Guardians of the Galaxy: Cosmic Rewind SPOILER Thread

[Casper Gutman]

I couldn't disagree more about Velocicoaster -- I think it significantly detracts from what was previously one of the best areas at Universal.

I really disagree with this. Jurassic Park was always the least visually interesting section of the park to me, a long stretch of nothing you had to walk through if you were circling the lake, a big void between HP and Kong. Velo adds a lot of kineticism and visual interest to the area.

Do I want Disney to start building naked coasters? Nope. But Uni and Disney adopted different design philosophies regarding such coasters, and while I marginally prefer Disney’s approach, as long as Uni overwhelms the naked coasters with heavily themed areas and hides them as much as possible, it really doesn’t bother me. And frankly, I find Velo less obnoxious then GotG big blue box.

 

[TheEPCOTHistorian]

Everyone understands the (very contrived) plot logic, but it’s more of the shameless leveraging of nostalgia for attractions that the company destroyed but wants to continue to profit from. It has always bordered on outright gloating, but this seems to cross the line. It’s a glib acknowledgement that they wrecked something people loved.

I understand this, and I'm in the exact same camp of belief as you guys. But why are we going to spend our time upset that they're mentioning it. Do you not think they understand this and know what happened? At least they *TRIED* something. We could have had a clone of WebSlingers or some random BS.

 

[yensidtlaw1969]

I understand this, and I'm in the exact same camp of belief as you guys. But why are we going to spend our time upset that they're mentioning it. Do you not think they understand this and know what happened? At least they *TRIED* something. We could have had a clone of WebSlingers or some random BS.

I feel like it would have been plenty easy for them to try something that simply doesn't yet again demonstrate utter contempt for the very park it's in. "EPCOT?? Who NAMES these things??" . . . *Groan*.

But if I were you I wouldn't stress about the amount of time people are spending being upset about it. I bet you none of us are losing sleep over it. I'm certainly not. I suspect most of us have a pretty healthy level of frustration about this stuff*.





*Despite some notable, vocal exceptions in this thread.

 

[jerseygirl29]

The vidoes I’ve seen have made me so nauseous! I can’t ride space anymore because it makes me feel sick hoping I can make it through this one haha.

 

[UNCgolf]

I really disagree with this. Jurassic Park was always the least visually interesting section of the park to me, a long stretch of nothing you had to walk through if you were circling the lake, a big void between HP and Kong. Velo adds a lot of kineticism and visual interest to the area.

Do I want Disney to start building naked coasters? Nope. But Uni and Disney adopted different design philosophies regarding such coasters, and while I marginally prefer Disney’s approach, as long as Uni overwhelms the naked coasters with heavily themed areas and hides them as much as possible, it really doesn’t bother me. And frankly, I find Velo less obnoxious then GotG big blue box.

The JP area was my favorite part of IoA! Although I suppose it's helped by the fact that River Adventure is my favorite ride there, but I really liked that whole area. Hogsmeade was probably second.

 

[Epcot82Guy]

If they truly had wanted this to pull the old crowd back in, they would have had the story be - Stan Lee is writing a new Guardians comic . It's inspired by how corporate greed destroys nostalgia. So, you'll join Peter Q - a huge fan of EPCOT Center - and the other Guardians as they race to fight a villain attempting to destroy hope and inspiration in the world. Using the inspiration of Epcot past, present and future, you can win - restoring the ideas and vision of inspiration EPCOT Center promoted.

The name of the villain is, of course, BOBS.

 

[GimpYancIent]

If they truly had wanted this to pull the old crowd back in, they would have had the story be - Stan Lee is writing a new Guardians comic . It's inspired by how corporate greed destroys nostalgia. So, you'll join Peter Q - a huge fan of EPCOT Center - and the other Guardians as they race to fight a villain attempting to destroy hope and inspiration in the world. Using the inspiration of Epcot past, present and future, you can win - restoring the ideas and vision of inspiration EPCOT Center promoted.

