GAC to Become DAS

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Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
I did not say I kept company with anyone. I simply said it is not illegal to not have id on you in WDW. I was supplying legal evidence of what I said instead of opinion. I never said not having idea was good. I simply said people do it on a regular basis with the thinking that bands save you from carrying anything. I have spoke with several parties over the last few weeks who think that ts ok to have the band only and go.
That company part was a joke, but in my defense your post came across as a definite statement that having an ID was not necessary. As we have seen in some states,it is indeed required and in all the rest it is just generally common sense that one needs to have one with them in the event of unanticipated things happening. The society requires today that we spell out not only the reasons why it isn't a law, but also why in makes way more sense to have one then to not. Your post seemed to be leaning entirely to how you don't NEED to legally, so don't worry about it. Legal or not, I say, WORRY ABOUT IT! My opinion is that it is absolutely essential that you carry that stuff with you otherwise you are relying way to heavily on luck and technology. Neither one is a wise direction.
 

BroganMc

Well-Known Member
2) I am a CM who asks to see the name of the person on the card - I also enforce the 6 person rule and the expiration date - but they often ask to speak to a manager who 99% of the time then lets them in. While it's technically a rule that I was trained to enforce, I have been chastised more than once for being "too black and white" regarding this requirement (as well as the 6 person rule and the date. And even the stamp! The wheelchair stamp is supposed to go through the standard line at my attraction, but my management team wants me to let them in the FP if they try to argue with me so that I can "preserve the magic" for them. "Magic" my a**, I'm preserving their entitlement attitude is more like it). Why would the managers suddenly start backing us up now just because it's a photo instead of a name? Granted, this can vary from area to area depending on the management team.

Let me guess. You work at Soarin? That is the only attraction I have ever been routinely hassled about my GAC. I've been turned away 3 times because the CM who wrote up the card at MK City Hall made a mistake of some sort (e.g. wrote beginning date + # days, scratched out dates and rewrote over it, forgot to add the number of people in the party, etc.). These hassles ALWAYS come after I'm admitted through the initial greeter and make it down the long hallway to the FP collection site. Then I must proceed back up the hallway, wait for the elevator by Living with the Land and go out to Guest Relations at the entrance to have a new GAC issued. It got so bad that now I've become about checking the GAC to make sure all fields are filled out correctly.

I had a very physical mobility disability and use my own power wheelchair. It's kinda hard to assume I'm faking any sort of disability. Unfortunately CMs at Soarin' seem prone to be about GACs. IDK, maybe they see a lot of abuse. Still didn't seem like they used common sense a lot.

I was at TSM in DHS yesterday. Asked the CMs there if they'd gone through any sort of training yet on the new system. I was told they couldn't discuss details until the 9th but they hadn't had training. They were aware of the "return time" ideas. My specific question was exactly how is TSM going to handle guests like me who need a wheelchair accessible vehicle so must wait for that. They had no information to give me beyond "Come back on the 9th and find out". I'll be in town until the 11th so I do plan to give it some trials just to see how it goes.

FYI, when I first got a GAC it was because a CM at Buzz Lightyear instructed me to do so. Reason given was that I would have to wait for the one wheelchair vehicle at the exit and this would make my wait more reasonable. Now I'll use the GAC for those few attractions where boarding is either very difficult (i.e. Test Track which involves a hard slide transfer), there are limited wheelchair accessible vehicles I can use (Pooh, TSM, Safari) or the process to obtain a FB and board involves complicated process (Soarin' you must wait for an elevator to even see the Standby lines, there's a transfer and limited parking for wheelchair/scooter vehicles). That list today includes: TSM, Soarin', Test Track, Buzz and Pooh.

Now I guess you can hate me because I've been able to go on TSM twice in a day. Sometimes, like yesterday, I luck out and only have one family in front of me at the wheelchair line. Most times it's at least 3. My biggest concern for the new DAS program is that guests who cannot transfer will end up waiting longer than the Standby Line because they are competing for a limited number of appropriate vehicles.

