Fire Mountain

[ToTBellHop]

yes, they always say there is "no need" because it has the highest attendance, but that was the same attitude they had toward Disneyland, which is why it got screwed for a decade. Then they invested for the 50th, attendance sky-rocketed and continues to rise. There are over 6 billion people on this planet...there are always more people that WDW could cater to.

 

[Champion]

yes, they always say there is "no need" because it has the highest attendance, but that was the same attitude they had toward Disneyland, which is why it got screwed for a decade. Then they invested for the 50th, attendance sky-rocketed and continues to rise. There are over 6 billion people on this planet...there are always more people that WDW could cater to.

But it has LESS need than the other three parks.

And it is more in need of refurbs of the classics before the money goes to new things.

 

[Enigma]

Let me attempt to clear this one up to the best of my ability...

At the time of its inception, Eisner asked for plans to a new E-Ticket attraction to go into the Magic Kingdom. Two teams of Imagineers were formed, each creating a new "mountain" to go into the same location. One team created what we have come to know as Fire Mountain. This attraction would be based around and inside of a volcano. The story details never really got out beyond the eruption scene, but most of us who have been given the story and concept art can tell you that many aspects of Fire Mountain made their way over into Tokyo DisneySeas' Journey to the Center of the Earth.

Now, I didn't forget the other team, just had to give some background on the main attraction there... The other team created what came to be known as Bald Mountain or Villain Mountain in its later years. Bald Mountain would be a flume ride, just like Splash Mountain but with a more sinister story. The main sequence of the attraction (the equivalent to Fire Mountain's eruption) was where you as the rider floated into the Disney villains' meeting location, alarming them and send you down off the side of Bald Mountain's "waterfall." I never saw any concept renderings though the description featured the chernabog (from Fantasia) lunging at you just before you took the plunge (much like the dinosaur coming out at you at the end of Dinosaur).

Both ideas were meant to go in the Fantasyland area on the 20,00 Leagues plot. Well, Eisner never really decided on a winner between the two ideas due to a massive budgeting problem caused by EuroDisney's recent monetary shortcomings. The ideas were shelved, but many of their aspects have been adapted for use in future Disney attractions.

And may I just add in that neither of these two attractions were ever planned for Animal Kingdom, Beastly Kindgom or such. One of these attractions has been taken off the shelf several times and expanded (conceptually) for further but so far non-tangible use...

There was a part of the story I read that at one point they wanted to build both projects (though naturally at different times) with Fire mountain being built in Adventureland and Bald mountain being built on the 20k plot. Fire Mountain in adventureland was supposed open during a big anniversary year for MK (I think it might have been the 30th.) and they even had some marketing stuff done for it like "WDW's 30th. anniversary ERUPTS with excitment" or something to that effect.

 

[JEANYLASER]

i can't wait to see it.

 

[marni1971]

Where is Martin????

AEfx

He`s here - too engrossed in Construction Crane Monthly in the SSE threads :lol:

Here`s the previous thread with images regarding the Adland expansions http://forums.wdwmagic.com/showthread.php?t=171475

Fire, Bald, Villian - all were generic terms for a series of Mountain E Rides proposed over the past 10-15 years. The descriptions in this thread are what I`ve heard of too. Don`t forget the rumour of a Matterhorn attached to IASW either. Just don`t believe it! As for the others.... Fuji, Matterhorn V2, The Mountain with all the stairs (thanks for the name, Lee!), the half MGM Mountain.... WDI love their hilly landscapes don`t they?
Personally the Atlantis water coaster was my favourite. Imagine a JTA on the 20K plot. Shame SeaWorld Orlando got there first.

 

[Champion]

i can't wait to see it.

Don't hold your breath.

 

[ToTBellHop]

But it has LESS need than the other three parks.

And it is more in need of refurbs of the classics before the money goes to new things.

