GAC to Become DAS

[jaklgreen]

So say one has "bladder" issues, and likes to drink lots of fluids... You see were I'm going with this.

OMG you laugh at that but that is seriously my medical issue. I can not get in a line over 20 minutes long due to my frequent urination,i would not make it thru the ride without peeing my pants, but I have never used a GAC and just stick to fastpasses. Do I have a medical condition that should qualify me, maybe. But I never once considered it. Maybe I should?

 

[PolynesianPrincess]

I'm glad to see that Disney is trying to find a system that will accommodate guests with special needs and yet doesn't make it easy for abuse. I think it is clear to everyone that there is SOME level of abuse, though the actual numbers seem in contention here. Regardless of the amount of abuse, Disney obviously feels based on their observations that this change is needed, and so I trust that this new system has been created to address the concerns they have.

As for the tone of the conversation and the rhetoric/accusations/and overly-defensive responses flying around... I think everyone needs to recognize that a VAST majority of us all want the same thing: we want children (and adults) to be able to enjoy the theme parks. For some kids a physical condition makes waiting in line impractical if not impossible; for others it is a mental or emotional one. Those needs are real, and anyone who would deny them, either the physical or the mental/emotional, is ignorant to the situation. Those needs are not always apparent and therefore the rest of us should withhold judgement and trust that there is more than we can see. There is a flip side to this though, guests with disabilities need to stop being so defensive to the point of aggression every time they think they are being judged. This reaction is understandable, but it just serves to escalate the emotions in a conversation or in line and make everyone THAT much more uncomfortable. I'm not suggesting that a parent must stay silent in the face of obvious aggression or mocking, but I've seen parents who per-emptively let EVERYONE know what's going on with their child and complain loudly how people don't understand the situation. I also think partly that has gone on here on these forums, those who have family/friends with disabilities have grown defensive disproportionately to the conversation, and understandably so, but in the end all that does is turn off minds, rather than open them.

Disney has to do it's best to make sure that as many of those passes are legitimate as possible. They cannot do this by requiring proof of disability, for reasons stated loudly and repeatedly on many other forum posts. They are very reluctant to deny based on their own detective work, done by under-trained staff who are liable to get it wrong and thus incur a lawsuit. So what can they do? They can create a system that provides what is needed, but not what would be wanted. They have to create a system that allows those who need to by-pass lines to do so, but not in a manner that gives them an advantage in touring the parks over a regular visitor. Let me be clear on this, by advantage, I mean the ability to ride significantly more attractions than a regular visitor.

Here is what I would love to see answered by those who have fears about the DAS. What are your fears exactly? If you have a child who cannot wait in line, would this system meet those needs? If you have a child who still would not be served by this system, how do they cope with the monorail and waiting there or the airport or car ride, or any of the other dozens of places where waiting is a necessity. I ask this, not out of trying to trap or condemn, but rather to understand the strategies that work in those situations and then extrapolate from there how they would work in the parks.

I agree that Disney is trying their best to accomodate everyone. My personal feeling on this is that if they don't do something now to stop the abuse to the system and continue doing it the same way they have been, more and more people are going to find ways to cheat the system. No one wants their child who can't handle long waits to have to wait in line. This is why the FP line works for them. shorter line, shorter wait time. But the more people continue to abuse this system, the longer the FP lines will get until evetually they will be as long as the stand by lines. Then what? At that point there will be no place to let those who can't wait in long lines onto the ride. Something has to be done and I feel this is a very fair way to do things. Is it perfect? No. Will it be difficult for some to adjust to? Yes. Unfortunately for some, this solution doesn't work for them. Disney can't please everyone, as hard as they try. But Disney will tweak it and mess with this new DAS system until it is the best solution that it can be.

 

[minninedaisy74]

The fact that someone is suggesting that agreeing with this new policy means a you are hating on disabled children is so silly! How is a disabled child ,as unfortunate as their situation may be anymore entitled to a Disney vacation then the poor kid born to a crack head mother who will more then likely never have a normal life much less make it to Disney? So this new plan does not give immediate access to the rides how is that the end of the world? They still don't have to wait in line.

 

[Tom Morrow]

From the previous GAC card thread, Disney did monitor GACs coming through the Fastpass lines at many attractions on property. I don't know the exact averages, but numbers I saw easily were about 125 per hour at some high demand attractions on a average attendance day. I'm willing to bet money that it is hovering close to 10% of riders got in with a GAC that is 1 in 10 riders!! 6 of which used regular Fastpass, and the remaining 3 stood in the regular standby line. Again that is an average and a guess, some attraction may see more and some may see less.

Some high demand/high capacity attractions were reporting as high as 1 out of every 6 riders during peak times!

