Having experienced Disney Springs, I can absolutely agree with this. There is clearly room for improvement/enhancement as was rumored at one time.
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Fourth Disneyland Hotel Officially Cancelled
- Thread starter Stevek
- Start date
Animaniac93-98
Well-Known Member
The Landing area (where the Edison is) is much nicer. If DTD looked like that, it would be great, even if none of the shops really interest me.
I guess DTD at DLR is better than DLP's Village right now, but that's not saying much. At least Disney Village still has a movie theatre, Rainforest and the Buffalo Bill Show (now minus buffalos).
TP2000
Well-Known Member
The neighbor lady said the Garden Grove hotel concept was not a bluff, it's something TDA is genuinely looking into and the city of Garden Grove is more than willing to play along and make life cozy for Disney.
The thing with a Garden Grove hotel however is that two short years ago TDA and Burbank had no plans to be building in Garden Grove, or to even imagine they'd be in the current political climate they are in (Great shape macro-economically with much lower federal taxes that funded a $1,000 bonus to all employees, but horrible shape locally with openly hostile Socialist politicians funded by unions and Measure L on the ballot).
It's taking TDA a while to really see if Garden Grove pencils out, and then how they handle that from a branding and design perspective. It's not a quick process they can turn around in 60 days, but it's a process that is actively happening now in the halls of TDA and Burbank.
Did I also mention how wonderful that cheesecake she brought over was?
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Animaniac93-98
Well-Known Member
The whole "resort" aspect of the Disneyland Resort needs improvement. You can tell back in the 90s they wanted it to be like WDW, but that sense of isolation was never going to happen with the rest of tourist trap Anaheim literally across the street from the east and south sides.
They need to create a more pleasant sense of arrival and setting when you're in DTD or walking from PPH or DLH. The only really immersive resort experience you have right now is at GCH.
They need to create a more pleasant sense of arrival and setting when you're in DTD or walking from PPH or DLH. The only really immersive resort experience you have right now is at GCH.
Disney Irish
Premium Member
I see a mini resort with a couple attractions in GG's future.... Hurry TDA get a concept going so it'll be ready to announce at D23 in the summer.
mickEblu
Well-Known Member
Lol yes you did mention it and this reminds me that my neighbors are non WDI working bums that never give me cheesecake.
Darkbeer1
Well-Known Member
TP2000 did an excellent job answering Mick's question, but let me add more to the political angle.
Anything not currently in construction at the parks (aka Galaxy Edge and Super Hero Land) is on hold until the November election happens and any additional fallout (think lawsuits due to the ALWI) are settled.
Then, based on the results, the execs will order financials and see what works.
Garden Grove officials doesn't want to make a move until the elections are over also. They want to see what they need to offer based on what the new Anaheim city council looks like.
So while we won't see a Hotel at DtD for a few years, what happens there, in Garden Grove and with the Eastern Gateway, and in conjunction, more DCA expansion all depends on what we will be discussing 4 Wednesdays from now.
Elections and Voting Does Matter!
EPCOTCenterLover
Well-Known Member
DCA expansion beyond Marvel? I hope its incredible- ummm, I mean, brings some charm back to the park circa 2013.!
nevol
Well-Known Member
Agreed. They saw the shortcomings of the property size and laid out the resort without the ambitions of Westcot's plan and prior to much of the economic development and placemaking we see in urban centers today. People don't mind, even desire, urban destination resorts. Disneyland resort, however, is like a Simon outlet mall in the midwest surrounded by a few hotels and surface level parking. The resort has a really terrible sense of arrival (no welcome signage as you enter by car), cheap infrastructure, and a layout that just bleeds out energy and totally lacks Disney magic. While the best end of downtown disney is the east end, I am frustrated that the entire approach to the parks is busy and not providing a strong enough palette cleanser like the fantasia gardens in paris, or even the pedestrian boulevards seen in hong kong disneyland. This was especially bad when DCA was hardly a theme park at all, and the lines between the resort and DCA were so blurred that it didn't make sense to pay to go into DCA when downtown disney was nicer and free. God forbid we had a nice micktorian hotel as a palette cleanser or some un-programmed gardens and fountains on the resort grounds somewhere for guests to relax in, since the parks are so overcrowded that space can no longer be dedicated to open land.
They also really need to make sense of the pedestrian flow of traffic to make the DTD/resort experience feel like an interiorized focused location with energy, not one that bleeds energy in every direction. Have resorts and landscaped resort grounds face inward on the west end toward the parks, with paths that expand from serving the population size of the hotels into the wider boulevards of downtown disney as traffics merge and approach the parks. The placement of every structure on the west end is painfully awkward and that's why it never worked.
