News Guardians of the Galaxy Cosmic Rewind attraction confirmed for Epcot

[Casper Gutman]

I think everyone laments the lack of animatronics, but holy exaggeration.

Nope. The Rewind ride may be fantastic. The heavily emphasized pre-show that is longer then the ride itself is garbage, monotonous nonsense on a bunch of TV screens. Even the rides greatest champions spend little time defending it. The promised pre-show, featuring a life-sized, three-dimensional Milano and several AAs of beloved characters, would have added a great deal to the attraction. It would also have made what is barely a Guardians attraction an actual Guardians attraction. It’s a huge change.

 

[eliza61nyc]

So your theory is that the concept art was smuggled out of Disney against the company’s will and used in PR materials for years despite Disney’s best efforts to suppress it?

What??
Okay I'm not sure I understand how we got there but no, someone was lamenting that the general public was not informed of every change in design that occurred between conception and final product and I was pointing out that there is a lot of changes that happened between the two (based on my ONE and only ONE experience) and that the company had absolutely no obligation of letting it's fanbase know of it's decision .

just for giggles I did a quick search on what the object of conception art is

What is the purpose of concept art?


Concept art helps to convey the look, feel and mood of a design idea. It is used to capture and convey the overall design vision of a project before anything goes into production, versus trying to express everything in specific terms at the very beginning of design development

 

[Casper Gutman]

why is there any "fault", from what I understand the ride is extremely nice. Because it doesn't have AA??

The “fault” is in Disney’s deceptive promotional practices, particularly the use of deliberately misleading PR materials. The ride itself is, by all accounts, a thrilling, strong addition to EPCOT. The queue and pre-show are lightly-themed, badly written, cheap looking disappointments that make the wonderful Guardians IP an afterthought in the attraction. All of which the concept art was used to hide.

 

[eliza61nyc]

The “fault” is in Disney’s deceptive promotional practices, particularly the use of deliberately misleading PR materials. The ride itself is, by all accounts, a thrilling, strong addition to EPCOT. The queue and pre-show are lightly-themed, badly written, cheap looking disappointments that make the wonderful Guardians IP an afterthought in the attraction. All of which the concept art was used to hide.

in your opinion. fixed it

 

[lazyboy97o]

Yes we did but we did get a lot of the same criticism that floats around here. Now I knew Disney has scaled down every project they announce I had no idea they were totally doing away with the projects. It seems they still build what they announce it just doesn't match the initial renderings.
and yes that's what the poster said, that disney should be forthcoming with it's changes.
I thought the complaint was basically it was not the same, for example I know people complain that 7 dwarfs mine train ride was drastically cut. Was it supposed to not be a ride? They aren't announcing Tiana's bayou whatever and then building a restaurant or a mall, it will still be a flume ride correct?

How many times must it be said that renders aren’t made just at the very beginning of a project? Most projects are past the concept design phase when they are announced. Making accurate renderings has become easier than ever which is how some “concept art” is the actual blueprints.

And yes, Disney has completely done away with projects despite being announced. Main Street Theater, Reflections and EPCOT Festival Center were all announced.

 

[Casper Gutman]

What??
Okay I'm not sure I understand how we got there but no, someone was lamenting that the general public was not informed of every change in design that occurred between conception and final product and I was pointing out that there is a lot of changes that happened between the two (based on my ONE and only ONE experience) and that the company had absolutely no obligation of letting it's fanbase know of it's decision .

just for giggles I did a quick search on what the object of conception art is

What is the purpose of concept art?


Concept art helps to convey the look, feel and mood of a design idea. It is used to capture and convey the overall design vision of a project before anything goes into production, versus trying to express everything in specific terms at the very beginning of design development

You understand that the concept art in question was not just used for internal purposes, as such art often is, right? It was used, over many years, as PR material to create a false impression in the general public.

 

[James Alucobond]

Nope. The Rewind ride may be fantastic. The heavily emphasized pre-show that is longer then the ride itself is garbage, monotonous nonsense on a bunch of TV screens. Even the rides greatest champions spend little time defending it. The promised pre-show, featuring a life-sized, three-dimensional Milano and several AAs of beloved characters, would have added a great deal to the attraction. It would also have made what is barely a Guardians attraction an actual Guardians attraction. It’s a huge change.

