviously very distinct and different from each other, but there seems to be a lack of awareness regarding MK’s history. I do partially blame the company for this, as they don’t celebrate MK’s history anywhere near as much as they do DL’s. Maybe that’s another reason why WDW’s 50th is a dud.

I still think they are sitting on a goldmine of WDW history that they've barely tapped into. This 50th Celebration, full of predictable PA announcement pablub about "dreams" and "magic" and "immersed in storytelling", only proves they have no idea what they're doing out there.

This 50th thing is Bob Chapek's party, unfortunately.

Then there's the clueless cubicle farms of Celebration who cling to this fake history that Walt was planning the Magic Kingdom Park on his deathbed, when actually he produced and starred in an entire promotional film about six weeks before he died where he showed quite clearly that the "theme park" was an afterthought to him and only a cut-and-paste copy of Disneyland circa 1966, right down to New Orleans Square, Nature's Wonderland, and the Flying Saucers. Walt spent more time on the Airport of the Future, and 1,000 Acre Industrial Park, and EPCOT than he did "the theme park area" as seen in this WED planning document from late 1966.

Walt didn't even bother to cut the Chicken Of The Sea pirate ship out of this thing in late '66.

Meanwhile, the real story of WDW's development takes place during 1968-1971, years after Walt's death. Who drew up those plans we see today? How did they get to those design decisions without Walt? Who was in charge? Who made those decisions, and what were the alternatives? Why don't they embrace that and showcase it, instead of creating fake history based on a 1967-1971 timeline that never existed?

It's creepy, but it's also idiotic. Even if they've been able to fool a bunch of sheep consumers east of the Mississippi into thinking Walt actually helped build Walt Disney World.

 

[TP2000]

Its honestly crazy WDW devoted an interim firework show featuring songs from extinct attractions nobody over the age of 28 would have knowledge of at Epcot but cant bother with any nostalgia for the 50th?

Is that the Magic Kingdom Park fireworks?

I watched the Epcot laser water show thing, Harmonious, via a very good video on YouTube. But even then I had to skip ahead every once in awhile because it was so boring and flat.

I'm afraid it's going to be a few days before I can bear to watch a new Magic Kingdom fireworks show.

All of these videos showing the carnage and clearly disrespectful behavior shown to the historically under represented Kite-Based Balloon Community in the KiteTails footage has taken its toll on me this weekend. I can only put up with so much bloodshed and deflation in the bleachers.

I'm going to have to watch some puppy videos to heal, before I can focus on WDW's 50th again...

 

[TP2000]

Okay, I lied. Forget about the dumb puppies.

Let's watch more KiteTails!

On Sunday afternoon, King Louie nailed his landing like the pro he is and the crowd goes wild!

 

[TP2000]

I'm calling my travel agent in the morning!

Rumor is they're going to make the bleachers section next to the Crash Landing Deflation Zone a Genie+ Lightning Lane upcharge.

I've got to get out there before all the Lightning Lane reservations are taken for this section of bleachers!

 

[DrAlice]

A crash landing video showed up in my Facebook feed this morning. The vast majority of comments showed that most people didn't understand that the crashes are INTENDED. So, to the average guest that goes to this show, they are left with the feeling that they watched a show accident.

I'd be embarrassed for the execs if I thought they actually cared about putting out a quality product.

 

[No Name]

It’s funny how two other very bad shows (Harmonious and Enchantment) debuted last weekend too and this kite disaster is stealing all of the attention here.

I still think they are sitting on a goldmine of WDW history that they've barely tapped into. This 50th Celebration, full of predictable PA announcement pablub about "dreams" and "magic" and "immersed in storytelling", only proves they have no idea what they're doing out there.

This 50th thing is Bob Chapek's party, unfortunately.

Then there's the clueless cubicle farms of Celebration who cling to this fake history that Walt was planning the Magic Kingdom Park on his deathbed, when actually he produced and starred in an entire promotional film about six weeks before he died where he showed quite clearly that the "theme park" was an afterthought to him and only a cut-and-paste copy of Disneyland circa 1966, right down to New Orleans Square, Nature's Wonderland, and the Flying Saucers. Walt spent more time on the Airport of the Future, and 1,000 Acre Industrial Park, and EPCOT than he did "the theme park area" as seen in this WED planning document from late 1966.

Walt didn't even bother to cut the Chicken Of The Sea pirate ship out of this thing in late '66.
View attachment 590939


Meanwhile, the real story of WDW's development takes place during 1968-1971, years after Walt's death. Who drew up those plans we see today? How did they get to those design decisions without Walt? Who was in charge? Who made those decisions, and what were the alternatives? Why don't they embrace that and showcase it, instead of creating fake history based on a 1967-1971 timeline that never existed?

It's creepy, but it's also idiotic. Even if they've been able to fool a bunch of sheep consumers east of the Mississippi into thinking Walt actually helped build Walt Disney World.

Walt is a big part of the brand (something that his family was divided on) to the point that they create statues of him and idolize him and whatnot. It gives the company character. It gives them quotes to use out of context. I get why they do it. But yeah I absolutely wish they would celebrate the change in focus that happened in those years, because then they’d be celebrating the resort for what it actually became. Magic Kingdom was something Walt had no interest in building and mostly agreed to as a compromise to get EPCOT funded. Now it’s iconic because of that shift in focus.

 

[TP2000]

It’s funny how two other very bad shows (Harmonious and Enchantment) debuted last weekend too and this kite disaster is stealing all of the attention here.

Because it's the most entertaining thing they've got out there for WDW's 50th.

Here's a recent show from Monday afternoon, where Non-Inclusive King Louie crashes perfectly onto the deflated remains of Baloo. Perfection! The jetski guys are really getting good at cutting their cords so the Deflation CM's can wrap up the crime scene.

Walt is a big part of the brand (something that his family was divided on) to the point that they create statues of him and idolize him and whatnot. It gives the company character. It gives them quotes to use out of context. I get why they do it. But yeah I absolutely wish they would celebrate the change in focus that happened in those years, because then they’d be celebrating the resort for what it actually became. Magic Kingdom was something Walt had no interest in building and mostly agreed to as a compromise to get EPCOT funded. Now it’s iconic because of that shift in focus.

Very true.

I think it bugs many of us because it's so inherently dishonest. And TDO peddles the fabricated history to sell more t-shirts and coffee cups to their fans who actually believed the fabrications.

 

[Communicora]

Because it's the most entertaining thing they've got out there for WDW's 50th.

Here's a recent show from Monday afternoon, where Non-Inclusive King Louie crashes perfectly onto the deflated remains of Baloo. Perfection! The jetski guys are really getting good at cutting their cords so the Deflation CM's can wrap up the crime scene.






Very true.

I think it bugs many of us because it's so inherently dishonest. And TDO peddles the fabricated history to sell more t-shirts and coffee cups to their fans who actually believed the fabrications.

Yes. They treat Walt as another character or part of their IP, rather than as a person.