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Ismael Flores
Well-Known Member
That would be an interesting idea, would kind of remind me of Mickey Avenue in Shanghai Disney. I'm sure that the reaosn they don't is because they would best enjoy the revenue of the lease minus the need to have more Castmembers added to the payroll
Californian Elitist
Well-Known Member
Cancel the rest of Downtown Disney.
Rich T
Well-Known Member
Agreed.
So.... How's *that* approach been working out for them so far?
Old Mouseketeer
Well-Known Member
Honestly, I'm not sure the four-star hotel idea was really a good fit for Disney (plus I thought it was a silly design). I agree that Anaheim needs upscale properties to support the hotel business and I think the tax rebate was a smart move. Upon reflection, I have mixed feelings about the ALWI. I absolutely see the value it added to the combined union effort to boost worker wages in Anaheim. The Master Services negotiation was definitely helped by the Survey, rallies, and the ALWI. I believe these got Disney's attention and brought them to the table with a more substantial offer.
OTOH, I admit I'm not comfortable with the "ex post facto" feel to the ALWI. Someone made the point that it's not fair to impose this expense on an agreement between a developer and the city after the fact. While I absolutely agree that companies that benefit from tax breaks should treat their employees well, I'm also in favor of fairness.
I believe Disney has gotten their way too much of the time over the past 20+years. I believe it's ultimately in the company's interest to be a better corporate citizen, and in the city's to try to partner responsibly with Disney and other businesses going forward. Reasonable people can differ about where these lines should be drawn, but I think there is room to agree when there are mutually positive outcomes. Disney workers just used the tools available to them in a capitalist democracy to campaign and bargain for more equitable pay. IMHO, Disney had neglected to consider the downside of depressing wages for so long, including their brand reputation.
I don't want a pure socialist government in Anaheim or anywhere in the US. But I do support continuing the balance inherent in a modern western-style social democracy and ending the massive corporate welfare that is the exact opposite of the fabled "free market". I was raised that capitalism is a good servant and a poor master.
After the dust settles from this election, Disney and the city will have the opportunity for a reset. I don't want a "socialist" city council, but neither do I want to return to the rubber-stamp pro-Disney years. We'll see how this shakes out.
Now if Disney will just please come up with something resembling a cohesive Master Plan for the DL Resort instead of shooting from the hip at every opportunity. And while I'm at it, I want a rainbow unicorn pony and the Peoplemover brought back. Heh.
OTOH, I admit I'm not comfortable with the "ex post facto" feel to the ALWI. Someone made the point that it's not fair to impose this expense on an agreement between a developer and the city after the fact. While I absolutely agree that companies that benefit from tax breaks should treat their employees well, I'm also in favor of fairness.
I believe Disney has gotten their way too much of the time over the past 20+years. I believe it's ultimately in the company's interest to be a better corporate citizen, and in the city's to try to partner responsibly with Disney and other businesses going forward. Reasonable people can differ about where these lines should be drawn, but I think there is room to agree when there are mutually positive outcomes. Disney workers just used the tools available to them in a capitalist democracy to campaign and bargain for more equitable pay. IMHO, Disney had neglected to consider the downside of depressing wages for so long, including their brand reputation.
I don't want a pure socialist government in Anaheim or anywhere in the US. But I do support continuing the balance inherent in a modern western-style social democracy and ending the massive corporate welfare that is the exact opposite of the fabled "free market". I was raised that capitalism is a good servant and a poor master.
After the dust settles from this election, Disney and the city will have the opportunity for a reset. I don't want a "socialist" city council, but neither do I want to return to the rubber-stamp pro-Disney years. We'll see how this shakes out.
Now if Disney will just please come up with something resembling a cohesive Master Plan for the DL Resort instead of shooting from the hip at every opportunity. And while I'm at it, I want a rainbow unicorn pony and the Peoplemover brought back. Heh.
D
Deleted member 107043
As a California resident and DLR tourist the cancellation of this hotel is disappointing, and I can't see myself spending top dollar to stay at an overpriced Disney hotel in the town next door a mile or two from the main Resort.
Every day the Asia parks look better and better to me.
Every day the Asia parks look better and better to me.
TROR
Well-Known Member
The answer is to get rid of the rubber stamps
Darkbeer1
Well-Known Member
How far are the WDW Hotels compared to the Parks?
D
Deleted member 107043
They are inside the resort though. I have no interest in staying at the Garden Grove version of the Caribbean Beach Resort.
Old Mouseketeer
Well-Known Member
Fair question on the surface. But taking a Disney shuttle up an overcrowded Harbor Blvd. through 8-10 traffic signals is significantly different than taking a Disney shuttle through vast green areas past Disney-designed resorts on private roads that, for the most part, meet the traffic demand with overpasses at several major intersections.
Old Mouseketeer
Well-Known Member
Even though it will undoubtedly be bigger, more Walt-like, and the rendering has a barker bird? /snark