EPCOT Figment, well, to be replaced by Figment

[Zak and Wheezie]

You can trust the President of the Tony Baxter Fan Club.


-

Who's the Vice President of the Tony Baxter Fan Club?

 

[GenChi]

If Figment sells ridiculous crap tons of merchandise as is why should they bother "fixing" him?

Because it's an IP without its tentpole evergreen media, and you need to invest in IP to keep those sales going with new audiences.

For something like Stitch the film is made avaliable in endless formats so new audiences can experience it. Haunted Mansion still has the ride that made it a thing. Figment's selling angle is a ride that has not existed for a quarter century and many parkgoers weren't even alive for. The supposed tentpole is a ride that's about to reach its full natural lifespan of 25 years and is unpopular in a way the character isn't. If no investment is made into any IP it's going to falter over time as interest wanes, and you need to get the next generation to have a reason to care about Figment besides being "the cute old Epcot mascot" if you're keeping this (or any) level of sales.

The ride is going to need a revamp in a few years regardless as rides its age do. If they want to take him international they have to introduce him with other media, but if they want to keep the local mania going and continue having 10,000 park items sell out they have to invest in him and Epcot at some point.

 

[FigmentsBrightIdeas]

That actually got me thinking. So, let's just say that some worker at a company wanted to make a Dragon Tales ride (this is assuming this company owns the rights to it). After all, a lot of 20-somethings loved Dragon Tales when they grew up as kids. Surely this'll be a hit, right?

Unfortunately though, they forget to take into account the bigger picture. And that's kids. Very few kids today even know what Dragon Tales is. And you might say, "okay that's true, but they could easily reintroduce these timeless characters to kids through their parents! Maybe we could reboot Dragon Tales and get it popular with the kids again!"

Okay, sure. Sounds good, right? But this company owns Cocomelon too (again, this is just a scenario where both Dragon Tales and Cocomelon were owned by the same company). Well, why waste time trying to take a risk on a Dragon Tales reboot when Cocomelon is already really popular with kids today? What's the point? So, they instead make Cocomelon: The Ride.

This is Disney's POV:

Considering the Dreamfinder and the pre-1998 ride is even older than Dragon Tales at this point, and it's last year open was 26 years ago (Dragon Tales stopped airing 14 1/2 years ago, for comparison), they're even more irrelevant at this point and even more absurd of an idea, at least in Disney's eyes.

Kids born in 2020 sure as hell don't know the Dreamfinder, teenagers born in 2010 don't know the Dreamfinder, and most grown adults born in 2000 won't know the Dreamfinder; if they do, it won't be from experience, as they weren't even alive when the original ride was still operating. Even 30 year olds born in 1994 and 1995 will likely barely even remember the original ride, if at all.

Refurbishing a ride to restore the 1983 version when most people under like 32-35 would have little/no memory of the original ride over just selling merch to kids and opening a Figment meet-and-greet and just keeping the ride as-is really doesn't make sense to Disney's POV.

Figment is still popular as a character. Maybe not as much with the ride, but the kids still seem to love Figment. I've had to wait in surprisingly long lines for Figment over my trips in the last 5 or so years. Why waste money closing the ride, taking like two years to reopen it and add in the Dreamfinder? Maybe it'll make a tiny bit more money, but not enough to justify a whole ride refurbishment.

From my POV, he deserves to reunite with Dreamfinder, but with the current state of Disney theme parks, I just can't see it happening for at least 5-10 years, if ever. We might live in a world where, in the year 2037, Figment has outlived Great Movie Ride, Splash Mountain AND Muppet-Vision 3D. And that just makes me miserable.

TL;DR - making a massive refurbishment to bring back the 1983 ride (this would also include audio and visual enhancements, polishing up the ride) over just keeping the ride as-is really isn't financially viable. It wouldn't make them any money in the grand scheme of things.

All Disney cares about is the money, and if they don't have to rework Figment, they won't.

There’s a key audience they’re missing here (which is where my demographic comes into the picture). I became a HUGE fan years ago through YouTube videos of & about the original attraction and would LOVE to be able to see it in person, the way it was designed to be. I’m also a huge collector and researcher and have been mainly collecting 83-98 era merch & material, and anything new that really captures that original ride & characters for more than a decade now. Fans in my demographic are much higher than you think they might be.. they are big percentage of folks buying the Figment merch and clamoring for the OG ride’s return aswell.