Take TSM for example. The break for the wheelchair line occurs just before the boarding staircases. Then you directed around a hallway and up a ramp to a side loading area. There you wait behind a fence until one of two HA vehicles cycle thru the ride. Each HA vehicle carries a max of 6 people with one car having a removable seat for wheelchairs. All parties, transfers or not, use these same two vehicles. CMs put in or take out the seat depending on if they have a wheelchair. They're pretty good about getting the supplies ready for wheelcahirs (stop block, gun handle, tie-down, etc.) and pretty fast at pulling out the chair, but it does take an extra couple minutes to ready a vehicle and load a chair. Then they'll try to clear the line as quickly as possible by filling up a car with transfers. You may find yourself being asked to clear a path for a transfer family if they can fill a car and you're waiting for the next slot. (Only gets annoying when the car wasn't taking you because a transfer family boarded first, then a second family comes up behind you to take the remaining spots. That time you'll wonder why you were left behind but the latecomer transfers weren't.)

Sometimes you'll have an easy time of it and wait less than Standby. Other times you'll be waiting 1.5 times as long or more. It really depends on what that wheelchair line is like.

The conversation I had with CMs is this idea of recommending people with any mobility issues use wheelchairs/ECVs for Standby and pushing them into that line. Seems to me more people will be opting to use those devices because they'll be dealing with longer waits. That will result in more transfers in the wheelchair line and make everyone wait longer.

I did learn they have the ability to call up 8 person vehicles for transfers so maybe that'll help. It's not something I've ever seen them do before (not even on a busy NYE), but they did pull up one for thr transfer family before me who had 7 people. Maybe that's new? Since the ride opened I was always told and observed the same two vehicles used for both types of parties.

FWIW when I went on TSM yesterday wait time was posted as 30 mins. (It was a night time EMH.) I started my stopwatch just to see how long it would take me. Time came out to 17:24 before I could board. (There was a small line in FP to get to the wheelchair line.) That includes the time it took for an accessible vehicle to cycle around and CMs to prepare it for me. The new DAS system would theoretically add another 3.5 mins to my wait time. For every party in front of me, add another 8 mins.

TSM is one attraction I think will be quick and easy only to get burned inside the wheelchair queue. I had one memorable occasion where I spent 90 mins trying to make my way through, just me and 5 kids. The CMs were so flustered from the business they forgot to lower my gun arm and let me play the game. If I was going with the new DAS card I'd add another 90 mins before the wheelchair queue. Good thing there's a bar nearby. :)
 

RandomPrincess

Keep Moving Forward
Who is changing appearance significantly during the new, shorter periods for which the cards will be issued?
Lot's of kids, Disney charges for it.


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Lord_Vader

Join me, together we can rule the galaxy.
From a Google search -

The ADA does not contain a list of medical conditions that constitute disabilities. Instead, the ADA has a general definition of disability that each person must meet. Therefore, some people with ADHD will have a disability under the ADA and some will not.

An individual with a disability is defined by the ADA as a person who has a physical or mental impairment that substantially limits one or more major life activities, a person who has a history or record of such an impairment, or a person who is perceived by others as having such an impairment.

My son is considered a 99 percentile ADHD child, and at no time would I ever consider a GAC for him. While it may be considered a disability by the ADA, it is primarily aimed at school programs to force them to accomodate students special needs IMO anyone using ADHD as an excuse to get a GAC is abusing the system.
 

misterID

Well-Known Member
Let me guess. You work at Soarin? That is the only attraction I have ever been routinely hassled about my GAC. I've been turned away 3 times because the CM who wrote up the card at MK City Hall made a mistake of some sort (e.g. wrote beginning date + # days, scratched out dates and rewrote over it, forgot to add the number of people in the party, etc.). These hassles ALWAYS come after I'm admitted through the initial greeter and make it down the long hallway to the FP collection site. Then I must proceed back up the hallway, wait for the elevator by Living with the Land and go out to Guest Relations at the entrance to have a new GAC issued. It got so bad that now I've become about checking the GAC to make sure all fields are filled out correctly.

I had a very physical mobility disability and use my own power wheelchair. It's kinda hard to assume I'm faking any sort of disability. Unfortunately CMs at Soarin' seem prone to be about GACs. IDK, maybe they see a lot of abuse. Still didn't seem like they used common sense a lot.

I was at TSM in DHS yesterday. Asked the CMs there if they'd gone through any sort of training yet on the new system. I was told they couldn't discuss details until the 9th but they hadn't had training. They were aware of the "return time" ideas. My specific question was exactly how is TSM going to handle guests like me who need a wheelchair accessible vehicle so must wait for that. They had no information to give me beyond "Come back on the 9th and find out". I'll be in town until the 11th so I do plan to give it some trials just to see how it goes.