'Kay. I still can't fathom what metric you're using to establish that they delivered half of what they promised. You're missing pre-show elements from one piece of concept art, and the Nova Corps ship has a stand not present in another piece that they resorted to using instead of going off-model for a better visual effect. All other art is basically 1:1.

 

[donsullivan]

Some here would be well served to read this:

Concept art - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Casper Gutman]

in your opinion. fixed it

I’ve read a lot of reviews praising the coaster section of Rewind. I have read very, very few saying anything good about the queue and pre-show - in fact, a more common approach is to, again, try and blame guests for the lackluster theming and overall design. If we accept the parts of first-hand accounts we like, it’s honest to accept the parts of those accounts we don’t.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Some here would be well served to read this:

Concept art - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

How many times must it be said that what is called “concept art” is not all concept art, and absolutely does come from later phases of design?

 

[Casper Gutman]

'Kay. I still can't fathom what metric you're using to establish that they delivered half of what they promised. You're missing pre-show elements from one piece of concept art, and the Nova Corps ship has a stand not present in another piece that they resorted to using instead of going off-model for a better visual effect. All other art is basically 1:1.

The accurate queue art was released very, very late in the projects development and Disney made little effort to spread it widely. The piece of art under discussion received heavy PR emphasis for years.

And for a modern Uni or Disney ride, yes, the queue and pre-show are half the attraction.

 

[Casper Gutman]

Some here would be well served to read this:

Concept art - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Why was the piece of “concept art” under discussion released to the public? What was the intent behind its release? Why was more accurate art not released until the project was almost ready to open?

 

[James Alucobond]

The accurate queue art was released very, very late in the projects development and Disney made little effort to spread it widely. The piece of art under discussion received heavy PR emphasis for years.

I recall pieces like the Galaxarium, ride vehicle, basic premise art, etc. being shown quite early and often as well, all of which they delivered on. I might agree with you if the pre-show simply didn't exist; instead, it's altered from what was shown. Even if you consider it significantly diminished from what you felt was promised, in no galaxy have they delivered half of the experience. Maybe half of what you think should be there based on the price tag, but not half of what was in the artwork.

 

[donsullivan]

Why was the piece of “concept art” under discussion released to the public? What was the intent behind its release? Why was more accurate art not released until the project was almost ready to open?

I find it fascinating, if not downright amusing that you feel so personally offended by the fact that Disney didn't provide you with regular progress reports and keep you updated on the evolution of the attraction throughout it's development and construction. They have absolutely no obligation of any kind to do anything like that, and getting all angry because they didn't is your personal choice and not a result of anything Disney did wrong. They shared an early concept of what they were thinking to set the mood, the provided multiple updates along the final stages of construction including showing the new 'to Disney' ride system they were going to use along with the ride vehicles. Seems they just should have said they were building a popcorn stand and left it like that until it opened.You could have made up the whole thing then and been totally disappointed by all of it.

Bottom line, this is your issue, not anything Disney has done wrong.

 

[celluloid]

I find it fascinating, if not downright amusing that you feel so personally offended by the fact that Disney didn't provide you with regular progress reports and keep you updated on the evolution of the attraction throughout it's development and construction. They have absolutely no obligation of any kind to do anything like that, and getting all angry because they didn't is your personal choice and not a result of anything Disney did wrong. They shared an early concept of what they were thinking to set the mood, the provided multiple updates along the final stages of construction including showing the new 'to Disney' ride system they were going to use along with the ride vehicles. Seems they just should have said they were building a popcorn stand and left it like that until it opened.You could have made up the whole thing then and been totally disappointed by all of it.

Bottom line, this is your issue, not anything Disney has done wrong.

Now you are just attacking people, with terrible hyperbole.

 

[eliza61nyc]

How many times must it be said that renders aren’t made just at the very beginning of a project? Most projects are past the concept design phase when they are announced. Making accurate renderings has become easier than ever which is how some “concept art” is the actual blueprints.

And yes, Disney has completely done away with projects despite being announced. Main Street Theater, Reflections and EPCOT Festival Center were all announced.

I guess one more time because all im getting us you're mad because it doesn't look like the pretty picture they announced and weren't informed of the change.

OMG, gasp. A big entity, company, state, city announces a ambitious program that never comes to fruition. Oh yes, that certainly is a rarity.