The name of the villain is, of course, BOBS.

Villains + minions = BOB's (two, no more no less)

 

[choco choco]

Seems pretty much spot on what everyone guessed it was going to be like, nary a surprise in sight.

It’s a roller coaster, the bar for it at least being a decent attraction are very low, and it gets there.

But what did they spend $450 million on?

 

[Sir_Cliff]

It is the type of roller coaster Disney is building. Over and over again. I kinda think BTM and, to a lesser extent, EE are the kinds of coasters they should be building, but to each their own.

Agreed; I said the same thing either earlier in this thread or in another thread.

It's a coaster that's actually fully themed with things happening from beginning to end. Would some physical sets and AAs be nice? Of course, and I think Everest/BTMR are probably more in line with the ideal Disney coaster. But this is a vast improvement over other recent Disney coasters like Slinky Dog Dash and TRON.

I'd just like to see them build three or four (or more) dark/water/etc. rides for every one coaster.

I understand both these perspectives on this one. On the one hand, there is something about Tony Baxter explaining how BTM was designed to look like the mountain was already there and the track was built over it that seems a level of artistry we don't see too often from WDI these days. On the other hand, I have to give them some credit for this one in that it seems like they have come up with a whole little world that you step into when you enter the queue that follows through to the conclusion of the ride.

Honestly, watching the video of the queue made me a little nostalgic as I remember as a child from Australia I knew next to nothing about Disneyland the first time we visited but my mother said something about how one of her friends had told her the queues were not so bad because they entertained you while you were waiting. The very first attraction we went on was Star Tours which really made me understand what that meant even as a 10 year-old. This whole set-up really reminds me of that experience of being led through the queue to the attraction.

 

[UNCgolf]

I understand both these perspectives on this one. On the one hand, there is something about Tony Baxter explaining how BTM was designed to look like the mountain was already there and the track was built over it that seems a level of artistry we don't see too often from WDI these days. On the other hand, I have to give them some credit for this one in that it seems like they have come up with a whole little world that you step into when you enter the queue that follows through to the conclusion of the ride.

Honestly, watching the video of the queue made me a little nostalgic as I remember as a child from Australia I knew next to nothing about Disneyland the first time we visited but my mother said something about how one of her friends had told her the queues were not so bad because they entertained you while you were waiting. The very first attraction we went on was Star Tours which really made me understand what that meant even as a 10 year-old. This whole set-up really reminds me of that experience of being led through the queue to the attraction.

Ideally any future coasters would be closer to BTM than anything else. But the last three coasters they've built at WDW are this, Slinky, and TRON. There's no comparison between this and the latter two. Guardians relies entirely on screens, which is far from ideal, but screens are certainly better than nothing at all -- and that's what you get for Slinky and TRON, for the most part.

I don't think this is one of the best attractions Disney has built (it wouldn't even be a top 5 attraction at original EPCOT), but I'm happy that it's such an improvement over those other recent coasters.

On the other hand, this did somehow cost $450 million, and it doesn't appear to come close to justifying that price tag. I don't think they will be in a rush to spend that kind of money on a single attraction again (if ever).

 

[Sir_Cliff]

Ideally any future coasters would be closer to BTM than anything else. But the last three coasters they've built at WDW are this, Slinky, and TRON. There's no comparison between this and the latter two. Guardians relies entirely on screens, which is far from ideal, but screens are certainly better than nothing at all -- and that's what you get for Slinky and TRON, for the most part.

I don't think this is one of the best attractions Disney has built (it wouldn't even be a top 5 attraction at original EPCOT), but I'm happy that it's such an improvement over those other recent coasters.

On the other hand, this did somehow cost $450 million (nothing we've seen seems to remotely justify that price tag). I don't think they will be in a rush to spend that kind of money on a single attraction again (if ever).

Yes, it does seem like the best coaster they have come up with since perhaps Everest?