At WDW. Stop assuming the problem is worse in DLR.

 

[Weather_Lady]

I agree that Disney is trying their best to accomodate everyone. My personal feeling on this is that if they don't do something now to stop the abuse to the system and continue doing it the same way they have been, more and more people are going to find ways to cheat the system. No one wants their child who can't handle long waits to have to wait in line. This is why the FP line works for them. shorter line, shorter wait time. But the more people continue to abuse this system, the longer the FP lines will get until evetually they will be as long as the stand by lines. Then what? At that point there will be no place to let those who can't wait in long lines onto the ride. Something has to be done and I feel this is a very fair way to do things. Is it perfect? No. Will it be difficult for some to adjust to? Yes. Unfortunately for some, this solution doesn't work for them. Disney can't please everyone, as hard as they try. But Disney will tweak it and mess with this new DAS system until it is the best solution that it can be.

Agreed -- in the end, minimizing cheating is going to make it easier for everyone -- the disabled AND the non-disabled -- to find shorter standby lines.

Of course the system is going to be imperfect for some, and I do sympathize with those who have mobility issues AND can't wait in a standby line, who will have to go back and forth to a kiosk. Clearly this is going to pose a greater hardship to them than to anyone else, and will be less helpful to them than the old system was. However, short of requiring proof of disability from persons wanting a GAC or its equivalent, I can't think of a better or more reasonable way than the DAS system for WDW to accommodate disabled guests and discourage "cheaters" at the same time.

 

[jaklgreen]

The fact that someone is suggesting that agreeing with this new policy means a you are hating on disabled children is so silly! How is a disabled child ,as unfortunate as their situation may be anymore entitled to a Disney vacation then the poor kid born to a crack head mother who will more then likely never have a normal life much less make it to Disney? So this new plan does not give immediate access to the rides how is that the end of the world? They still don't have to wait in line.

True, and at least they get to go to WDW. I never went as a child, not due to any issues other then my dad was a cheap SOB that liked his money more then his children. Most people have some kind of issue in their lives. Our job is to be productive members of society and not a drain. Do what you can in life, take care of you and yours and be a good person. And sometimes that means that life will be a struggle, that is life.

 

[flynnibus]

Because for some families the GAC allowed them to tour the park with little delay, and for some with physical and mental health issues who can only stand 3-4 hours out at a time, the GAC allowed them to do that. The new system will see some families leaving the park after the same time, but having done a lot less.

Do what everyone else does.... Book the length of your vacation based on your intended pace.

Should Disney give passes to those who like to explore the walkways... Or who just move slower .... So they can get the same number of rides in as those who prefer to race from attraction to attraction?

The idea that I need a pass so I can keep up the same quota of attractions per day is extremely flawed and unreasonable.

Someone's pace and park stamina are things EVERYONE has to account for... Themselves.

 

[fosse76]

We never made them stop the ride, we made it work. When he couldn't make the transfer from the chair to the ride, we didn't go on it. Disappointing sure, but he knew his limitations and also knew that the world wasn't built to strictly accommodate him and his disability.

Disney's responsibility is to provide "reasonable" access to its attractions, not "convenient" access. It appears to me that many of the GAC supporters in this thread don't really need a GAC because conditions already exist for them to physically access many of the attractions. And the ADA is all about physical access to services. It's just that "physical" access doesn't always mean "wheelchair accessible." This new system seems to understand that, but I agree with Flynn that it is still open to abuse, but is a much better solution than GAC. And let's face it, everything is open to abuse. There is just no fool-proof system. The question is whether or not CMs will enforce many of the policies (limit to the 6 on the pass, enforce the person with the DAS ride, etc.). From the stories I heard, and having worked in customer service, if a guest complains, the CM will get in trouble, regardless of the veracity of the complaint.

But I really want to be a fly on the wall in City Hall the day this rolls out!

 

[JLipnick]

The fact that someone is suggesting that agreeing with this new policy means a you are hating on disabled children is so silly! How is a disabled child ,as unfortunate as their situation may be anymore entitled to a Disney vacation then the poor kid born to a crack head mother who will more then likely never have a normal life much less make it to Disney? So this new plan does not give immediate access to the rides how is that the end of the world? They still don't have to wait in line.

I never said the new policy was hating on my son. it is the responses from some in this thread. I am all for fixing the system. the abuse only hurts people like my son. i welcome changes and we will adapt. I only wish the general response to situations like this would change and not see this type of accommodation as an entitlement. calling it an entitlement only shows that people that have never dealt with a person (especially a child) with a disability really don't understand what it is like. my son should be entitled to enjoy life like any other 5 year old, but he can't. so in a way, he is lacking that entitlement that other children who are not disabled are allowed to enjoy.