And on the point of Dragon Tales, as you wanted to mention.. in what I wanted to illustrate about Journey Into Imagination..don’t forget.. you don’t even need a rebooted show to showcase why those characters & original show are nostalgic & popular as-is. All us adults are now sharing that w today’s generation of folks. The ‘same exact’ show we remember, not a reboot/remake. The classic one we remember, and it still holds up for both sets of audiences. So in my mind, it’d be much better to invest in something (in this case an attraction as you brought up) that stays true to the original show, retains the original actors, character designs & backgrounds, musical score/composer, etc. but simply utilizes today’s technology.
Seems foolish to me not to take into consideration, something kids ‘and’ parents can enjoy together. It is ‘not’ strictly about the kids and never has been. If the adults aren’t enjoying themselves, there’s a massive problem.
Like I said before, the very same points can be applied to the original Journey Into Imagination and Dreamfinder & Figment. They ‘just’ released a Little Golden Book btw that’s the original ride’s story in storybook form and it’s wonderful for all ages. Walt ‘never’ was in the business of strictly entertaining kids for kids’ sakes. He was in the business of making everyone happy, regardless of age. But it’s the adults spending the money, children don’t have the money.

 

[Zak and Wheezie]

The ride is going to need a revamp in a few years regardless as rides its age do.

The ride needed a revamp 10 years ago.

 

[Agent H]

Well this sucks I have to work both of those days

 

[Zak and Wheezie]

There’s a key audience they’re missing here (which is where my demographic comes into the picture). I’m in my 20s and became a HUGE fan through YouTube videos of & about the original attraction and would LOVE to be able to see it in person, the way it was designed to be. Fans in my demographic are much higher than you think they might be.. they are big percentage of folks buying the Figment merch and clamoring for the OG ride’s return aswell.

I am one of those people, but i'm really not sure if there are really that many 20-somethings that are as big on the original, unfortunately. I could be wrong, though.

And on the point of Dragon Tales, as you wanted to mention.. don’t forget.. you don’t even need a rebooted show to showcase why those characters are popular. The original show is nostalgic & popular as-is. All us adults are not sharing that show w today’s kids. The ‘same exact’ show we remember, not a reboot/remake. The classic one we remember, and it still holds up. So in my mind, it’d be much better to invest in something (in this case an attraction as you brought up) that stays true to the original show, retains the original actors, etc. but simply utilizes today’s technology.

The Dragon Tales thing was more of an analogy than any realistic expectation, just to clarify. They're never bringing that back, mainly because 1) it's not popular with anyone except me, these days, and 2) it's owned by Sony, who really couldn't give a crap about their animated television shows (except the ones based off big movie IPs). A man could dream.

Seems foolish to me not to take into consideration, something kids ‘and’ parents can enjoy together. It is ‘not’ strictly about the kids and never has been. If the adults aren’t enjoying themselves, there’s a massive problem.

This is 100% correct and I feel like this is something many studios seem to not realize. And even Disney doesn't seem to realize, honestly.

These very same points can be applied to the original Journey Into Imagination and Dreamfinder & Figment. They ‘just’ released a Little Golden Book btw that’s the original ride’s story in storybook form and it’s wonderful for all ages. Walt ‘never’ was in the business of strictly entertaining kids for kids’ sakes. He was in the business of making everyone happy, regardless of age. But it’s the adults spending the money, children don’t have the money.

But how many kids are reading these books and things about Dreamfinder and Figment?

The safest option is to greenlight the movie (which was in the works allegedly), and hope it does well, after which the 1983 ride could have a possible return in the vein of the Tiki Room.

 

[GenChi]

The ride needed a revamp 10 years ago.

It needed a revamp 23 years ago lol

 

[Zak and Wheezie]

It needed a revamp 23 years ago lol

I could forgive the third version as it was presumably a temporary solution to the awful 1999 version that they made!!!! that was apparently supposed to be "rectified" by Project Gemini. I'm not sure of the specifics (I learned this from the Yesterworld video on Figment's downfall).

Unpopular opinion: I like the 2002 Eric Idle version. It is nowhere near the level of the 1983 ride, but I like it. Figment reminds me of Wheezie from Dragon Tales. To the point where I took a Zak and Wheezie plushie on the ride.

With that said, it needs to be reworked. Assuming you get the right people to do it.

 

[FigmentsBrightIdeas]

But how many kids are reading these books and things about Dreamfinder and Figment?

The safest option is to greenlight the movie (which was in the works allegedly), and hope it does well, after which the 1983 ride could have a possible return in the vein of the Tiki Room.

More than you may think.. it sold tons and tons of copies and is still being sold everywhere Little Golden Books are sold, and it’s thanks to folks like me aswell as folks who grew up w that ride & characters that want to share it with their own kids aswell as anyone else who may not have known or been introduced to the characters/ride the same way/time.

