FastPass+ Most Certainly Not Coming Back As It Was

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bgraham34

Well-Known Member
In order for this "theory" of yours to work out then far more people are going to need to be on board with you AND you are going to have to educate all of the people that are planning on a first Disney trip and get them to cancel that trip. Until then, Disney could care less if you, me, anyone goes elsewhere. ;)
Oh i know this without a doubt. There is also a difference from people who have been going to Disney f0 15 plus years and those who are 5 or less. The veterans understand what we once had and they newer people don't care as much.

With Disney as a company i would be more concerned about losing the long term customer as opposed to the new customer. Those who are hooked have been coming year after year. But the new customer will drop Disney when the nice new shiny thing comes along.

I understand the new customer spends more than the older customer but!
 

Weather_Lady

Well-Known Member
Huge perk of staying at the Poly, is not having to use a bus for half the parks. And MK is only a short relaxing boat ride away.
That will be the case once the Epcot monorail starts up again, but at the moment, no date has even been announced and Polynesian guests only have monorail service to one park (and only from the TTC).

Also, FWIW, the walking path from the Polynesian around the lake is presently closed for paver removal. EDIT: Oops! I see that was already mentioned above.

Stay tuned for more Doom and Gloom at 6:00.
 

G00fyDad

Well-Known Member
Oh i know this without a doubt. There is also a difference from people who have been going to Disney f0 15 plus years and those who are 5 or less. The veterans understand what we once had and they newer people don't care as much.

With Disney as a company i would be more concerned about losing the long term customer as opposed to the new customer. Those who are hooked have been coming year after year. But the new customer will drop Disney when the nice new shiny thing comes along.

I understand the new customer spends more than the older customer but!

And I understand what you are saying. I am pretty nostalgic and I would LOVE for Disney to bring back some of the old stuff and keep adding new stuff without raising the price tag too much. Unfortunately they are going to keep offering less and charging more. As I have told others if it were not for the Star Wars stuff I would not be going back again since Disney does not seem to care about guest satisfaction anymore. This will be our last trip but I am sure that is not going to even cause a blip on their screens.
 

KCheatle

Well-Known Member
Again, I'm not forcing anyone to spend their money how I wish.

However, I absolutely have the right to guilt people on how their spending impacts everyone else, because that's how the market works. I'm a consumer too, and I'm fortunate enough to easily afford multiple WDW and other trips per year, but it's my opinion that continuing to pay more for less is irresponsible, regardless of your means.

Here's the secret that no one is either picking up on or willing to admit though...you're not only screwing others over, but you're screwing yourself/your family over too. You're making a good/service more (appear more) luxurious/exclusive while getting way less value for that good/service. That's the opposite of how the free market is supposed to work. There are so many other options/competitors out there, we should be forcing Disney to offer MORE for LESS, not the other way around.

So, yes, but continuing to pay the fee, it can be argued that you're harming the product for no net benefit to yourself (you're getting less, it's not more exclusive, "free" items are now an extra purchase, etc.) and certainly not to others.

I don't have to "respect" that, because that's the antithesis to the consumers controlling the market. I'm not calling on the government to lock anyone up. I'm not going to harass or assault anyone for going to WDW. I will voice my concern though, because no one is just owed "respect" or "acceptance". You have the right to spend your money however you want, this is correct, but once/when it negatively impacts me/mine, I will absolutely voice my concern, especially when the stance is "Hey, you guys know if you just didn't pay this now that X, Y, Z aren't free, they might bring them back for free after a few quarterly reports."

But, that would mean a lot of people having to make short-term sacrifices, which is why @Sirwalterraleigh isn't far off in calling it an "addiction". Only addicts pay more for less to get their fix.

At the end of the day, it's not your problem to care about anyone else's feelings or issues. However, as I said above, you're still screwing yourself over.
I'm not disputing what rights you have or don't have. I stipulate you have the "right" to have an opinion on people for how they spend their own money. However, I maintain that you are in the wrong for doing so if you don't have all of the facts, and particularly where you were not part of the process of earning the money spent.