Too each his own

 

[MrPromey]

YOU being unintelligent is not MY problem, don't apologize to me.

Adorable way to dodge my statement and question.

My whole point was that you shouldn't take early concept art as a final product. This goes for everything, even outside of Disney and theme parks in general. A concept is just that, a concept. I don't know of any instance in which the final product was 100% accurate to the concept art. Extremely close to it? Sure, but never 100%.

I'm not so "unintelligent" as to think that the world is going to suddenly catch on to what you think it should mean when Disney decides to release concept art for what they're building to market and hype it... or starting to build... or thinking they might maybe someday build something sort of like, assuming it doesn't get scraped and never spoken of again (cough, Main Street Theater).

As for what I should do, I've been around long enough to not believe anything they say until the soft previews and then, I assume aspects may never be working that way again a year or less after the attraction opens once the reigns are fully in the hands of park Ops when it comes time for fixing something.

Someone's argument for paying up for the Star Cruiser before reviews from actual paying guests was something along the lines of "I know it'll likely never be as good as it is the first few months ever again" and sadly, that's hard to argue with - especially with trends in current management.

Ideally, additional concept art is released over time to show an updated vision. Most recent example would be the new EPCOT art. That shows what the current concept is as of early 2022. This is why they don't like releasing blue-sky concept art because people like you will take it and run with it

I don't know what you think I ever took and ran with regarding concept art. Perhaps you could link to where I said that?

I realize it isn't YOUR problem to explain the world to me but it kind of is your responsibility to defend claims that make you feel you have the right to attack my intellect.

Someone else was saying people shouldn't believe the concept art. I'm saying, if Disney's release of the concept art purely for marketing purposes, they don't update it and that causes confusion with the public, I think the communication problem there is on Disney's side.

I'd also say it's likely not unintentional.

In my opinion, the only place blue-sky concept art should be showing up is in coffee table books well after the project is complete.

Might I humbly suggest, though, that since you think I was the one confused by all of this, that you perhaps spend a little time reflecting on the three fingers pointed back your way?

 

[MrPromey]

Why? Serious question.
A bit off topic. So I was on the building committee for my church, a two year project for a new 20,000 seat building. Yes, we presented the plans at the beginning of the project and tried really hard to keep our congregation involved but over the two year project so much crap occurred. Zoning issues, town hall, noisy seniors, township officials changes, endangered bird nesting etc etc just trying to keep up to date was extensive. After about a year we decided not to give out specifics, now I will say, with a church many of the folks we're volunteering so it is different that a major corporation but I will say it's sometimes impossible to please everyone and there is a lot of sense in not publishing your every change.

Lol I do know this is apples to oranges but having to broadcast every change that comes down the pipeline especially on a long term project, whew can get out of hand.

So for example with the Tron Rollercoaster I'm sure there have been a ton of changes since the original conception announcement, what purpose works announcing every change serve?

For a company like Disney, it's simple enough - if the concept art was done for internal purposes, keep it internal.

If they want to release something to the public, don't share details of something you don't know are actually coming.

"New Guardians Ride: here's the name, here's the basic plot - something you've never experienced before. It'll be amazing. We're adding extra trash cans to the exits - you mission space fans know what we mean wink-wink! Here's a poster!"

Not as exciting as the concept art of something people will never get to experience mind you, but more accurate.

That's hard when you're trying to create reasons for people to pay to attend D23 and then trying to keep public interest up in a park that's a mess for half a decade while you build whatever you'll eventually build but that would be a more honest way, don't you think?

 

[MrPromey]

Okay I'm not sure I understand how we got there but no, someone was lamenting that the general public was not informed of every change in design that occurred between conception and final product and I was pointing out that there is a lot of changes that happened between the two (based on my ONE and only ONE experience) and that the company had absolutely no obligation of letting it's fanbase know of it's decision ...

I think you picked up part way through a conversation and responded to an individual post without the context of what came before it.

 

[lazyboy97o]

I guess one more time because all im getting us you're mad because it doesn't look like the pretty picture they announced and weren't informed of the change.

OMG, gasp. A big entity, company, state, city announces a ambitious program that never comes to fruition. Oh yes, that certainly is a rarity.

Too each his own

Why the need to repeatedly mischaracterize? You’ve already been told several times this is an incorrect exaggeration.