To your last point, to the execs maybe.. but truthfully. I think the safest bet is the ride. They don’t have to worry about “not getting things right” cause everything is planned out right in front of them and is already well-received/beloved. They have all the materials, research & development artwork & photos, documents, audio/video elements, etc. and the same molds for the animatronics are used for today’s version).. there’s also more left of the original track & building than we give credit for. It’s more possible than you think.. the execs need to just give the greenlight already. And WDI needs to consult &/or work with those that are still around that worked on that OG attraction to really make sure they’re getting things right, if they’re really not familar w or genuinely love the source material already.

In regards to a movie though.. they ‘really really’ need to get it right. Traditionally animated/Paperman style animation and/or a OG Pete’s Dragon/Roger Rabbit traditional animation/live action hybrid style movie . Something that feels like the classics & like the original ride. It was timeless. Nothing that “modernizes them for today’s audience”. Just keep them looking, sounding, and acting as they were, and you’ll be fine. Keep it sincere, heartfelt, and charming (and funny moreso in a clever & witty way, the way the animated classics were written, not a self deprecating or crude/ making modern day pop culture references way), be true to the message & spirit of the original ride, and the rest’ll work from there.

 

[FigmentsBrightIdeas]

And in regards to getting Dreamfinder’s & Figment’s characters right. Dreamfinder’s the kind-hearted all knowing eccentric Santa-esque wizard like inventor sage basically. Who again, is a helpful guide and companion to Figment. The loving father figure basically. And Figment is the naive, curious, and innocent child figure that wants to learn & discover his creative abilities & everything around him in the way that Disney’s Pooh characters are written. Almost think the Gepetto & Pinocchio father & son relationship and maybe a bit of Merlin & Wart/Arthur from Sword in the Stone. A basic watch of the original Journey Into Imagination ride lays everything out perfectly. This is so simple to get right by someone who genuinely cares. I just really hope whomever decides to write or direct new content w these characters, whether it be a film or animated series, really loves & understands them & the original attraction enough to make sure it’s done justice.

 

[brb1006]

View attachment 840603
Picture of a Figment/Dreamfinder fan in depression after having waited 33 years for a new ride, 2035 colorized

I find it hilariously ironic that Dragon Tales premiered the year after the original JII was closed (and a month before the 1999 Figment-less version opened).

Therefore, Emmy, Max, Cassie, Ord, Zak and Wheezie never got to ride the pre-1998 Figment. However, The Magic School Bus and Arthur, the other two 90s PBS cartoons, premiered in 1994 and 1996, meaning that Ms. Frizzle (+ her students), Arthur and his friends could all have ridden the original Journey Into Imagination.
View attachment 840610

When did this site suddenly get invaded by old school fans of PBS Kids? Has Iger messed up so badly that WDWMagic is slowly transforming into PBS Kids?

 

[FigmentsBrightIdeas]

When did this site get suddenly invaded by old school fans of PBS Kids?

You’d be surprised at how many fans of animation, regardless of where it comes from, have interests that cross over. Is it really that hard to believe, someone that loves a show surrounding whimsical, colorful dragons w childlike personalities wouldn’t like characters like Figment & Dreamfinder? I wouldn’t be so tough on him. He’s just relating things he’s familiar with/is showcasing who ‘he’ is so you can understand his personal perspective & experience. No biggie. I understand where he’s coming from. As long as he stays mainly on topic and iterates how his perspective relates to this ride and these characters specifically (which he has) I don’t see a big issue. (My personal opinion)

 

[brb1006]

Therefore, Emmy, Max, Cassie, Ord, Zak and Wheezie never got to ride the pre-1998 Figment. However, The Magic School Bus and Arthur, the other two 90s PBS cartoons, premiered in 1994 and 1996, meaning that Ms. Frizzle (+ her students), Arthur and his friends could all have ridden the original Journey Into Imagination.
View attachment 840610

His name is spelled "Org" not "Ord".

 

[FigmentsBrightIdeas]

His name is spelled "Org" not "Ord".

Hate to be the guy to do this, but Actually, that’s incorrect.. It was ‘always’ Ord. lol : https://dragontales.fandom.com/wiki/Ord

 

[brb1006]

Hate to be the guy to do this, but Actually, that’s incorrect.. It was ‘always’ Ord. lol : https://dragontales.fandom.com/wiki/Ord

Wait that's how his name is spelled!?

I swear it was spelled with a "G" which I believed for 25 years!