FYI, when I first got a GAC it was because a CM at Buzz Lightyear instructed me to do so. Reason given was that I would have to wait for the one wheelchair vehicle at the exit and this would make my wait more reasonable. Now I'll use the GAC for those few attractions where boarding is either very difficult (i.e. Test Track which involves a hard slide transfer), there are limited wheelchair accessible vehicles I can use (Pooh, TSM, Safari) or the process to obtain a FB and board involves complicated process (Soarin' you must wait for an elevator to even see the Standby lines, there's a transfer and limited parking for wheelchair/scooter vehicles). That list today includes: TSM, Soarin', Test Track, Buzz and Pooh.

Now I guess you can hate me because I've been able to go on TSM twice in a day. Sometimes, like yesterday, I luck out and only have one family in front of me at the wheelchair line. Most times it's at least 3. My biggest concern for the new DAS program is that guests who cannot transfer will end up waiting longer than the Standby Line because they are competing for a limited number of appropriate vehicles.

Take TSM for example. The break for the wheelchair line occurs just before the boarding staircases. Then you directed around a hallway and up a ramp to a side loading area. There you wait behind a fence until one of two HA vehicles cycle thru the ride. Each HA vehicle carries a max of 6 people with one car having a removable seat for wheelchairs. All parties, transfers or not, use these same two vehicles. CMs put in or take out the seat depending on if they have a wheelchair. They're pretty good about getting the supplies ready for wheelcahirs (stop block, gun handle, tie-down, etc.) and pretty fast at pulling out the chair, but it does take an extra couple minutes to ready a vehicle and load a chair. Then they'll try to clear the line as quickly as possible by filling up a car with transfers. You may find yourself being asked to clear a path for a transfer family if they can fill a car and you're waiting for the next slot. (Only gets annoying when the car wasn't taking you because a transfer family boarded first, then a second family comes up behind you to take the remaining spots. That time you'll wonder why you were left behind but the latecomer transfers weren't.)

Sometimes you'll have an easy time of it and wait less than Standby. Other times you'll be waiting 1.5 times as long or more. It really depends on what that wheelchair line is like.

The conversation I had with CMs is this idea of recommending people with any mobility issues use wheelchairs/ECVs for Standby and pushing them into that line. Seems to me more people will be opting to use those devices because they'll be dealing with longer waits. That will result in more transfers in the wheelchair line and make everyone wait longer.

I did learn they have the ability to call up 8 person vehicles for transfers so maybe that'll help. It's not something I've ever seen them do before (not even on a busy NYE), but they did pull up one for thr transfer family before me who had 7 people. Maybe that's new? Since the ride opened I was always told and observed the same two vehicles used for both types of parties.

FWIW when I went on TSM yesterday wait time was posted as 30 mins. (It was a night time EMH.) I started my stopwatch just to see how long it would take me. Time came out to 17:24 before I could board. (There was a small line in FP to get to the wheelchair line.) That includes the time it took for an accessible vehicle to cycle around and CMs to prepare it for me. The new DAS system would theoretically add another 3.5 mins to my wait time. For every party in front of me, add another 8 mins.

TSM is one attraction I think will be quick and easy only to get burned inside the wheelchair queue. I had one memorable occasion where I spent 90 mins trying to make my way through, just me and 5 kids. The CMs were so flustered from the business they forgot to lower my gun arm and let me play the game. If I was going with the new DAS card I'd add another 90 mins before the wheelchair queue. Good thing there's a bar nearby. :)

Yeah, the managers were the only thing that salvaged my day at MK. I had two managers intervene in seperate instances when the CM's were being ... less than helpful, competent or nice and apologized profusely. This was from their observations, I didn't have to ask for them. And I have a feeling that the DAS thing is going to be trial and error and things will evolve to make it easier for guests like yourself and others :)
 

willtravel

Well-Known Member
Yeah, the managers were the only thing that salvaged my day at MK. I had two managers intervene in seperate instances when the CM's were being ... less than helpful, competent or nice and apologized profusely. This was from their observations, I didn't have to ask for them. And I have a feeling that the DAS thing is going to be trial and error and things will evolve to make it easier for guests like yourself and others :)
But this is going to be , I think, like MM+ . There are going to be a few......mad people for this change and confusion. I would not like to be working on the front lines.
 

flynnibus

Premium Member
The conversation I had with CMs is this idea of recommending people with any mobility issues use wheelchairs/ECVs for Standby and pushing them into that line. Seems to me more people will be opting to use those devices because they'll be dealing with longer waits. That will result in more transfers in the wheelchair line and make everyone wait longer.