I don't consider refurbishing rides a reasonable replacement for new attractions, and I realize they are spending a fortune on these changes, but that is only because they went cheap on maintenance for years as they pushed these projects off. It's like if you slack off at work for a week and fall behind, your boss will not be happy the following week if you merely catch up on what you should've done the week before. I accept that Disney has been lazy and they have a Magic Kingdom that is falling apart, and I am happy they are slowly trying to fix it, but that doesn't excuse the behavior or give them an out from doing what they should've done all along. Yes, the other parks "need it more", but over on the West Coast, we have hundreds of millions about to go into DCA and DL has managed to keep its classics up to date while adding attractions, including one that just cost $150,000,000. The only need I see is for Disney to keep its entire brand up to snuff. Guests do not view each park as a separate entity as we do because they don't worry about the fact that each park has different management teams. For all the defense of current practices that goes on around here, I still (STILL!) see burned out lightbulbs on Main Street, USA. Is this not incredibly alarming? They need to stop burning tons of cash on pointless marketing campaigns and make a trip to Home Depot for some Energy Efficient lightbulbs that won't burn out as quickly.

Fire, Bald, Villian - all were generic terms for a series of Mountain E Rides proposed over the past 10-15 years. The descriptions in this thread are what I`ve heard of too. Don`t forget the rumour of a Matterhorn attached to IASW either. Just don`t believe it! As for the others.... Fuji, Matterhorn V2, The Mountain with all the stairs (thanks for the name, Lee!), the half MGM Mountain.... WDI love their hilly landscapes don`t they?
Personally the Atlantis water coaster was my favourite. Imagine a JTA on the 20K plot. Shame SeaWorld Orlando got there first.

The greater shame is that they did this so poorly...and that every successive JTA ride has been crappier than the previous one. The new one at Sea World in Texas is just a joke...I hate to see what Kraken would be by the time it got to Texas...a Kinex coaster?

 

[Mansion Butler]

The ride would be outside the tracks
Not even near the monorail
or the walkway

How would it be outside the tracks yet not near the monorail? I've been back there many, many times. Immediately behind Swiss and along the Jungle Cruise (behind Shrunken Neds) is a large back stage area, mostly used for moving parade floats around. That runs all the way along Mainstreet before it hits the train tracks. Then IMMEDIATELY on the other side of the train tracks is a fence, and there's a small lawn between the fence and the monorail. You could get across it in like. . . five big steps.


Seriously, if it were where everyone says, how could it be outside the tracks?

 

[Lee]

...most of us who have been given the story and concept art can tell you...

Hmmmmm....I don't have any of that, I don't think. Story, yes. Art, no. Please provide.

 

[ToTBellHop]

How would it be outside the tracks yet not near the monorail? I've been back there many, many times. Immediately behind Swiss and along the Jungle Cruise (behind Shrunken Neds) is a large back stage area, mostly used for moving parade floats around. That runs all the way along Mainstreet before it hits the train tracks. Then IMMEDIATELY on the other side of the train tracks is a fence, and there's a small lawn between the fence and the monorail. You could get across it in like. . . five big steps.


Seriously, if it were where everyone says, how could it be outside the tracks?

c'mon...it's the Magic Kingdom.

 

[Lee]

Seriously, if it were where everyone says, how could it be outside the tracks?

Wasn't actually gonna be behind Jungle.
It was going into the open plot behind the PotC building. Way out there. That's where balloon tests were done, way back when.

 

[Mansion Butler]

He`s here - too engrossed in Construction Crane Monthly in the SSE threads :lol:

Here`s the previous thread with images regarding the Adland expansions http://forums.wdwmagic.com/showthread.php?t=171475

That area shown in that thread is MUCH more likely than anything anyone is saying in here. The area stretching from behind Pirates all the way to just next to Thunder Mountain has a relative ton of room. And it certainly has stuff that would need to be moved, but it's also all relatively movable. The buildings are prefab shed-type things, and it's mostly access road. It also would seem to me expanding the utilidor and building on top would be possible. Also, it wouldn't interrupt with the train as much, could be themed so the train could pass through, or it could be outside the tracks. It's by far the mostly likely place in the park I can spot for expansion outside the obvious 20K area. I've walked it a few times and it's all just big, empty room.

The only major consideration is making sure the floats can pass through. But, again, building a higher ride with room to pass under for access seems more than reasonable.



The area behind Shrunken Neds has some room, but not for a whole E-ticket mountain.

 

[Mansion Butler]

Wasn't actually gonna be behind Jungle.
It was going into the open plot behind the PotC building. Way out there. That's were balloon tests were done, way back when.

