First Mexico and Now Norway? Proof America is Getting Dumber?

[THEMEPARKPIONEER]

Just think of it as this... There meeting half way, not all kids and even adults are going to enjoy Epcot. So while the Parents and who ever else is there to enjoy Epcot for Epcot the ones who arrant so into it can have something to enjoy as well. I know in some cases back in the day friends of mine on their family trips would always say they didn't go to Epcot but their parents did, some will say they used to visit Epcot before their kids were born or when they got older finally got to see the place or revisit. Even when I was little we would spend a half day at Epcot.

Ill admit... back in the 90's we all would park at Epcot, take the Monorail to the Magic Kingdom start out day there and all meet up in Epcot in the late afternoon. I was older by the time I actually wanted to spend a whole day at Epcot and enjoy every minute of it. Expansion would be nice instead of transforming existing rides. It only makes it easier for those who want to enjoy Epcot without getting getting cut short of the experience do to others who arrant so into it. And to make things more positive these attractions are in their own consolidated area. You wont actually know theres a Disney attraction within these pavilions unless you set foot in the Que.. I often never notice the Circle of Life, Turtle Talk or the Ride, Grand Fiesta so really the pavilions are still cultural but there are consolidated areas for those who just want the Disney Magic experience. That said everyone is happy.

 

[prfctlyximprct]

Still much cheaper to fly to Orlando and visit Disney than actually go to a top 10 city in the world. World travel is actually very expensive, especially flying there. If you want to eat well or have any fun, prepare to pay much more than Disney...at least that's my experience in Tokyo, Cayman Islands, Zurich, or even right here in NYC.

My best friend just did a Europe trip for eighteen days through contiki travel with food and transportation included for five grand. 18 days at disney would be more expensive than that. She went to Rome, Paris, London, etc..


Personally I'd take Epcot.

 

[FettFan]

As Disney turns what was once a celebration of culture into a second Magic Kingdom, is the movement toward promoting the newest shiny toy proof Americans are getting dumber?

Is it actually our fault Disney is listening to the masses and giving the millions of Frozen fans exactly what they want?

A silly fringe ride with a name you can't pronounce, about a country no one has been to, emphasizes trolls, and herds you in to an outdated movie on Norway? Frozen it is!

The same thing happened to a once great Spaceship Earth (still great, but watered down) and now the Sea's with Nemo. Also, we lost the original Universe of Energy, the closure of Horizons and World of Motion, and just an overall sense it's becoming more about what's popular.

I guess that makes money, but it's a more watered down product. I think guests liked the calm, tranquil nature of older rides that didn't always have a recognizable character pushed in your face, particularly at EPCOT.

I think we have a "dumber" WDW today, do you?

Ever hear the story of the three blind men who encounter an elephant?
One blind man grabs the trunk and says "Oh this is a snake like creature!", one blind man grabs the butt and says "No, you fool, it's NOT a snake! It's clearly a rhinoceros!", and the third grabs the elephant by the leg and says "HA! You're both wrong! This is a TREE!"

Congratulations, buddy, you're our resident trunk-holder. You're grabbing on to your own perception and claiming it's true. Using the same logic, I could just as easily say that the current state of Epcot is actually because American's are getting SMARTER. Because we can experience outside cultures with a few clicks of a mouse and communicate via Skype/Instant Messenger with anyone in any part of the world, combined with how quickly we can travel almost anywhere....the Digital Revolution has rendered World Showcase almost obsolete.

There is a laundry list of reasons Epcot is evolving the way it is:

1. The aforementioned rise of the Digital Age.

2. Pavilions need funding; without funding, they die. Disney is turning to their own IP's in order to bridge a funding gap left behind when investors decide to leave. Case in point: The Soarin' Food Court Pavilion (formerly known as "The Land"). Nestle dropped sponsorship in 2009, and if not for Disney's Soarin' and the Food Court, this pavilion would be suffering the same fate as "Cranium Convention Center".