The system isn't really that different. I don't think the system will ultimately push more people to take ECVs or chairs because
1) getting around in a chair and ECV comes with a lot of headaches.. that alone will discourage some
2) they can still just as easily lie to get a DAS and avoid the hassles of the chair/ECV

These things are the same as they were under the GAC.
 

Pinkerton

Banned
My biggest concern for the new DAS program is that guests who cannot transfer will end up waiting longer than the Standby Line because they are competing for a limited number of appropriate vehicles.

This is exactly what will happen unless the CMs shorten Return Times on those rides where we, who can't transfer, have to wait for a wheelchair accessible vehicle. Let's be honest here and admit that the first passes like these were originally meant for those who were physically disabled and couldn't transfer and it was Disney kowtowing to those with "invisible disabilities" and allowing them into the pass program that led to it's abuse and eventual downfall. By abuse, I not only mean those who flat out lied about being disabled but also those who have "marginal invisible disabilities" who are able to wait in line but chose the GAC route due to it's FOTL access. I am more appalled at this group than the low-life scum who flat out lied because they back-stabbed those who have severe disabilities (both physical and neurological). Because of this betrayal by our own kind, I no longer have sympathy for those with "marginal invisible disabilities" and will judge them accordingly in the future. Shame on you and your greed and for being one of the main reasons why the GAC program was dismantled and for denying those who are truly disabled to lose this privilege.
 

Mark In KY

Well-Known Member
For everyone out there that might have ever been your patient at the primary care level, I thank you for not choosing a field of medicine that requires empathy, patience, and tolerance.
I had to do all those "primary care" rotations in med school. This is what I came away with:
1. 90% of FPs and IMs hate 90% of their patients
2. 5% of FPs and IMs hate 100% of their patients
3. 5% of FPs and IMs drink and pop pills so that they can tolerate their work
4. Peds like their patients and hate all the parents
5. If you could hear the stories that "primary care" docs tell about their patients and hear the mocking of their patients that go on after the office closes your toes would curl
6. Those stories and drug rep lunches are the only good parts of "primary care"
 

Mark In KY

Well-Known Member
If I lived in Kentucky, I would gladly be one of your patients.

This country sent men to the moon, six times. We conquered the wild, untamed west and turned it into peaceful farmland and prosperous cities. We built the Hoover Dam and the Interstate Highway System. And we didn't need a DAS card and a support group and a mommy blog to do it.
'Mur-i-ca is now nothing but a nation of "entitled" whiners. If you are running for office and you don't "promise free stuff" you aren't going to get elected.
 

flynnibus

Premium Member
Because of this betrayal by our own kind, I no longer have sympathy for those with "marginal invisible disabilities" and will judge them accordingly in the future. Shame on you and your greed and for being one of the main reasons why the GAC program was dismantled and for denying those who are truly disabled to lose this privilege.

Don't blame those with disabilities you feel are less than your own. Blame Disney for blanket hand-outs of how they handled accommodations vs addressing an individual's need. Disney was the one who put people in the handicap accessible entrance.. not the guests. It's Disney's choice that lead to people lying to abuse it.
 

Gabe1

Ivory Tower Squabble EST 2011. WINDMILL SURVIVOR
Don't blame those with disabilities you feel are less than your own. Blame Disney for blanket hand-outs of how they handled accommodations vs addressing an individual's need. Disney was the one who put people in the handicap accessible entrance.. not the guests. It's Disney's choice that lead to people lying to abuse it.

I really tend to agree with what you just said. It was years and years ago that Disney started to address issues they were having with plain old fashion wheelchair abuses. Disney then altered physically their attractions trying to right the ship for guests with mobility issues. This was really the first hint of what was going to happen with abuses, guests just became far more creative with their demands for assistance as GAC captured 100's of illnesses and disabilities. Disney indeed imagineered this mess and guests jumped onboard.

Disney should have had the wherewithal to foresee GAC was another Pandora's Box since Disney long ago acknowledged how far guests would push the envelope with the rented wheelchair.
 
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