See, that makes sense. Seems like everyone in here is saying the area behind/between Crystal Palace and Jungle.

Doesn't make sense at all. Even without being a CM, can't folks just kind've look around and envision the way the parks are laid out and see these things? And if you can't, don't state things as fact.



Thank you for reminding me there are some reasonable people here, though. :lol:

 

[Lee]

See, that makes sense. Seems like everyone in here is saying the area behind/between Crystal Palace and Jungle.

There is an expansion pad there...a VERY small one, that I suspect will be the last of the inside-the-tracks pads to ever see use.

 

[jedimaster1227]

I hate to see what Kraken would be by the time it got to Texas...a Kinex coaster?

:lol: :ROFLOL: :lol:

Hmmmmm....I don't have any of that, I don't think. Story, yes. Art, no. Please provide.

I don't own the concept art myself- it was shown to me a few years ago, so I can only tell you what I know and had seen... Sorry.

 

[CarlHS]

I don't consider refurbishing rides a reasonable replacement for new attractions, and I realize they are spending a fortune on these changes, but that is only because they went cheap on maintenance for years as they pushed these projects off. It's like if you slack off at work for a week and fall behind, your boss will not be happy the following week if you merely catch up on what you should've done the week before. I accept that Disney has been lazy and they have a Magic Kingdom that is falling apart, and I am happy they are slowly trying to fix it, but that doesn't excuse the behavior or give them an out from doing what they should've done all along. Yes, the other parks "need it more", but over on the West Coast, we have hundreds of millions about to go into DCA and DL has managed to keep its classics up to date while adding attractions, including one that just cost $150,000,000. The only need I see is for Disney to keep its entire brand up to snuff.

YES! YES! YES! Finally someone gets it!

Just think about the 16 million visitors going back home to friends and saying you have to go on that new Fire Mountain! at MK.

Disneyland blows away MK in content and quantity. It's a good 8 E tickets ahead of MK as it is. The MK is so far behind it's not funny.

Anyone who thinks MK doesn't need anything but TLC has a screw loose. MK is the only park that has a negative number in E Ticket Growth. It's lost (read "gotten screwed out of") 20,000 Leagues and never gotten an E ticket in return.

It's time for all that money being generated in Orlando and being spent in CA, HK and Paris to be turned back toward's Orlando. Let those other parks start paying their own way a bit more like Tokyo does.

 

[CarlHS]

Right on!

 

[scottnj1966]

I have been to disneyland and was very impressed on how the park looked. It sure looked brand new.
I do not agree with you though. WDW does need some help for the MK but to compare this huge resort and everything it offers with just a theme park in California, I am sorry.
I was so disappointed in the monorail, it looked like a toy with midew all inside. The resorts they had was so bad compared to what we have here.

And that small little baby castle. I had no idea how small it was until you actually visited the park.

WDW spends much more money keeping there 4 theme parks, two water parks, downtown disney with pleasure island, disney quest, the countless resorts, waterways, lakes, roads and trails updated.

MK has been doing much to get the place cleaned up again. Another ride would be great and I am sure we will get one, but we have had some great onesbuilt the last few years. Space, Soarin, and Everest

 

[CarlHS]

I was not comparing WDW to DL, I was comparing MK to DL. One park to one park.

I can agree on the castle and monorail references you made, but DL's subs are far better than MKs, as are it's Star Tours, Indiana Jones, Mr Toad, Matterhorn, Space Mountain, Pirates, HM, Fantasmic, the list goes on and on and on....

There are 11 Disney parks and the one setting the records is getting the least attention. It will eventually lose its spot unless it is invested in, perhaps as soon as Harry Potter moves into Orlando.

 

[CarlHS]

MK has been doing much to get the place cleaned up again. Another ride would be great and I am sure we will get one, but we have had some great onesbuilt the last few years. Space, Soarin, and Everest.



None of those new rides (Space, Soarin, and Everest) are in MK. Using rides from other parks to defend the MK's deficit of rides, proves my point.

The new C ticket every 2 years plan for MK, Laugh Floor, Stitch, BL-SRS, while cute and fun just don't fill the E ticket void this park faces. You shut down SM for referb and you're left with 4 or 5. DL shuts down SM and the subs and they still have a dozen or more to carry the load.