There is something about the queue that is a little sad in that it is a fake Epcot pavilion about things that don't actually exist as a mere conceit for a theme park attraction. There's part of me that likes they are at least continuing to push the concept that Epcot is something different from the other parks rather than just setting down a rollercoaster as though it was in Tomorrowland or DHS. Still, there is something that feels a bit sad about self-referential Epcot attractions with no actual educational or inspirational goal.

 

[Coaster Lover]

But what did they spend $450 million on?

Voice actors that poorly imitate Bradly Cooper...

 

[Casper Gutman]

Yes, it does seem like the best coaster they have come up with since perhaps Everest?

There is something about the queue that is a little sad in that it is a fake Epcot pavilion about things that don't actually exist as a mere conceit for a theme park attraction. There's part of me that likes they are at least continuing to push the concept that Epcot is something different from the other parks rather than just setting down a rollercoaster as though it was in Tomorrowland or DHS. Still, there is something that feels a bit sad about self-referential Epcot attractions with no actual educational or inspirational goal.

I totally agree with what you said about the importance and artistry of queues - Indy, ToT, ST, etc are masterpieces. I don’t really see the enthusiasm for this queue - I think GotG will be a vastly superior ride to Rat, but I think Rat features the much more well-themed queue.

I actually think they overdid the backstory here (something they are prone to do). All the Xandalarian stuff strikes me as unnecessary. We know Quill loves EPCOT - why not have the line be ostensibly themed to classic UoE before Star Lord hijacks us to present his own, wildly unsafe version of EPCOT edutainment?

I can’t make out every element of the ride videos, but does the “Rewind” element of the plot actually factor into the ride visually at any point? I expected there to be some really cool projection effect on the one physical prop, the giant ball, showing a planet forming or collapsing, but it seems to be just… a moon.

 

[MisterPenguin]

Diznoids

 

[Sir_Cliff]

I totally agree with what you said about the importance and artistry of queues - Indy, ToT, ST, etc are masterpieces. I don’t really see the enthusiasm for this queue - I think GotG will be a vastly superior ride to Rat, but I think Rat features the much more well-themed queue.

I actually think they overdid the backstory here (something they are prone to do). All the Xandalarian stuff strikes me as unnecessary. We know Quill loves EPCOT - why not have the line be ostensibly themed to classic UoE before Star Lord hijacks us to present his own, wildly unsafe version of EPCOT edutainment?

I guess I am imagining standing in that queue with other people and it seems like they give you enough to look at and listen to so that you are being led along without it requiring too much attention nor it being too static and boring to fill the time. The references to Quill having visited Epcot seem a little like Easter eggs to me, but the references to this being an Epcot pavilion at least recognise that an Epcot pavilion is a thing. In other words, the attraction at least keeps alive that the logic according to which Epcot is organized is different to the other parks rather than just setting down a Guardians of the Galaxy rollercoaster.

 

[No Name]

The main problem with Coaster Track is that it telegraphs in a highly visible way exactly what it is - a Roller Coaster. Such structures are found pretty exclusively in one type of place - Amusement/Theme Parks.

The issue is that when you're in a Theme Park you're generally not meant to feel like you're in a Theme Park, you're meant to feel like you're somewhere else. Generally, both you and the park have paid a lot of money for the illusion that you're somewhere else. High-flying exposed coaster track is the quickest way to undercut all the rest of the immersion and remind people where they actually are instead of where they're meant to feel like they are. Which defeats much of the purpose of a Theme Park vs. a mere Amusement Park.

There are ways of doing it that work; as someone mentioned earlier, Velocicoaster is set Jurassic World, which is still a theme park, so a coaster isn't wholly inappropriate. That sort of level of thematic redundancy isn't my personal favorite, but it's technically a fair justification for exposed coaster track. How the sightlines impact the other lands is a bit of a different story, but your mileage may vary about how much that sort of intrusion bothers you. But within it, the exposed track doesn't break the theme of the land because "Theme Park" is the theme of that land.