3. Theme park visitors want MORE. 'World of Motion' and 'Horizons' were really nifty, really creative experiences....for the 1980s. However, the 90s were a game changer for Disney Parks, 1994 specifically. Two huge additions came to the World with the Tower of Terror at Disney-MGM and the ExtraTerrorestrial Alien Encounter at the Magic Kingdom.
Suddenly, boarding a slow-moving omnimover to watch what amounted to an animated wax museum and history presentation wasn't exactly "the big thing" anymore. 'World of Motion''s show building was gutted and transformed into Test Track, and poor 'Horizons' was completely demolished to make way for Mission: Space.





And oh my god I think I just defended Frozen's existence in Epcot. Shoot me.

I still think Frozen could have been used sparingly and smartly for a Maelstrom refurb (perhaps Olaf the Snowman takes a brief tour of modern Norway or something?), but I honestly fear we are going to get "Let It Go: The Ride", especially after they announced the "Tangled Bathrooms Expansion" for the pavilion.
I'm also fairly certain that alcohol won't be served at Norway anymore, what with the influx of "little snowflakes".

They wanted to build Arandelle? Fine. But they should have just demo'd Tomorrowland Speedway and built it there. T.S. was already a truncated version of DL's Autopia....and was cut down even more back in '89 to make way for Mickey's Birthdayland.

 

[unkadug]

The whole premise of this thread revolves around WDW receiving nothing but American Tourists.

 

[FettFan]

After having spent my life surrounded by mouth breathers and incoherent baboons, I can't imagine a metric that would determine that all of you were even dumber at some arbitrarily determined earlier time point.

*raises hand* How about the outcomes of every US Presidential election since 1964?

 

[Chef Mickey]

My best friend just did a Europe trip for eighteen days through contiki travel with food and transportation included for five grand. 18 days at disney would be more expensive than that. She went to Rome, Paris, London, etc..


Personally I'd take Epcot.

No offense to her, but that's just one of those tour trips and undoubtedly a low end experience. You can do anything on the cheap...even Disney. Staff of property, drive in, eat quick service, and don't fly. I can get to Europe for $800 and take public transport and stay in hositles for cheap. I'm just saying it costs a lot more than Disney if you go overseas and have a high end experience.

Apples to apples, Disney is cheap because your entertainment is so cheap. Essentially $350 for a week at the parks. I spent $350 in one day in the Caymans for a day bed and lunch by the ocean.

 

[mousehockey37]

I think we have a "dumber" WDW today, do you?

To paraphrase a line from what's becoming society today (Idiocracy): "Welcome to Didney Wurl, I love you!"

Today's Disney isn't the Disney it was. With the rapid advancement of technology, what was once the future in EPCOT's FutureWorld became today's society. I think Disney needs to do a little work, go get some business partners and revitalize and show us what our "new" future is going to look like. With all these neat gadgets and gizmos that are coming out, with tv's that are immersing us to the point that "we're almost there", there's got to be some company out there that is willing to push the limits and give us (for lack of better terminology) the Disney version of the Jetsons world in FutureWorld.

I, for one, am sick of Frozen. I haven't seen the movie and I don't want to. When I was down to WDW in Sept. last year, they were still going with the "Frozen Summer of Fun" and DHS looked like a trash heap with all the Olaf cutouts on a stick laying ALL OVER THE PLACE!!!

Disney is doing what business calls for today. Sell, sell, sell. Create something, promote the snot out of it and sell as much junk as you can in the process then make the sequel and rinse, lather, repeat. Granted Disney doesn't encompass just the parks, but speaking of just them, the company needs to start doing like other businesses are doing and listen to their customers. For those that have shopped and had problems with Amazon.com, you know that they have a no-hassle replacement process and if they can't get a replacement, they may/will refund you (depending on your situation). Now Disney can't take every last little thing said and make drastic changes, but I'd love to see those survey takers asking more intricate questions or being open to take down feedback from the people they survey. It's one thing to gather demographic info, it's another to get the customers opinions as they are standing in the park, right in the middle of their vacation.

 

[HouCuseChickie]

My best friend just did a Europe trip for eighteen days through contiki travel with food and transportation included for five grand. 18 days at disney would be more expensive than that. She went to Rome, Paris, London, etc..