 

[RichKermitFan]

TO AEfx and anyone else arguing against DAS, I'm trying to figure out exactly what the argument is? Guest wity disabilities are still given the opportunity to use an accessible line. Guests with disabilities are still given the opportunity to do each and every attraction that is accessible without having to wait in the "dreaded stand-by line". They
are even given an opportunity to go take
advantage of other experiences while
basically a spot in line is held for them. The
only exception being guests from make-a-wish and give kids the world who will still get immediate front of the line access. So basically is the argument that a guest with disabilities time in the park is more valuable than every other guest that paid admission? Im just trying to figure it out. I thought equality is what we were striving for to begin with in regards to ADA laws?

 

[flynnibus]

Agreed. My son falls into this category. He is 5 and walks in a walker. Having to constantly go to a kiosk in between rides will tire him out. We might have to use his wheelchair stroller but then disney may tell us we have to put him in his stroller and wait in the normal lines. our stroller is not a means of normal transportation for him, but more of somewhere for him to sit when he gets too tired (he has low muscle tone, so his muscles tire very quickly) and we will never tell him he has to stop walking if he wants to walk nor will we ever let anyone else tell him he can't walk. Our next trip is next June, so hopefully some kinks will get worked out before then. But this very well could alter our ability to do disney. I just hate how some people think that this type of treatment is giving the disabled an edge up on every one else. why not give a child who can't run and play like all of his friends an leg up every now and then?

It's not clear if your child will have to be present at the kiosk. There is no real reason to require it.... Ownership is checked when redeemed.

 

[jaklgreen]

Do what everyone else does.... Book the length of your vacation based on your intended pace.

Should Disney give passes to those who like to explore the walkways... Or who just move slower .... So they can get the same number of rides in as those who prefer to race from attraction to attraction?

The idea that I need a pass so I can keep up the same quota of attractions per day is extremely flawed and unreasonable.

Someone's pace and park stamina are things EVERYONE has to account for... Themselves.

This is so true. When our kids were smaller we went on less rides and spend more "down" time at the pool, etc. When the kids got older and wanted to do more rides we did that. Now when I go solo, I walk around world showcase most days and hardly ride on anything. Your needs change at different times of your life. You can not quantify a vacation in terms of how many rides you went on. A vacation is supposed to be a respite from every day life. If anyone feels that they did not have a good vacation because they only got to go on a ride 6 times in a day instead of 10 then it is time to reevaluate what vacations mean to you.

 

[Lucky]

as a parent of a disabled child, I couldn't agree more. I have had someone once tell me i was lucky to not have to wait in line. Excuse me? Am I lucky to have my son not be able to walk? Is my son lucky to not be able to walk but be able to get onto rides a littler quicker than others? If he were truly lucky, he would be able to walk like other kids.

This was posted by a CM on another site:

The part that really makes me extremely angry/disgusted are those rare guests who see a Make A Wish family go to the front of a character meet/greet line, and yell out loud, “I wish my kid was dying so I could get to the front of every line!” Again, this is a rarity, but does happen.

 

[jaklgreen]

TO AEfx and anyone else arguing against DAS, I'm trying to figure out exactly what the argument is? Guest wity disabilities are still given the opportunity to use an accessible line. Guests with disabilities are still given the opportunity to do each and every attraction that is accessible without having to wait in the "dreaded stand-by line". They
are even given an opportunity to go take
advantage of other experiences while
basically a spot in line is held for them. The
only exception being guests from make-a-wish and give kids the world who will still get immediate front of the line access. So basically is the argument that a guest with disabilities time in the park is more valuable than every other guest that paid admission? Im just trying to figure it out. I thought equality is what we were striving for to begin with in regards to ADA laws?

To you and I(and others) this is very reasonable. The issue is some have said that since they have to struggle in life with a disability then why shouldn't they get and "extra advantage" at WDW. It is this type of thinking that is more the issue. Since the DAS takes away your front of the line pass, some are angry that they do not get the exta advantage because they deserve it. This is just what I have read from the posts here.

 

[ddrongowski]

OMG you laugh at that but that is seriously my medical issue. I can not get in a line over 20 minutes long due to my frequent urination,i would not make it thru the ride without peeing my pants, but I have never used a GAC and just stick to fastpasses. Do I have a medical condition that should qualify me, maybe. But I never once considered it. Maybe I should?

I wasn't actually laughing at it, because I um sometimes have this issue, along with other "um a" problems. But like you I am not going to use a GAC or DAS as I already know I have to work around it. Kind of like if someone is diabetic, they need to not be in a WDW or lines without having glucose tabs, oj, etc... to handle a low sugar issue. But I guess that could get a GAC also as it can be life threatening. Still not going to use GAC/DAS though.