However, the places within theme parks where "Theme Park" is the theme are few and far between, precisely because so much of the design goal of a theme park is to help you forget you're actually in one. So a good first step to doing that is to mask out anyting that screams "Theme Park". That's why Disney doesn't have a lot of Ferris Wheels, either - they give away the "secret" that this whole place is actually a kind of Amusement Park, despite millions of dollars and years of construction meant to convince you otherwise.

I agree but that is why I mentioned it only works when it makes thematic sense. I don’t think a nicely-painted low-elevation coaster carefully integrated through Epcot makes any less sense than a monorail doing the same, especially if it were to have a show scene or two befitting the park.

 

[MisterPenguin]

The Incridicoaster is a thrilling ride that would fit in a regional coaster parks portfolio nicely, ditto RnRC. ToT and it’s derivatives would also be considered thrilling there as well.

Disney can push the envelope on thrilling rides it just closes to rarely do so.

There are problems surrounding adding more thrilling rides... for now.

The MK has the reputation for being for children. But children screamed their heads off in the ExtraTerrorstrial attraction. Despite numerous signs and verbal warnings, parents thought everything was Disney-safe-for-children. The reaction to it was so bad, it brought down the overall guest satisfaction scores for the MK. It was hurting the brand, and a lot of parents were angry (same for Stitch).

So, then how about the other parks... well, yes and no. RnRC and ToT did well in DHS. But DHS only had less than seven rides for a long time. And thrill rides have height limits. So, a family only had 3 or 4 rides they could go on in DHS.

"Families" (the four quadrants of male/female/boy/girl) is Disney's bread and butter. Chase away families and the parks' bottom line suffers. And you get the situation where week long vacationers will spend several days in the MK and maybe just one day in some of the other parks, which makes MK continually overcrowded.

So, for now, putting up more thrill rides is problematic. They won't work in MK. And the other parks don't have enough family rides yet to justify adding rides that small children can't go on.

The other three parks need more rides immediately. I wish people would stop whining about adding more rides to MK which already has too many -- compared to the other parks.

 

[MisterPenguin]

A propos to this thread...

 

[yensidtlaw1969]

I agree but that is why I mentioned it only works when it makes thematic sense. I don’t think a nicely-painted low-elevation coaster carefully integrated through Epcot makes any less sense than a monorail doing the same, especially if it were to have a show scene or two befitting the park.

I didn't say it necessarily would. With some sort of Peoplemover-type conceit I suppose it could work. EPCOT is a theme park, but generally plays by different rules regarding its theme - it was always a little more brechtian in its presentation than really any other park. That doesn't automatically preclude it from featuring an exposed track roller coaster, it would just have to be integrated in a way that doesn't scream "THIS IS A THEME PARK".

 

[Casper Gutman]

I guess I am imagining standing in that queue with other people and it seems like they give you enough to look at and listen to so that you are being led along without it requiring too much attention nor it being too static and boring to fill the time. The references to Quill having visited Epcot seem a little like Easter eggs to me, but the references to this being an Epcot pavilion at least recognise that an Epcot pavilion is a thing. In other words, the attraction at least keeps alive that the logic according to which Epcot is organized is different to the other parks rather than just setting down a Guardians of the Galaxy rollercoaster.

For me, there is a very fine line between “respectfully acknowledging EPCOTS past” and “exploiting nostalgia for rides we destroyed to sell merchandise.” I agree that acknowledging GotG is an EPCOT pavilion is the right move, but as I said I’d take it even further - having Quill literally interrupt an attraction in order to try to recreate a cherished experience he shared with his Mother better preserves the thematic unity of that section of the park, at least nods towards edutainment, and, most importantly, provides an emotional narrative through-line that better represents the GotG films and is likely to resonate meaningfully with many guests. Essentially, I think that even though everyone rolled their eyes at the “Quill visited EPCOT” thing, Disney should have leaned into it even harder. Heck, you could even have the preshow be in amongst the AA dinos, where Quill has crashed the Milano!

At the moment, the Guardians seem like secondary figures in their own ride - why did they need Gunn to shoot this?