Personally I'd take Epcot.

Not going to get into the Europe vs. Epcot debate (since I think there are major strengths of visiting both Epcot and experiencing the real things), but for the heck of it...I did a calculation based on a European tour we took. We nixed Contiki because the lodging and dining wasn't our thing, but we did consider both Trafalgar and Cosmos when we went to Europe and ultimately went with Trafalgar. The lodging classes, dining and excursions through Trafalgar would be on par with staying deluxe, eating signature, and doing some special extra things at WDW. Based on inflation, our 18 day tour would cost about $8,500 per person at today's prices.

So...$8,500/18= $472.22 per person per day for our tour in Europe, including air, dining, excursions, etc. We went to England, France, Belgium, Germany, Austria, Switzerland and Italy.

Now let's look at this in terms of WDW trips. Now I don't know what you've spent on your WDW trips, so I'm going to have to use my budget for the example. My last WDW trip was just 2 adults, 6 days, and the cost of the trip was about $4,500 total. That includes staying at the Poly, airfare, 9 or 10 TS meals- including 5 signatures, and a big cake. So, that's about $375 per person per day.

So, when comparing deluxe Europe to deluxe WDW...WDW is about $100 cheaper per person per day and would equate to an $1,800 per person savings if we spent 18 days at WDW instead.

 

[George Lucas on a Bench]

Truthfully, the original Mexico ride was kinda dubious once you passed by the awesome Blue Bayou-esque scene at the beginning. Was putting a bunch of incredible quality flat-screen TVs playing Donald Duck cartoons a good solution? Not at all.

 

[prfctlyximprct]

Not going to get into the Europe vs. Epcot debate (since I think there are major strengths of visiting both Epcot and experiencing the real things), but for the heck of it...I did a calculation based on a European tour we took. We nixed Contiki because the lodging and dining wasn't our thing, but we did consider both Trafalgar and Cosmos when we went to Europe and ultimately went with Trafalgar. The lodging classes, dining and excursions through Trafalgar would be on par with staying deluxe, eating signature, and doing some special extra things at WDW. Based on inflation, our 18 day tour would cost about $8,500 per person at today's prices.

So...$8,500/18= $472.22 per person per day for our tour in Europe, including air, dining, excursions, etc. We went to England, France, Belgium, Germany, Austria, Switzerland and Italy.

Now let's look at this in terms of WDW trips. Now I don't know what you've spent on your WDW trips, so I'm going to have to use my budget for the example. My last WDW trip was just 2 adults, 6 days, and the cost of the trip was about $4,500 total. That includes staying at the Poly, airfare, 9 or 10 TS meals- including 5 signatures, and a big cake. So, that's about $375 per person per day.

So, when comparing deluxe Europe to deluxe WDW...WDW is about $100 cheaper per person per day and would equate to an $1,800 per person savings if we spent 18 days at WDW instead.

I do applaud you for doing all that!! I guess when it boils down to it, I'd rather save 1800 and go to disney!

 

[HouCuseChickie]

I do applaud you for doing all that!! I guess when it boils down to it, I'd rather save 1800 and go to disney!

Sorry...it just really piqued my curiosity since I was trying to remember how much longer and how much more we had to save to get to Europe. That being said, if it's ever in the budget to do both, I highly recommend it Plus, while I chose a day at the Louvre over DLP, you could always use it to justify a trip to DLP!

 

[FettFan]

Truthfully, the original Mexico ride was kinda dubious once you passed by the awesome Blue Bayou-esque scene at the beginning. Was putting a bunch of incredible quality flat-screen TVs playing Donald Duck cartoons a good solution? Not at all.

I wouldn't have minded a face-to-beak encounter with a 25-foot tall animatronic Quetzalcoatl myself....

 

[prfctlyximprct]

Sorry...it just really piqued my curiosity since I was trying to remember how much longer and how much more we had to save to get to Europe. That being said, if it's ever in the budget to do both, I highly recommend it Plus, while I chose a day at the Louvre over DLP, you could always use it to justify a trip to DLP!

Hahaha I one day do want to travel to ALLLLL the Disney parks, but can't justify the flight expense to go to a new country for just Disney..