 

[FigmentsBrightIdeas]

Has Iger messed up so badly that WDWMagic is slowly transforming into PBS Kids?

i mean… if you wanna go that far. Yes. Have you ridden Tiana’s Bayou Adventure, Frozen Ever After, etc. and seen how badly those scripts are written? They’re written exactly like the PBS kids scripts we see nowadays. And don’t even get me started on what the Clubhouse show has done to Mickey & Friends’ characters and reputations since ‘06. To Zak and Wheezie’s credit, Dragon Tales was written w much more depth, care & sincerity, the way we remember much of the Disney shows growing up than we might give it credit for. Think Book of Pooh and Bear in the Big Blue House. ‘Everyone’ loved those.
Or something like New Adventures of Winnie the Pooh & Chip n Dale Rescue Rangers. Those storylines had lessons and morals without being exactly preachy about it per se. They were executed sincerely, entertaining without breaking any pace, character development or action, and were appealing to all ages. They didn’t talk down to the audience, they treated the character interactions & audience w respect to their intelligence.

 

[FigmentsBrightIdeas]

i mean… if you wanna go that far. Yes. Have you ridden Tiana’s Bayou Adventure, Frozen Ever After, etc. and seen how badly those scripts are written? They’re written exactly like the PBS kids scripts we see nowadays. And don’t even get me started on what the Clubhouse show has done to Mickey & Friends’ characters and reputations since ‘06. To Zak and Wheezie’s credit, Dragon Tales was written w much more depth, care & sincerity, the way we remember much of the Disney shows growing up than we might give it credit for. Think Book of Pooh and Bear in the Big Blue House. ‘Everyone’ loved those.
Or something like New Adventures of Winnie the Pooh & Chip n Dale Rescue Rangers. Those storylines had lessons and morals without being exactly preachy about it per se. They were executed sincerely, entertaining without breaking any pace, character development or action, and were appealing to all ages. They didn’t talk down to the audience, they treated the audience respectfully.

And in regards to how that all relates to Figment, Dreamfinder, and Journey Into Imagination. It has to do with making sure. ‘If’ there ‘is’ anything more ‘new’ done with these characters, after or as the ride is being restored, it needs to be done right. With genuine sincerity without feeling like it’s being dumbed down to strictly a children’s audience. Audiences of all ages got & loved the original ride, characters, and concept of creativity/imagination as-is perfectly fine. There’s no need to write them any differently or feel like they can’t positively impact people the same way they have for decades. It’s what makes all the classic Disney films, cartoons, shows, and attractions hold up to this day. And why things like, say, Barney & Friends or Mickey Mouse Clubhouse for instance, do ‘not’ in comparison (and never have made the same impact on all age groups, as a result of that)

 

[Zak and Wheezie]

And in regards to how that all relates to Figment, Dreamfinder, and Journey Into Imagination. It has to do with making sure. ‘If’ there ‘is’ anything more ‘new’ done with these characters, after or as the ride is being restored, it needs to be done right. With genuine sincerity without feeling like it’s being dumbed down to strictly a children’s audience. Audiences of all ages got & loved the original ride, characters, and concept of creativity/imagination as-is perfectly fine. There’s no need to write them any differently or feel like they can’t positively impact people the same way they have for decades. It’s what makes all the classic Disney films, cartoons, shows, and attractions hold up to this day. And why things like, say, Barney & Friends or Mickey Mouse Clubhouse for instance, do ‘not’ in comparison (and never have made the same impact on all age groups, as a result of that)

Barney does have a rather sizable adult fanbase, but it's really not appealing to me.

Going back to Figment, I can safely say that the 2002 ride is 100% a "just for kids" ride. It doesn't have the same age-wide appeal that the original does.

Figment is far more mischievous in the current iteration than in the 1983 ride, in a way where it's hard for adults (except me) to really like him here. He comes across as sort of a nuisance to Eric Idle Dr. Nigel Channing who is just trying to bore the kids while Figment does wacky stuff that the kids enjoy.

 

[FigmentsBrightIdeas]

I can safely say that the 2002 ride is 100% a "just for kids" ride (although Barney does have a fanbase, it's really not appealing to me)

Same, & Bingo, that’s another HUGE reason it doesn’t make the same impact/have the long lasting appeal as the original 1983-98 version of the ride.

 

[Zak and Wheezie]

Same, & Bingo, and that’s another HUGE reason it doesn’t make the same impact/have the long lasting appeal as the original 1983-98 version of the ride.

The "Skunk Figment" part makes it automatically a kids ride to me. "Haha farts are funny" logic to it. That scene is cringey