As a free market, Disney can put a product out and people can buy it or not buy it. In a healthy free market economy, the decision to spend or not spend is left to each individual, and businesses see results from their experiments. This happens daily and in every type of industry. Look at Apple, look at Target, look at ANY for profit business, and their sole goal is to please their shareholders by increasing revenue, increasing operating margin, and increasing capital efficiency. That is exactly what Disney is going for, and that is the foundation of a free market. The fact that it makes you mad because you will have to spend more to get a product you want is unfortunate for you, but I don't think people should have to give one moment of thought to whether their personal spending at a completely optional recreational park negatively affects the other people who are choosing to spend their money at the recreational park. The idea that I should feel pity on a fellow-Disney park goer is ludicrous.
 

monothingie

I'm both Crunchy and Delicious!
Premium Member
No, although it’s not clear why it’s closed.
Truck with a drill rig on it.
Disneys-Polynesian-Resort_Full_42370.jpg

My best guess is that the grease tanks from the Spirit of Aloha Show kitchens have reached criticality from lack of use and emergency relieve bores need to be installed to prevent an angry Tiki eruption.
 

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
Speculation on this topic is not fact. If it does affect offsite, it won't be offset anymore then it has always been. People either take advantage of early admittance or the don't. Not everyone is obsessed with rope drop. Surprisingly, many people take a vacation to relax. Who'da thunk it! The bulk of the crowd starts to arrive at around 10 am and no one has a singular direction to go. They like what they like. Until we know what they are going to use as the next incarnation of Fastpass, we will have no idea how any of this will impact anyone onsite or offsite.
 

DisneyNittany

Well-Known Member
I'm not disputing what rights you have or don't have. I stipulate you have the "right" to have an opinion on people for how they spend their own money. However, I maintain that you are in the wrong for doing so if you don't have all of the facts, and particularly where you were not part of the process of earning the money spent.

As a free market, Disney can put a product out and people can buy it or not buy it. In a healthy free market economy, the decision to spend or not spend is left to each individual, and businesses see results from their experiments. This happens daily and in every type of industry. Look at Apple, look at Target, look at ANY for profit business, and their sole goal is to please their shareholders by increasing revenue, increasing operating margin, and increasing capital efficiency. That is exactly what Disney is going for, and that is the foundation of a free market. The fact that it makes you mad because you will have to spend more to get a product you want is unfortunate for you, but I don't think people should have to give one moment of thought to whether their personal spending at a completely optional recreational park negatively affects the other people who are choosing to spend their money at the recreational park. The idea that I should feel pity on a fellow-Disney park goer is ludicrous.

Nowhere did I ask for pity. You're still not understanding the point. I'm simply pointing out that by choosing to spend more while being provided less, you're hurting yourself and your perceived value as well.

It doesn't make me "mad" that I now have to spend more money on a certain product. That's life. It does upset me that I will now have to pay more for less, not because the product did anything to warrant an increase (even factoring in inflation), but because of the purchasing attitude among the fandom.

There will be a point, maybe not now, maybe not for ten years, but the day will come when you say "Why am I paying for ABCDEF and XYZ when all of that use to be included?". Then, you'll have no one but yourself to blame, because you willingly allowed it to happen.

And this isn't a finger pointing activity. We are ALL guilty of it here! Me just as much as anyone.

At the end of the day, this doesn't matter. Nothing I'm saying matters. However, the point of this whole argument is that the original post of "doing Disney differently is bad" was not wrong (in the intended context), because it's a net negative for EVERY consumer. Whether you can afford or whether you go into crippling debt, I don't care. But, the fact remains rewarding a business for providing less by giving them more, benefits no one but the business/stockholders.

This isn't to say you should feel shame or guilt in going to WDW. This isn't to say that I won't go myself when I have the opportunity to take my daughter.

What I believe though (or at least what I took) was that people like us (repeat customers throughout the years) SHOULD know better the value WDW than anyone else. You're not going to get the one-time families from visiting WDW, since it's a right of passage here in America. However, the loyal repeats could and should stand up and say "enough is enough", and then put the ball in Disney's court to see how much they actually need us. If the answer is "they don't", then yeah we don't have leverage, and we'll just have to accept that's how things are. Yet, because we all need our taste (notice how I'm including myself there), we won't and the wheel will just keep spinning.
 

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
Truck with a drill rig on it.
Disneys-Polynesian-Resort_Full_42370.jpg

My best guess is that the grease tanks from the Spirit of Aloha Show kitchens have reached criticality from lack of use and emergency relieve bores need to be installed to prevent an angry Tiki eruption.
According to the never flawless internet, one of PSI's functions is to determine if water, such as in a lagoon, is leaking out of it's confines by taking bore samples to determine the amount of water on the land along the larger body of water. That may be what they are doing or installing safety barriers to keep critters from infringing on the pathway if that is one. That is another thing that they do is work to maintain safety. I'm not sure where it is located.
 