 

[Goofyernmost]

I never said the new policy was hating on my son. it is the responses from some in this thread. I am all for fixing the system. the abuse only hurts people like my son. i welcome changes and we will adapt. I only wish the general response to situations like this would change and not see this type of accommodation as an entitlement. calling it an entitlement only shows that people that have never dealt with a person (especially a child) with a disability really don't understand what it is like. my son should be entitled to enjoy life like any other 5 year old, but he can't. so in a way, he is lacking that entitlement that other children who are not disabled are allowed to enjoy.

Everyone needs to separate their thoughts on the matter. NO ONE, I repeat, NO ONE has said that this program was an entitlement program in the sense that you are taking it. It was designed for people with legitimate problems and they are entitled to use them. The negative entitlement is directed at those that do not need it physically, but feel the since no one is forcing them to prove need, they might as well take advantage of it. In that process they deprive (or at least hold up) people that do have a need and are disrupting the flow of the rest. It would take a heartless individual to feel that people with disabilities shouldn't be helped achieve access to this stuff.

To the one screaming that their daughter and/or son isn't able to walk and now we want them to not enjoy themselves, please get past yourselves long enough to realize that part of the reason for this change is to enhance your daughters or sons enjoyment of the experience. No one will deny you access that is any different than you are used to, but, you might have to adjust your experience to be more in line with what people without disabilities are dealing with. How is that unfair? Anyway, it is obvious that those with real problems are deciding that this concern is directed at them. Absolutely untrue. It is directed at those that are dishonestly or with a huge degree of exaggeration using a service that was designed to help those that were truly needed. If it's not as fluid now as it was, blame them not the rest of us. I want your son or daughter to have a great time...I don't want the cheats to take advantage of your daughters disadvantage.

 

[jaklgreen]

I wasn't actually laughing at it, because I um sometimes have this issue, along with other "um a" problems. But like you I am not going to use a GAC or DAS as I already know I have to work around it. Kind of like if someone is diabetic, they need to not be in a WDW or lines without having glucose tabs, oj, etc... to handle a low sugar issue. But I guess that could get a GAC also as it can be life threatening. Still not going to use GAC/DAS though.

It is actually horrible at times(not as bad as not walking of course) but having to plan your life around a bathroom affects the quality of life in its own way. Which I know you know. So if anyone sees me running toward a bathroom, make way. LOL

 

[arko]

I disagree with your last statement. Having to wait the length of the stand-by line will discourage some. Having to get a photo taken for your ID will discourage others. Limiting its usage and eliminating transfer ability will discourage others still. It might not prevent abuse, but I do think it will reduce it.

Will it reduce the overall effect of more people in FP lines, sure it will, just like having only 3 FP's a day will. But give it a little time, because honestly what is taking someone's picture going to do when a family is doing rides together, dad or mom will just nominate one kid, like they do now. GAC abuse didn't start out bad, it got bad because word got around, and then the internet happened.

Once people are limited to the 3 FP a day scheme, it won't take long for the more enterprising abusers to realize this system gives them more than other guests. The fact that it is limited, doesn't change that. And based on a lot of peoples comments any kind of more is too much. Once word spreads on how best to get a DAS, and that Disney taking your picture has no legal ramifications, since they still can't ask for any proof, nothing has really changed.

 

[ddrongowski]

It is actually horrible at times(not as bad as not walking of course) but having to plan your life around a bathroom affects the quality of life in its own way. Which I know you know. So if anyone sees me running toward a bathroom, make way. LOL

THAT MADE ME LAUGH SO MUCH I HAVE TEARS IN MY EYES!!!!! Cause I know the feeling!!!!!

 

[minninedaisy74]

S

I never said the new policy was hating on my son. it is the responses from some in this thread. I am all for fixing the system. the abuse only hurts people like my son. i welcome changes and we will adapt. I only wish the general response to situations like this would change and not see this type of accommodation as an entitlement. calling it an entitlement only shows that people that have never dealt with a person (especially a child) with a disability really don't understand what it is like. my son should be entitled to enjoy life like any other 5 year old, but he can't. so in a way, he is lacking that entitlement that other children who are not disabled are allowed to enjoy.

So not having immediate access to a ride will ruin the the entire vacation? I am not sure how you can even justify that line of thinking. Please explain to me how this new way of doing things will be a disaster because I am really having a hard time understanding. IMOP the only guest who deserve any special treatment or immediate access to any ride or show are the Make A Wish families. Disney is obviously following the law so I am not sure why people expect so much more from them.