Europe has not made my travel bucket list.. But maybe one day that will change!

Thanks for your interesting insight

 

[mousehockey37]

Hahaha I one day do want to travel to ALLLLL the Disney parks, but can't justify the flight expense to go to a new country for just Disney..

Europe has not made my travel bucket list.. But maybe one day that will change!

Thanks for your interesting insight

I went over with a music tour while in high school one summer and we ended our tour in Paris. We actually got 1 day, yeah, 1 day in DLP. While I didn't get to immerse myself, I can say that it was awesome. Their parades were completely different, there was a Hercules float, Steamboat Willie Float, and others you'd never see here.

Also, their face characters were different. I actually got to see Merlin the Wizard with kids trying to pull of the Sword in the Sorcerer's Stone. As for a language barrier, there really wasn't one. Most of the DLP CM's speak very good English.

 

[FettFan]

Also, their face characters were different.

And creepy.

 

[Chef Mickey]

Hahaha I one day do want to travel to ALLLLL the Disney parks, but can't justify the flight expense to go to a new country for just Disney..

Europe has not made my travel bucket list.. But maybe one day that will change!

Thanks for your interesting insight

Hopefully you'll get to Tokyo Disney someday, but I can tell you...if you think WDW is crowded, Tokyo Disney is on a different planet. It was a 4.5 hour wait for every ride at DisneySea and I'm not exaggerating.

 

[mousehockey37]

And creepy.

Exactly, lol.

Unlike in the US, the Disney's outside of the US aren't, let's say, "kid friendly"? The over sensitivity of people in the United States leads to the "softer" side of the villains, unlike Capt. Hook here pictured above. They're able to be more devious, and portray their character better because well, this isn't the US anymore. If you have a problem, move along. Sure, the villains at WDW will mess with you, but these villains in DLP are mean looking from the start.

 

[prfctlyximprct]

Hopefully you'll get to Tokyo Disney someday, but I can tell you...if you think WDW is crowded, Tokyo Disney is on a different planet. It was a 4.5 hour wait for every ride at DisneySea and I'm not exaggerating.

Wow!! And I'm guessing there's no "off season?!"

I need to do the rich people personal tour lol.. I'll keep playing the lottery!

 

[rsoxguy]

I must, with all due respect, disagree with the premise of this thread. To claim that people have become less intelligent because Disney is changing the theme and style of their attractions is an invalid point. One would have to conclude that vacations within a theme park are aimed toward intellectual enlightenment in order for such a point of debate to be valid. It would seem instead that people go to WDW for the sake of simple recreation, not education.

This debate might not exist if we considered that IASW has always shown us world cultures through the use of silly dolls and Jungle Cruise has always shown us world travel through silly banter. My point is that WDW has often used intellectual simplicity to entertain, and tourists have always enjoyed it.

In the case of EPCOT, the original format seemingly wasn’t working anymore, hence the changes. Tourists apparently wanted to learn through schools, websites, personal studies, and time dedicated to intellectual pursuits and enrichment. However, they reserved a trip to Disney World for the sake of pure and simple recreation. Disney has responded in like manner.

Do I personally like the changes made to EPCOT? No. I truly prefer the “smarter” EPCOT, but I also enjoy watching Pinky and The Brain cartoons. I’m no better or worse for either one.

 

[copcarguyp71]

This model is fine with me, but it used to not be this way on every attraction, especially at EPCOT.

I agree....I had always hoped that EPCOT was teflon coated and these ideas wouldn't stick...then Nemo happened. Then I thought "surely World Showcase will stay true"...then Frozen happened. Marketing pure and simple so if it makes them money then they shoot for the moon. I like when they do hints of a movie like some of the Ratatouille that is splashed around France but when they go all-in with an overlay smashing it in your face with every turn I get kind of turned off like I am being led around like a child who cannot make up their own mind...but in essence I guess that is what marketing really is.

Let's just hope that they go big with Frozestrom and wow us instead of some half-arsed, budget cut, does not even resemble the original grand plans version that leaves us underwhelmed and let down.