Chi84

Premium Member
Nowhere did I ask for pity. You're still not understanding the point. I'm simply pointing out that by choosing to spend more while being provided less, you're hurting yourself and your perceived value as well.

It doesn't make me "mad" that I now have to spend more money on a certain product. That's life. It does upset me that I will now have to pay more for less, not because the product did anything to warrant an increase (even factoring in inflation), but because of the purchasing attitude among the fandom.

There will be a point, maybe not now, maybe not for ten years, but the day will come when you say "Why am I paying for ABCDEF and XYZ when all of that use to be included?". Then, you'll have no one but yourself to blame, because you willingly allowed it to happen.

And this isn't a finger pointing activity. We are ALL guilty of it here! Me just as much as anyone.

At the end of the day, this doesn't matter. Nothing I'm saying matters. However, the point of this whole argument is that the original post of "doing Disney differently is bad" was not wrong (in the intended context), because it's a net negative for EVERY consumer. Whether you can afford or whether you go into crippling debt, I don't care. But, the fact remains rewarding a business for providing less by giving them more, benefits no one but the business/stockholders.

This isn't to say you should feel shame or guilt in going to WDW. This isn't to say that I won't go myself when I have the opportunity to take my daughter.

What I believe though (or at least what I took) was that people like us (repeat customers throughout the years) SHOULD know better the value WDW than anyone else. You're not going to get the one-time families from visiting WDW, since it's a right of passage here in America. However, the loyal repeats could and should stand up and say "enough is enough", and then put the ball in Disney's court to see how much they actually need us. If the answer is "they don't", then yeah we don't have leverage, and we'll just have to accept that's how things are. Yet, because we all need our taste (notice how I'm including myself there), we won't and the wheel will just keep spinning.
I don’t understand your point either. You seem to be telling people not to go to WDW because they’re screwing over themselves and others. SirWalter “loves” this idea, but you sure aren’t keeping him away from WDW. Then you say you’ll go to WDW when you have the opportunity to take your daughter. So who is supposed to follow this economic boycott you’re proposing? It’s not going to be me, because I still find plenty of value in the product. I thought that’s how a free market works.
 

DisneyNittany

Well-Known Member
I don’t understand your point either. You seem to be telling people not to go to WDW because they’re screwing over themselves and others. SirWalter “loves” this idea, but you sure aren’t keeping him away from WDW. Then you say you’ll go to WDW when you have the opportunity to take your daughter. So who is supposed to follow this economic boycott you’re proposing? It’s not going to be me, because I still find plenty of value in the product. I thought that’s how a free market works.

No, the point was that regular visitors who complain about the Disney changes and price increases are the reason for those things.

That's great that you still find value in the product. I'm not arguing whether there is value in the product or not. I was simply stating that there is much LESS value in the product, based off of what you are charged and what you're provided.

Literally, this whole discussion was sparked off by people complaining about a potential pay-for FP+ and then later on talking about how they'd still pay it. I jumped in somewhere in the middle, but in the context of the discussion my point remains. Regular guests only have themselves to blame for the continued lower offerings at a higher price point.
 

disneyfreak0710

Active Member
The true business/financial reality is that if Disney's changes to their offerings are negatively impacting the overall experience, people will naturally stop spending as much or visiting as often. It doesn't need to be this concerted effort among our niché community here. They are quite religiously tracking their satisfaction and revenue numbers. As soon as they are anything but up (down or even flat), they make changes in the direction we seek.

These things will happen naturally as millions of people visit these theme parks every year. There's no need to torture yourself and not go to Disney. We make up a tiny, tiny fraction of the guests who visit and spend money at Disney.

Or on the flip side, the changes we seek won't happen in which case our opinion on their modifications to offerings are simply not as impactful to the experience (in the view of the vast majority of guests) as we believed.

They want to make money, giving people a sub par experience doesn't help them there. That will always be on our side. But if something makes them money that we don't like, we're simply out of luck.

Except this is not true. Go to any Disney board and watch the amount of people who complain about Disney out of one side of their mouth, all while continuing to throw money at them. Talk to people in the real world who have miserable trips. And yet, Disney does what Disney does. Why? Because the die hards will go no matter what, and those that stop going do just that - they stop going without telling Disney why... and then 3 more people take their place.
 

disneyfreak0710

Active Member
Huge perk of staying at the Poly, is not having to use a bus for half the parks. And MK is only a short relaxing boat ride away.

To each their own. I'd still rather have my own vehicle for the other half of the parks not services by the monorail or boat, and I would never spend that amount of money for transportation.
 
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